By - RugbyBot
##[Post Match Thread HERE](https://redd.it/vpnll3)
Ireland didn't get into the high gears. NZ winning tries were soft they look very beatable and got lucky with the 50/50 calls. On form Ireland can beat them easy.
This man knows nothing about rugby, nor how hard it is to win a test in New Zealand
Ireland pump themselves up by beating a tired ABs at home in November. Playing a fresh ABs at home is a different story.
Neither should be a good indicator of form.
What matters is the RWC and Ireland won't beat a Fresh South Africa in the pool and definitely won't beat either France or ABs in the QF.
>Ireland won't beat a Fresh South Africa in the pool
lol I remember everyone writing Ireland off before the Australia pool game in 2011 with Aussie commentators saying "Irish fans will have nothing to cheer about after the game" before the game even started. They say pride comes before the fall.
Ireland have had a looooong season, so it's quite literally the shoe on the other foot compared to Nov.
Any team could beat the other on their day.
Except in the QF of the RWC when we know what the result will be.
Leinster lads seem to have decided to clock off about 2 months ago.
Next world cup will be another washout. At least we're decent in the Six Nations but beyond that we're miles behind everyone else.
Impressed by NZ scrum and lineout.
They got dominated by France and Ireland in Novemeber, so to turn that around so well, well done forward coaches and players
Bring on Dunners under the roof!
ABs brutal with opportunities... massive pressure game and NZ delivered....still unbeaten at Eden park since 1994...unbelieveable
combinations in the abs were nice
All blacks didn’t dominate the game but were brutal opportunities. Atmosphere at eden park was Stella. Thanks to all the Irish fans and players.
I still have concerns about the abs attack. Half those trys came just from individual brilliance.
Not really. They AB’s showed they could adapt imo. As soon as smith started passing long on the first pass off the ruck we make real meters. Ardie’s try was a long pass off the ruck.
I agree. Attack is not structured, or breakdown. Most scoring opportunities were like said, opportunistic. But taking small windows of opportunity is a big part of test rugby.
Only saw one issue with the ABs was the breakdown. It is a bit issue, but everything else was pretty good
Thought it was vastly improved from November. IMO, Dickson's policing of the rucks and mauls was incredibly poor - Ireland often had players pawing at the ball-carrier from the side in the mauls, and very often, especially in the first half, had players off their feet, lying all over the wrong side of the ruck when on attack. ABs adapted well to that, and were getting more regular turnovers.
Unsure what this game tells us about Ireland. It was a comprehensive defeat but difficult to tell if it was a one off or will be repeated next time around. I think that game will tell us more.
Areas of worry, in my eyes at least. Porter was owned, unsure if Furlong still has it, after Sexton who? You need some pace on the wings and Earls ain't it. Carberry is not an international 10.
Let's see what the next game brings. If it's more of the same then Ireland have some problems to deal with before the WC.
Earls is a clinical finisher, we also have a good few players injured , Carberry would be my pick for 10 going forward, sexton has looked his age this season , scrum half would be more of a worry and we have good props coming through in josh whycherly and Kenyan Knox , we’re gonna have to take these hidings for the month and hopefully learn for the tour
Edit: Coombes should also be a nailed on starter
Agree, as an All Blacks fan I am still nervous about next week’s test - Ireland created a lot of opportunities and got across the line a number of times only to be denied at the finish. The pressure from the All Blacks’ defence contributed to that of course but there was some bad luck in there too.
Dominant victory for the All Blacks, but Ireland can definitely be proud of how well they played tonight.
Take away two of those all blacks tries off our own mistakes and it’s 28-19, we get given the Carbery try and it’s 28-26. Winnable game if sexton didn’t get concussed.
So take into account the forward passes leading to the first two Ireland tries, and the fact that Aki didn’t actually make the try line yet was given, and it is 28-0?
Unfortunately it doesn’t work like that…
If we had this
If we did that
If you got out of bed on the other side this morning
If it makes it easier to deal with the loss then go hard mate.
Winnable if but and maybe....welcome to international sport
Go the ABs!
If my grandma had wheels she'd be a bike
If my Grandmother had wheels she would have been a bike
Is that you Gino?
If my Grandma had wheels she'd be a bike
I dont think Ireland played badly at all. The ref missed a few costly things and they just lacked continuity at critical times
ABs lacked continuity and scored a truck load of points. So yeah, both teams were scratchy and that's expected from ABs early in the season.
