By - boomership
It was scheduled to be temporarily removed because of a street construction. But it’s probably going to be permanent now because of Putin’s war.
Fun fact: ironically, the statue is named ’Maailmanrauhaa’ (=world peace) but some activists painted a tag on it re-naming it ’Maailmanräyhää’ (=world mayhem). Officials decided not to clean the tag paint away, apparently even they saw it as a more fitting name for the statue.
Diacritics aside, the fact that in Finnish the words "peace" and "mayhem" are only 1 letter away is quite funny.
In Finnish, a and ä should be viewed rather as separate letters, they just use diacritics because of the use of the Latin alphabet.
Same in German.
Well, technically 4 letters, since you need to change three a's to ä's and add an y.
That being said, Finnish is an interesting language in many regards. For some words that are actually 1 letter away from each other:
Veri (blood) and vesi (water). Apparently as a toddler I mixed these a lot, wanting to drink blood and crying that I scraped my knee, causing water to come out of it.
Tuli (fire) and tuuli (wind). Can imagine this one can get confusing for someone learning the language.
For weird case where the same word can mean multiple things, vuori can mean both mountain and backing of a shirt or furniture.
There are also many names that can have multiple meanings or are part of sayings. For example there is a joke about how you can (depending on the variation of the joke) fit 15 people in a 5 person car: all of them have "Matti in their ~~pocket~~ wallet" (are broke) and have Yrjö (vomit) on their lap.
Speaking of Yrjö, it is commonly used to replace the name George, so where others have Saint George we have Saint Vomit.
>Veri (blood) and vesi (water).
>Tuli (fire) and tuuli (wind).
Vér, víz, tűz and szél in Hungarian.
Veri, vesi, tuli, and tuul in Estonian!
Blood, water, fire and wind in English
Thanks (thanks in English).
In Latin, apparently.
krov, voda, ogon and vetyr in misc slav languages
Since Latin’s here:
Spanish: sangre, agua, llama*, viento
French: sang, eau, flamme*, vent
*Or fuego, feu (from _focus_ ‘hearth’)
This made me laugh much more than it should have.
Fuckin' magnets, how do they work?
Now do “live, laugh, love”
Elä, naura, rakasta (in Finnish)
Don't forget Tulli (Customs)
I still think my favourite is "kuusi" which is both number six and a spruce.
"Kusi" is piss
Double vowels tend to a big challenge for Finnish learners, and this is why you shouldn't just ignore the difference no matter how insignificant it may seem. Same with "tapaan sinut" (I will meet you) and "tapan sinut" (I will kill you)
This comment entertained me.
>Tuli (fire) and tuuli (wind). Can imagine this one can get confusing for someone learning the language.
Was confusing for me when there was a fire (tuli) at the customs office (Tulli) on a windy day (tuuli) when I arrived (tulin).
So in Finnish, Earth Wind and Fire is called “[Something] Tuuli and Tuli?”
They'd be "Maa, Tuuli ja Tuli", yes.
Miyamoto Mushashi's "The Book of Five Rings" is called *Maa, vesi, tuli, tuuli ja tyhjyys* in Finnish, along similar lines.
Isn't Matti in the wallet? "Matti kukkarossa."
You are indeed correct. Brainfart on my part.
English is a bad example for this though since it is an analytic language that has a low average letter count per word and thus needs to use basically all the "address space" in words that is pronouncible.
As well as being a degenerate mongrel of a language
>Tuli (fire) and tuuli (wind). Can imagine this one can get confusing for someone learning the language.
Having my mothertongue as Swedish causes me to mispronounce this one so often.... Ordered a windy pizza recently at ABC -\_-
Reminds me of drunkenly trying to order whiskey-cola at a bar, but repeatedly saying vichy-cola instead until the bartender asked if I seriously wanted non-alcoholic, watered down coke.
The Estonian orthography completes the a/ä, o/ö symmetry by using ü for the sound that Finnish writes as y. I don't see why Finnish couldn't adopt that.