This thread goes hard
I wonder if any Irish readers understood what you just said lol
Well done Foster and Cane.
Some improvements still needed, but for the first hit out of the season, not too bad.
didnt see much from foster or cane tbh
Great maul defense, incredible goal line defense, 200 tackles, dominant scrum, dominant lineout, ruck parity, decent tactical kicking, plus 6 tries. Not a bad first hitout at all. We need to keep working on disrupting Irish short attack, they're very good at making ground up the guts.
For next week
Get some studs.
Bring in Aki Murray Coombes.
Teach Sheehan to throw a line-out
Happy Birthday Sam Canes Nana 😤
Does she have wheels? If yes then you may be confusing her with a bike.
Crazy goal line defense from ABs. Reckon Ireland will have a point to prove next weekend and come out firing
Gg NZ, better side today and though us a lesson in almost all areas.
A lot of fans letting themselves down in this thread though, a bit of dignity in victory would go a long way.
Thats this sub for you.
Ireland always bring the heat and ABs had to really stand up in a pressure game
Well done both sides
Choo-choo, here comes the match take train:
\-I expected a much closer game at first, never anticipated a drubbing like this.
\-The All Blacks started out slow and muddy, but after the 30 minute mark had passed, there were at their full power, dominating Ireland for almost the entirety of the game.
\-Ireland, on the other hand, were dominant for the first 30 minutes, however, after Sexton was gone, it all came crashing down for them, although that didn't stop them for trying to rebound in the last 10 minutes or so.
\-Speaking of which... God, I hope Ireland don't lose anymore players due to injury. I hope those all injured or ill can recover well.
\-Both Leicester and Pita Gus, while he stumbled a bit first, had cracking debuts.
\-I've got zero words to say abut this ref. He was just... appalling, to say the least.
\-Overall, was a pretty fun game and I hope to see more games at this scale later in the tour.
Anyway, this is all I have for now. As always free free to add more takes if there's any more concern.
Cheers for now and I'll see all in the next match thread!
also happy birthday mum
I agree for the most part, but I actually don’t think the reffing was bad at all
Yeah the refereeing got a bit loose at the end but overall decent showing, reasonably balanced to both teams
And yet earls scored and carbs had on ruled out. Game wasn't won or lost in those two positions
Yeah we’re never gonna win games with earls on the wing. We need pace out wide.
POMs a great interview. It’s crazy how quick he goes from manic aggression in the game to quite eloquent post game
The time he tore into Lavanini and then apologised to the ref like a little boy had me in stitches
I really like the idea of a henshaw bundee centre pairing with ringrose outside them
Bundee Henshaw is definitely our best centre pairing
Yes bundee has big game instincts and henshaw is Ireland's best centre
Look pretty close match. Ireland had 10 minutes of shitness where they conceded 21 points. If the carbery try was given (which it should’ve been) and sexton possessed any ability to kick then the score would be 28 - 42. Overall not too bad considering the ABs didn’t create any of their own tries they basically took advantage of Ireland’s mistakes. Next match will be close as well.
Is PGS usually that dirty of a player ?
I can think of 3 of the tries tonight off the top of my head that the All Blacks created off phase ball.
But they only had the ball because an Irish player threw a shit pass or because an Irish player had horrible handling skills. If someone beats someone who is badly skilled, does that make them extremely skilful ?
Part of the NZ game plan will be to absorb pressure while waiting for mistakes. Mistakes almost always happen and when they do, NZ pounce. Ireland spent 5x as long in the NZ 22m, but NZ were more clinical when they had their chances.
So, it's hard to answer the question - as I don't think Ireland are lacking in skill. They just weren't as clinical, coupled with the psychological toll of being the attacking team and your efforts being absorbed, I'm not surprised they forced things and it didn't work out for them.
Right, so when Savea caught the lineout, Faingaanuku made it over the gain line, Savea got on the outside shoulder of Ringrose and then stepped Earls to go over for a try... that was somehow due to Irish passing or handling?
> Overall not too bad considering the ABs didn’t create any of their own tries they basically took advantage of Ireland’s mistakes.
AB didn’t show that they had an attack. It will certainly be entertaining to see next week if they can pull it off.
6 tries with no attack is pretty good going
Was that the try where he lost control?
JVDF without a doubt lost control but Carbery try definitely should’ve been given. Ref probably had money on the game or something.
You don't need control just to be still touching it anywhere
You either need control or need to press it down
The ball can be grounded in in-goal:
• By holding it and touching the ground with it; or
• By pressing down on it with a hand or hands, arm or arms, or the front of the player’s body from waist to neck.
No mention of control in the law book, just a SH interpretation of... nothing?
The ball can be grounded in in-goal:
- By holding it and touching the ground with it; or
- By pressing down on it with a hand or hands, arm or arms, or the front of the player’s body from waist to neck.
No separation - more than enough downward pressure. Definite try
Key take-always are that NZ have superiority at the set price, especially the scrum!
Also, as much as I love Mounga, Beaudy is our best 10 at test level.
When it becomes unstructured Ireland can’t keep up, however if they can maintain structure they can cause the ABs real problems.
The point about richie, having both on at the same time is stupid, have richie either start 40 or end 40 with barrett not on, infact i found that the game lacked richie and it could have been a better performance.
Totally agree. Richie only ever gets to play with other players trying to get in at first receiver every phase.
Yes, but I do want to see Richie run the cutter and have the reigns. Whenever Richie is on for ABs, Beauden goes to fullback. I’d like to see more of him in charge like at the Crusaders.
Agree, Mo’unga is good no doubt but his Super Rugby form doesn’t seem to translate to test level. Beauden knows what to do.
I sorta disagree with that narrative tbh, I think Mounga has been better at test level than most people make-out, but there’s no denying Barrett has been better at test level.
Not saying he’s bad at test level, just not the dazzling player he can be at Super Rugby level. He’s solid enough but doesn’t stand out, imo.
Peter O'Mahony's face as he mentally translates the interviewer's Kiwi-English to Cork-English! 🤣
You know I think I prefer a captaincy style more like Michael Wells, after a tragic thumping being all roses and positivity in the post-game interview is a bit disingenuous. POM out there saying 'all we gotta do is be consistent' is maybe downplaying how completely dominated they were in all aspects of the game all night.
It was 6-3 in tries. Ireland left a few behind and gifted NZL some. Ireland had more territory and more possession. NZL made 200 tackles.
How was it a domination?
Peter O'Mahony is a generational player.
He's a cry baby at best.
That term had lost all meaning.
This is definitely a bit rash but I think just make Frawley defacto 22 and prep him for the World Cup
He has a lot of weaknesses but I think they can be trained up better than Carbery's weaknesses which are pretty clear.
I’ll second this
Was qorried coming into it but good performance from the boys, onto next week
I never really liked rugby anyways
I enjoyed this game a lot more before I opened the match thread. I need to stay away during games
Its horrible in here sometimes mate. Theres some really sad, sad bastards out there
Happy birthday Thelma
We were sloppy, our scum was poor, our line out was poor, we gifted them at least two tries and in my opinion butchered two oppertunites ourselves.
But still we weren't awful. There is some hope.
Why is she asking Sam about his wig?
McCaw was watching from the stands 😉
Score flattens NZ somewhat; Irish crossed quite a few times. That last 20 minutes of the first half was the end of them. But a lot of positives and still no reason to suggest they at least don’t have a chance to win 1 or both of the remaining 2 games
It doesn’t really. You can easily look at territory/possession stats and think that. But the metric that should be used is scoring possessions.
Its true, don’t know how many times now I’ve seen the All Blacks dominated in the stats, but still win comfortably.
Kidding yourself Ricko! Got to get the ball down to score matey
Yea but that’s not how world rugby thinks. If you want to take that mindset to the WC then fair, but be prepared to be humbled
Defense wins matches, world rugby has never been closer and it’s exciting.. still love to see tries, that’s what the fans pay to see
Ah shit misinterpreted your comment to think that you’re making a comment about Rieko’s try saving tackle (I’m 9 Heineken’s deep). Definitely! So damn exciting!
And what about nz defence? They never dotted down..
Enjoyable watch. Ireland came out with some real urgency, and little chips through the midfield were a good tactic for a bit there.
Im sure it will be a closer match next week, Ireland are still a good chance to grab a win.
OK, quite the game.
Ireland made a mistake and conceded the second try, then lost their heads and conceded 2 more very soft tries. Without those its a different game and the score probably undersells Ireland.