Because estonian has a pronunciation difference between ü and y. Finnish wouldn't and it would make no sense to ditch one letter in favour of another that is also less common throughout the world
Veri, Vesi, Tuli, Tuul, in Estonian
Today I learned….many thanks 😊 🙏🏼
Where as english just reuses the same word instead of changing how to spell it.
> in Finnish the words "peace" and "mayhem" are only 1 letter away
like laughter and slaughter.
This is an underrated response.
That"s a 4 letters difference though, no?
4 letters in Finnish is barely a syllable
True that. You you 4 letter words only in Kindergarten, in school you start with 20 letter words and later move to 40 letter words.
In University people usually you 80 letter word until Bachelor, Magisters use 160 letter words and Doctors use 320 letter words.
I fucking knew it when I red your comment you play poe
Yes, but it happens to be not just any 4 letters. Finnish has a property called vowel harmony, where the three back vowels "a, o, u" and the three front vowels "ä, ö, y" are basically never shared in a single word. Going from "rauhaa" to "räyhää" is basically just transforming all the back vowels to their front counterparts, which makes it a rather natural transformation for the word.
Yes, that'''s right.
One letter and 6 dots, then.
a and ä are considered to be two separate letters. It's not just "a with dots".
My visa card and various travel tickets would like a word with you
Yeah , English first systems really fuck up things for a lot of people with regards to their names.
At least they don't replace ä with ae anymore usually...
Just like an R is just a P with a line in it
Alphabets are more complicated than that and very arbitrary. a and ä are completely different sounds in finnish. They use ä because it's easier to find fonts and keyboards that include it, not because it's related to a. It could be any symbol.
In many languages diacritics are not just additions but are considered part of the letter giving it a completely unique identity.
Imagine someone saying that J is just an I with a hook, or Q is just an O with a tail attached.
>J is just an I with a hook
That actually used to be the case, J is a relatively recent letter.
> Imagine someone saying that J is just an I with a hook, or Q is just an O with a tail attached.
That's literally what it is. As a Swede all the english words with dots on a and o to make it "ikea" is super weird and just shows that whoever made it doesn't have any clue.
Häagen-Dazs anyone? I have genuinely no idea how it's supposed to be pronounced, but in my head it sounds extremely stupid.
And yes, it's an entirely made up name that has no basis in any language -- the guy that came up with the name is Polish.
Presumably it's supposed to be faux Danish.
They may or may not have a clue, probably not, but it’s a joke about what their impression of Swedish is. They’re not pretending it’s real Swedish or that Swedish doesn’t have the letters a and o too, just being comical. Same with inverting random letters to make a word look ‘Cyrillic’
They have a clue, they just don't care.
They have decided the branding identity is worth more than what they lose by irritating those who actually speak that language.
> They have decided the branding identity is worth more.......
He is not talking about Ikea, all Ikeas names make sense in Swedish.
Exactly, it is those *hilarious* fake manuals that random people make.
Like this: https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/ikea-kanya-west-yeezy-funny-fake-products-fb__700-png.jpg
The å in that is pronounced like the ou in thought, making it more like kard**ou**sh than a bad reference to his wifes name.
Oh thanks. Now the letter Q looks like if the letter O was a furry. I CANT UNSEE IT.
The controversial World Peace statue was moved from Hakaniemenranta on Monday morning.
The City of Moscow donated the statue to Helsinki in 1989. It was unveiled to the public in 1990. Even then, the statue was the subject of much debate.
The statue is owned by the Helsinki Art Museum (HAM) and will be transported to a warehouse designated by the museum in the eastern part of Uusimaa.
The City of Helsinki and HAM will decide on the final fate of the statue at a later date.
Following Russia's invasion of Ukraine, public debate has heated up over the need for the statue.
Since the statue was revealed to the public in 1990, it has attracted controversy.
The statue was severely damaged when three students poured tar and feathers on it in 1991. Calling themselves "Höyhenryhmä" ("The Feather Group"), the trio wanted to make a statement that the Soviet gift did not belong in Helsinki.