An object lesson for Ireland tho. Cannot be loose against the ABs. Bit not a million miles off.
42-26 isn't too bad
I assume you're also taking out the forward pass on Ireland's first try?
It wasn't forward.
Not sure what you're talking about there, don't remember.
Not sure why you're getting picky, bit weird after a pretty impressive win, but you do you pal.
You're the one that starting the whinging over a missed try with the "42-26"
My friend, that was a joke.
Sore winners is right, this is a bit pathetic.
Mine was also a joke though? Why are you allowed to make a joke but not me? Lmao
Aye yeah sure
Which one are you counting couch ref?
The one where the onfield decision was overruled without any evidence of separation.
Am I the only one who saw it being clearly dropped? Was imagining things? I'll watch it again when I can.
Yes you're definitely the only one who saw it being clearly dropped. No separation. Farcical decision but at least it didn't matter.
There was no angle showing separation.
The one from above was pretty damning, I thought
Definitely showed the ball moved, and it's entirely possible there was seperation, but there weren't any shots showing air between the ball and his fingers.
You're gonna want that right hand angle bud, the ball leaves his hand.
Did you break into Eden Park and steal a tape or something? Wasn't an angle showing separation, so no evidence to overrule onfield decision.
Maybe the TV director does have one, and if I see it I'll change my mind. Til then I'll go off the available evidence.
We got it here, I can't say i know much about the TV thing because I haven't always been able to afford it live. On what we saw, it looked marginal on the front view, then the angle from the top-ish right showed it leaving his hand
The one without downward pressure?
That's not how onfield decisions work my friend, look up the laws.
Needs to be evidence of separation, and there wasn't any.
The onfield decision was that the grounding was inconclusive hence they went upstairs.
That's incorrect. Not how onfield decisions work, it's either onfield decision try, or onfield decision no try. "Buhh, I dunno" is not an option.
Refer back to my recommendation to look up the laws.
ABs better when the players coach themselves for the week.
Wanting abs to win > wanting foster to be bad
Honestly though I did see innovation tonight so the jury can stay out
Wonder how much of it was from the fill-in coaches.
TBH, have no idea how players/teams at this level plan, train, etc.
Yeah I was just being facetious. Best thing I saw tonight from an ABs perspective was the small adjustments they made after the first 20. I can only assume thats come from the coaches at some point.
Somehow Murray was better than JGP. NZ is just too good at home and we just didn't know how to ground the ball similar to the Maori game
Just bitterly disappointing from an Irish perspective
We looked amazing in small periods then would totally implode
We definitely have the ability to beat new Zealand, we just need everything to go 100% our way
Whereas New Zealand can win when they're only playing to half of their potential
I'd happily take a 2:1 loss in the series
2:1? Haha What game did you just watch? Ireland are looking down the barrel of a white wash. You haven’t been close in either game. The rust is off the All Blacks, next week will be even more painful
How graceful of you
It's people like you that give new Zealand fans a terrible name
Also first 20 we absolutely dominated, then yous got 3 jammy scores which inflated the scorelines...we also had 3 held up trys and 1 with "no downward pressure" and another knocked out of Vander fliers hands
So that's 5 trys we could/should have scored
Different day and we get some of those scores and all of a sudden game looks totally different
We score all of them and that's 35 points
Add in sextons missed conversion and that's 37 points we left on the field
The "downward pressure" reference from the ref was shocking. That's the rule in rugby league, but not in rugby union.
NZ 42 - IRL 19
Gr8 rEsPOnSe m8
The worst winners in rugby at it again
We’re not all like this I promise
Literally calling it as I see it, for the life of me I can’t understand where this Irish confidence comes from.
They’re 3 wins from the last 5 before tonight get your hand off it
Typical NZ performance just so ruthless when the chances came. Some good patches from us but that 2nd quarter really killed the game
WE WON!!! WOOT WOOT!!!
Good game, Ireland!!
Cane had a good game. Dalton was immense as soon as he came on.
Beaudy played out of his shoes, and Richie was solid.
Leicester played tremendously, as did Sevu - and Will Jordan's in the wings.
Feeling pretty rapt about the depth
Some dude literally followed me round and harassed me every time sam cane made a mistake, but was weirdly quiet when he was good
It's a shame our three best loosies by far are all 7s haha.
BB controlled the game really well I feel.
It'll come back to bite us though. Always does.