The group included Mikael Jungner, a law student who later became the managing director of the Finnish Broadcasting Corporation Yle and an MP.
In 2010, there was an unsuccessful attempt to blow up the statue with a gas cylinder.
Actually in Russian the world "peace" and "world" is the same. So when Putins and his cronies talk about "Russian Peace" he often refers to "Russian World"
Sorry to ruin the joke, but there is no such concept as „Russian piece“. Whenever these words come together it is always „Russian world“ in the meaning of „part of the world where Russians live“.
Can't get any more metal than that. Who doesn't love Finland?
Wait until you hear what the English did with "cleave".
It's both "to be attached" to something and "to be detached" from something.
I know it's not exactly in the same category but I always thought that "flammable" and "inflammable" meaning the same thing was hella weird.
Personally I’ve never heard “cleave” used in the first way, I’ve always heard it when someone means “to detach something”
First Google search comes up with:
"Rose's mouth was dry, her tongue cleaving to the roof of her mouth"
As the first way. Also, Google is a bit saucy these days
I don’t doubt that it’s an official way to say it, I’ve just never heard it used that way before now.
Google only gets saucy when it realizes your search history, writing down every kink you have
The punctuation changes how the word sounds dramatically.
Yeah I know, my first language uses plenty of diacritics too. I just thought it was interesting how close those 2 seemingly opposite words seem to be.
Also that the word starts with Mailman
Fun fact, the word 'maailma' (world) in Finnish is a compound word, maa (earth) and ilma (air). So in Finnish the world is literally 'earth air'.
>Diacritics aside, the fact that in Finnish the words "peace" and "mayhem" are only 1 letter away is quite funny.
Ha. "Dust" and "dust" are 0 letters away in English, but mean the exact opposite things.
I took me a few seconds to realize what you meant. I guess you're talking about the verb and the noun? As in the noun "dust" indicates the presence of, well, dust, while the verb "dust" indicates the action of removing it. Hadn't really thought about it, pretty interesting indeed.
You can *dust* your bread with flour (add dust), and *dust* the counters (remove dust).
Some locals called this statue as ”katiskavarkaat”. It is ”the fish trap thieves” in English.
The statue has a long history of vandalism and vandalism attempts. If I recall correctly, someone tried to blow it up over a decade ago.
It's literally mentioned in the article.
>In 2010, there was an unsuccessful attempt to blow up the statue with a gas cylinder.
You think I can read?
I hope it's maintained for a time when it is appropriate to reinstall it.
It'll sit in storage, but I at least won't miss it. It's not a great statue and was never really liked either. Rather have something nicer there
And at the same time Tehtaankatu is housing all kinds of nasty FSB agents. Like living people, not statues. We should have removed the Russian Embassy instead.
Mailman Mayhem? I think I played that game back in the day.
Crazy Taxi DLC.
Sequel to Paperboy
Helsinki decided already years ago that World Peace would be removed in 2022.
...It was supposed to be temporary, but I guess it will stay in a warehouse.
Out of context this is such a droll yet alarming statement.
Ten years from now a headline will read, "World peace lost. UN Chief says he could have swore he put it here. US President Marjorie Taylor Musk says, "It was probably stolen by those liberal underwear gnomes!"
>US President Marjorie Taylor Musk
I hate this. I hate this a lot.
That's okay. She'll be around 60 by that time, no way Musk will marry someone that old.
Ivanka Musk then?
"Helsinki topples world peace"
Helsinki: peace was never an option 🔫
Does seem a bit ironic
Both in the fact that the statue was donated by a completely different country that doesn't even exist any more and that Finland sided with the Nazis in WWII.
The things you chose to ommit are revealing. Here's a quick history of Finland and the Soviet Union:
Finland gained independence by slipping out the door when Lenin was too busy fighting a civil war. The newly founded Soviet Union then promptly sponsored a civil war for us as well, supporting the communist red guards. They were even kind enough to set up a new government for us. Unfortunately for them, the communists ended up losing, in part due to military training from (the then non-nazi) Germany. Lots of executions and terror against the losing side promptly followed. Finland became a republic and would have been perfectly happy to not fight any more wars. Unfortunately that didn't happen.
WWII in Europe started when the Soviet Union sided with Nazi Germany, made a pact to divide Europe up and then jointly invaded Poland. The Soviet Union then tried to conquer Finland, failed partly due to some ridiculous incompetency, but managed to take some land. We call this the "Winter War". Throughout the ordeal the USSR denied any sort of aid to Finland by the Allies and was requestion permission from the Germans to annex Finland all the way up to the "Continuation War" where Finland retook the occupied territory, pushed deeper into Soviet territory and set up defenses. With help from Nazi Germany, the only ally it could have in the world. It didn't work and Finland wound up losing even more territory and much of our political independency.
After the war Finland was forced into a mutual defence agreement and politically controlled and threatened by the Soviet Union pretty much until it's collapse. This became known as "Finlandization" or "doing as you're told so as not to get invaded again". During this time we were "gifted" this statue that celebrated "world peace". Having read this far I'm sure you understand how many of us feel about it's message.
Now Finland is objectively one of the most functioning democratic nations in the history of the world, whereas Russia slipped straight into authoritarianism after a brief attempt of democracy and continues the traditions of the Soviet Union by trying to conquer land that isn't theirs and being unnecessarily barbaric about it, too. They even kept the anthem, much of the nomenclature and the Security Council seat.
The links you gave pretty clearly shows that the attacks consisted of volunteers and weren't ordered by the government. And the numbers hovered somewhere around 10000 people total. So essentially the men from a small city and no more.
Not far from the truth to call these people fanatic nationalists who went rogue, since the military has no right to declare wars independant of the government.
Fresh Russian troll account? Very nice of you to bring up history of our "wrong" doings while Russia just casually invaded it's neighbours with tens of thousands soldiers.
Besides you're just casually ignoring that some turbulence with the population is quite expected when a new nation is born and there is a freaking civil war going on inside Soviet Union. So yes Finn's did do expeditions to Karelia and yes probably Finnish Karelians wanted rest of Karelia to join Finland too. Is there something weird about this?
Well the Russians really tried to fuck them so there’s that
Well not going to lie it doesn't seem like the Soviets are going to be disturbing world peace any time soon.
The statue was completed in 1990, two months after Berlin Wall fell. Soviet Union wasn't around long to disturb world peace after that.
People look at Russia like it is still the Soviet Union. It’s bizarre. The governments and systems couldn’t be different.
Nostalgia for the Soviet Union is motivating a lot of this recent expansionism. An ex-KGB man is running the place. Don't pretend there's no connection.
I used to be Part of a church. Now I’m not. Does that make me Christian? No. What are you getting at? Prior membership only colors perspective and history of a person. It does not define material conditions nor current personal decisions and values. If nostalgia for the ussr was something Putin cared about, he wouldn’t be fighting an imperialist war under the guise of denazification.
The Soviets had a lot more competence in governance. More like the Chinese than modern day Russia
Russia still claims to be the successor of the USSR.
There are some obvious diplomatic reasons for claiming to be the successor state to the USSR (e.g. the Soviet Union's seat of the UN Security Council). Even if Russia disavowed everything about the USSR you can't blame them for wanting the international influence.
I misread the comment. Of course Russia is today very different from Russia during the USSR, but Russia claims to be the successor.
The USA claims to be the greatest country in the world. So what. Russia’s propaganda is meant to appeal to those that lived under soviets. Who cares what they claim. Look at the evidence.
Any country can claim to be anything they want to be.
Its a shame Gorbachev's reforms were a failure--USSR could have become like its Scandinavian neighbors, potentially--democratic, strong labor protections, tolerant of markets, etc...and still potentially kept working towards Marxist goals like worker's ownership of the means of production, etc.
It would have been more like the EU but just socialist
The Communist Party is still the second largest party in Russia. Maybe if things get bad enough…
Huh. I live right around the corner from that statue and I hadn't noticed they took it away.
I think it is probably for the best. Though I liked the vandalised version of the statue.