Tight 5 were awesome, Reiko played well too
No try for Fainga'anuku but he had a monster game anyway. Amazing defense!
Quite the baller coming on
Really good start I thought. He played great but he'll definitely shine against teams with weaker defences later this year.
Great to see such gracious victors in this thread…
They're so weird, I hope it's just this subreddit and not their supporters on the whole that are such sore winners.
They're usually nice in person but their online fanbase is genuinely awful.
I’m glad we won, and it wasn’t Ireland’s night, but you guys are a hell of a tough team. And we can’t (and shouldn’t) forget that you gave us a walloping in Dublin. Expecting two more cracking Tests.
200 tackles? yikes
ABs just too clinical. Ireland probably had more ball, more territory and more chances but were too sloppy, too slow and too inefficient
Lots of injuries doesn't bode well for next week.
Only going to get worse in my opinion.
Not a lot worked tonight, lineout maul was poor, scrum was weak. These are all things that have been an issue for Ireland this season. Which is pretty worrying that we haven't sorted them.
Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how soon Sexton will be back after world rugby made the stand down period 12 days for concussion - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jun/17/world-rugby-concussion-regulations-change
Kinda flattering win for the ABs, still not the well-oiled machine we expect them to be
Never understand these kind of comments? We executed nearly all opportunities and our defence shut Ireland down? It was a brilliant decisive first hit out…
Attack didn’t look too crisp to me, lacking a bit of fluidity. Defence was good. Overall it was a good performance imo, don’t get me wrong
Attack never looks clean in a first test, but I’d argue it was far better than last year..
That was their first hit out, they’ll continue to gel
True, however last year their chemistry got worse as the year went on. Gonna be a defining couple months for Fozzie and Co
Lol Ian Foster will still have a job, AB fans won’t be happy
No idea how Papali’i is still not starting on this team.
Ian Foster is a bum.
Need to make room for Scott Barrett to shoulder charge someone’s head
Didn’t play well and still won very comfortably. Ireland gave it their all but their game plan was far too simplistic and hasn’t developed since 2018.
If you rely on forward dominance your scrum can’t keep getting turned over and you need monster forwards which Ireland just don’t have
Wasn't the best example of it today but the game plan is completely changed since 2018
You lost to us literally 8 months ago. Score line flattered you. You’ve no game plan other than hands and hope for the best.
A tired team that didn’t include all our best players. This is a new Nz team which is only getting better.
I just don’t see this Ireland team getting better
Ok well we can say this is a tired Ireland team who lost its starting outhalf after 20 mins
If you’re that reliant on a soon to be 37 year old then you have major problems
I'd disagree completely there, Ireland have developed their game, it was just the basics of scrum and lineout that ultimately flattered the ABs tonight
Well yeah, the Ireland scrum and line out isn’t good enough and hasn’t been for a while.
This isn’t a shock, it got decimated by England and France as well. It wasn’t just a one off bad game
I think the problem with goal line drop outs is that it's easier to practise tackling high and falling backwards to hold up a try than it is to actually defend for many phases. It seems like a get out of jail for defenses to release all pressure on their line.
My issue with it is that it massively overpowers advantage. Teams just wait until the defence infringes, then it's back to the old rules. Not a fan of the change personally.
It also rewards the defending team for defense alone, when the reward for defense should just be not conceding points.
I think it discourages white line fever and rewards goal line defense.
I know that's the point of it, but it doesn't really discourage pick and go tactics. Teams still do it just as much. And sometimes it's the only option on the goal line while your backs get set.
Looking forward to the Sky analysis panel with 1 woman and 3 huge men calling her "honey"
I hope this is a joke, but her name is Honey
Looking forward to her token basic as takes
'*It was really great to see the All Blacks bouncing back after the disappointment of last season and ah, Ardie Savea! What a player*!'
Forget sometimes how brutal these tests can be. Disappointing of course but a hell of a game
Really high quality test and Ireland brought their game regardless of the scoreline. It’s hard to be critical of yourselves when the All Blacks play like that. Apart from a few ugly errors they played incredibly well when they were in ascendency.
Sure yeah the all blacks just have that aura as well especially at home. I'd say you can't coach that kind of confidence to just execute 9/10 times whether you're on or off, but somehow you've figured it out down there.
Ireland would have been better off slowing it down, but it was some watch other than 10-15 mins midway through the second half