Russia is not the Soviet though... Putin is channeling Imperial Russia rather than Soviet Union.
Though I guess emotionally people don't care bout technicalities.
The donation of statue has certain meaning and it's not peace.
That being said, the statue is removed because of improvements meant for the road it's on. Ironically to make it more acceptable for people who are using public transit or walking. If i recall right new place will be found for the statue, but it's removed for safety. Not for virtue signaling. (Plans were drafted before the war)
Yea believe they already had plans to move it, but now it may be temporarily placed in a warehouse forever
Russia has taken the stance that it is the successor to the Soviet Union. This is why they are founding members of the UN dispute Russia not being a country in 1945 and many other countries being former Soviet Union members. So even if they are not the Soviets right now they still are the same thing according to themselves which might as well be the actual technicality.
He's channeling both. The USSR was just as imperial as monarchist Russia
>He's channeling both. The USSR was just as imperial as monarchist Russia
Finland remembers the Winter War.
Finland also hopefully remembers the holocaust.
Hint: They’re best friend rhymes with Schmazi Schmermany.
Saying Finland actively committed the Holocaust is disinformation. During the Continuation War, Finland has 327 Finnish Jews who fought on the same frontline as German forces. The Finnish front even had a field synagogue operating in the presence of Nazi troops. Jewish soldiers were granted leave on Saturdays and Jewish holidays.
In November 1942, eight Jewish Austrian refugees (along with 19 other deportees) were deported to Nazi Germany after the head of the Finnish police agreed to turn them over. Seven of the Jews were murdered immediately. When Finnish media reported the news, it caused a national scandal, and ministers resigned in protest. After protests by Lutheran ministers, the Archbishop, and the Social Democratic Party, no more foreign Jewish refugees were deported from Finland. Approximately 500 Jewish refugees arrived in Finland during World War II, although about 350 moved on to other countries, including about 160 who were transferred to neutral Sweden to save their lives on the direct orders of Marshal Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim, the commander of the Finnish Army. About 40 of the remaining Jewish refugees were sent to do compulsory labor service in Salla in Lapland in March 1942. The refugees were moved to Kemijärvi in June and eventually to Suursaari Island in the Gulf of Finland. Although Heinrich Himmler twice visited Finland to try to persuade the authorities to hand over the Jewish population, he was unsuccessful.
Jews with Finnish citizenship were protected during the whole period. Late in the war, Germany's ambassador to Helsinki Wipert von Blücher concluded in a report to Hitler that Finns would not endanger their citizens of Jewish origin in any situation.
Three Finnish Jews were offered the Iron Cross for their wartime service: Leo Skurnik, Salomon Klass, and Dina Poljakoff. All three refused the award.
President of Finland, Marshal Mannerheim attended the memorial service for the fallen at the Helsinki Synagogue on 6 December 1944.
Finland was the only Axis country where synagogues remained open throughout World War II.
Please do research before you say dumb things as it helps both you and me.
We do. We made the mistake of deporting 8 jews to Germany. There was a public outcry, and several ministers resigned in protest, and it was never done again.
We did not collaborate with Nazis. We were cobelligerent with them, when they invaded USSR.
So not exactly best friends...
I'd also like to remind people of the part where southern European aid to Finland was blocked during winter war by Soviet collaborators. The Nazis.
Finland was allied with the Axis out of necessity as they asked for allied assistance in reclaiming lost land to the Soviets after the Winter war where the Soviets invaded Finland. Besides, Finland cooperation with Nazi Germany were to a minimum of frontline combat.
It was decided 6 years ago that the statue would have to be moved for construction of a new tram route. This move is not a political decision. Glad to see it gone, though. It is fugly.
Check out the statue we gave to Soviet Union in exchange. We got the better deal lol
Melt the statue into bullets, donate them to Ukraine.
Suffocation, no breathing...
Don't give a fuck if cut my arm, bleeding
is that the real lyric? that's dumb af.
Have you listened to the rest? It's all about wanting to die/hurt oneself
Melt a statue dedicated to world peace so you can use it for bullets in a brutal war. Yeah man you've definitely got the moral high ground here
A statue ”dedicated” to world peace which was definitely just a reminder from the USSR for Finland that they share a >1000km border and that they shouldn’t get too close to the west. That was the same country that tried to invade Finland twice 50 years earlier. That statue had nothing to do with peace.
The USSR in 1989 hardly had expansion on their mind.
Whoever downvoted you has no idea about history and geopolitics.
Upvotes and downvotes have nothing to do with facts. You can post an objective fact but if it paints Russia in favorable fashion, it's going to get downvoted.
They totally had it on their *minds*, they just hardly had *means* for it.
Melting down a statue dedicated to world peace donated by (the legal predecessor of) the state now directly threatening it, and turning it into bullets for use by the defenders of a peaceful sovereign country against the country waging a war of aggression against it, is rather in keeping with the statue's ostensible purpose as a monument to peace. Ukraine didn't choose to be invaded by Russia, and given the latter's actions, the statue would arguably do more to achieve peace that way than standing as a monument to hypocrisy.
It was the Soviet Union, not the modern Russian Federation, that donated the statue.
USSR was dominated by Russia and russians, it consisted of Russia plus occupied territories and Russia is USSRs legal successor.
The institutions are the same and the people mostly the same. The same power block still dominate.
The soviet Union literally saw it as their goal to keep the russian empire together after Lenin betrayed the revolution and couped the soviet assemblies.
The Soviet Union was, to put it in a internet-friendly format, simply Russia in a big red coat.
> Russians have a habit of invading and/or genociding everyone around them
Damn, they do? Like where?
Destruction of the zaporoshian cossacks, great northern war, annexation of crimea, annexation of Finland, first partition of poland, Caucasian wars, russian invasion of manchuria, genocide of the ingrians, first invasion of Ukraine, first invasion of Georgia, holodomor, deportation of crimean tartars, deportation of the baltic peoples, second partition of poland, the winter war, invasion of Hungary, invasion of czechoslovakia, soviet invasion of Afghanistan, first chechen war, second chechen war, second invasion of Georgia. And finally third invasion of Ukraine since 2014.
That's just a small selection of the crimes committed by Moscow.
Although I do not support the war in Ukraine.... I mean, if we want to open the books of history to way back you can find just as much dirt on America, UK, France, Italy, Spain, China, Japan, Arabia (with its different caliphates), Turks, and literally everyone.
Human history is bloody. And anyone in a place of power has abused it.
We going back hundreds of years now? Many of those were also done by the USSR and not just Russia.
Lol half of those were committed by imperialist Russia because of the czar, not because "Russians" have any "habit". And the Russian Revolution occurred in part because "Russians" were sick of that shit.
Some of those are outright fabrications invented as Nazi propaganda. Almost none of them are what anyone would consider genocide.
Yeesh. Loving all this hyper-racist blanket Russia hate that folks are bringing to the table though lately. Super healthy.
Better yet, donate them to Russia, at a high muzzle velocity.
Personal donation straight to Putin would be nice too
You understand how to deal with Russia. Good.
Why not just build a trebuchet and launch it across the border to Russia? That way they can claim "we weren't shooting at you, just a special statue operation"
Special peace keeping operation.
Same difference, Ukraine is the middle man who can fight Russia without nuclear war breaking out.
Why not melt it and turn it into a couple plows or something for Ukraine after the war? Much better gesture imo
Title is misleading, it's being temporarily moved for construction.
Gonna need to have you quote sources, as that is not mentioned anywhere in the article.
Well once Putin is dead, Helsinki will celebrate Putin's death along with EU and Ukraine.
Russian bs will not end to Putin's death, there is line of minions waiting to take Putin's mantle
There should be a statue of "World Proletariat Celebrating The Death Of Fascist Dictator Putin".
Well yes, this should be added in every European city here
But our heritageski!!!
They can replace this with a real World Peace statue.
- Soviet statue
- Called “World Peace”
Finally. What a cynical monument.
Yeah dude, fuck peace.
No, fuck the Soviets and their iron fist enforced peace.
Soviet and world peace don’t mix
What does mix with world peace capitalism? Get real
Tbf saying Soviet and world peace not mixing is not the same as propping up capitalism. Saying the U.S. and world peace do not mix is equally true, thanks to the military industrial complex
Criticism of Soviet Union isn't an implicit or explicit praise for capitalism.
I mean, Europe was the most peaceful part of the world for many decades.
They agreed to rape the world together instead of each other
They did say Europe, not European countries.
if it wasnt for the Soviets Union's sacrifices, Europe would all be speaking German right now
Lol yeah, and the Soviets didn't give a shit about Europe all speaking German until the Nazis attacked them too.
The "sacrifices" weren't for the Europeans.
and the U.S. didnt join until Japan attacked them 🤷
In 1938 they were trying to start a war against Germany with France and the UK. The USSR and France both had defense treaties with Czechoslovakia. What happened instead was the Munich Agreement
I'm not underplaying the number of lives the Soviet Union ultimately lost, however it's not as clear cut as that. The Soviet's were initially on the German's side for the first two years of the war and split Poland in half between them.
One could argue that Germany wouldn't have made the gains that they did and it escalate to the level it reached had that not been the case and one could also argue that the Soviet Union didn't necessarily need to sacrifice that many lives had they employed a different strategy, but that would also be an unfair take given all the other parties involved and their actions in the war and I'm not a military strategist or expert.
That is to say that WWII is a complex and messy affair and to characterise it in one statement like you have is always going to be a dishonest take.
Edit - I'm being downvoted but the success against Nazi Germany was a collaborative effort, not just one single country "won" it. Every country involved made great sacrifice and expended huge amounts of resources. It's straight up wrong and pretty gross to say "Oh, well Russia did most of the work". It's simply not true.
> "Oh, well Russia did most of the work". It's simply not true.
8 out of every 10 german casualties happend against the Red Army, I'd call that "most of the work".
Ye, cause lives lost is the only metric to characterise the success or effort put into a war. Just ask Ukraine...
>That is to say that WWII is a complex and messy affair and to characterise it in one statement like you have is always going to be a dishonest take.
not nearly as dishonest of a characterized statement such as "Soviets and world peace don't mix" right? yet of the two, you choose to criticize mine for trying to give the USSR the credit it deserves, why is that
the USA and UK constantly get credit and gloat about winning the war "We saved Europe's ass from the Nazis, Hoorah!" yet when it comes to the USSR, there's always some intellectualized way of explaining why it wasn't the case. oh well
>"Oh, well Russia did most of the work"
that's not what I was implying, I mean that WW2 would've been lost without the USSR, not that it single handedly won the war. same could be said for the rest of the allies btw
Well done Helsinki.
This seems like a shitty PR move.
Because USSR =/= Russia. it split into 15 different nations. Putin might claim his Russia is the new USSR, but its lightyears apart.
>This seems like a shitty PR move.
It's not, at least fully. The English article is a shortened version, and missing some info. It has to be moved due to road construction, which was decided years ago. The change is now whether it comes back or stays in storage, originally they considered returning it. And tbh regardless of world situation, many think it's good riddance of an ugly, ridiculous statue.
Putin despises then Soviet Union; he's actively trying to purge as much Soviet history as possible, so you may want to read up on that.
The communist party in Russia is actually the second most powerful political faction behind Putin's party at something like 20% support(, Navalny's party only gets around 2% support) so Putin does have reason to be concerned about Soviets and their history.
I don't know what to think here because Russia is no longer soviet and has been capitalist since 1991. I mean it doesn't really matter to guess, but there is nothing communist about modern Russia.
Nothing to think, really. The move was planned for years, it's in the way of construction. The statue itself has been disliked basically always, so likely will sit in storage. This isn't ideological removal, we have others still around
i love the russian apologists going on about how russia isn't the USSR, like the two weren't synonymous for decades
the USSR was no better than nazi germany anyway, it's like poland being asked to keep a statue honoring nazis