If money was no object, where is the absolute perfect place to build your dream bug out fortress?
By - JustinTime78
I’m not telling.
This is the correct answer.
Money no object, terraform Mars. Bug out planet.
Elons working on it lol
Somewhere with enough healthy land that I could easily grow on and raise animals on. Ideally some place relatively mountainous with trees as well. The ability to secure building materials such as large stones and lumber would be crucial, somewhere that maybe only has summer time access to the property since the road becomes unable to be navigated during the winter and is far enough away from towns/cities that you don't generally have to worry about looters or anything like that. The fortress itself would need to be large and have a multitude of buildings for various purposes and the capability to hold at least a few hundred people. The thing is, as long as the ground was healthy and I could find the nearby resources that I needed, and had several ways of procuring drinkable water nearby, then any place works pretty well. Humans happen to be pretty good at terraforming the earth to suit their needs, and most everything can be made to suit your preferences, especially if money is no object.
Without saying where, here are my criteria:
* Rain fed farmland, no need for pump irrigation or sprinklers
* Long growing season, able to get in two (or maybe three) crops a year
* Mild winters, with snow being acceptable but no sub-zero arctic freezes
* Proximity to year-round water sources, at least 2
* Sufficient water flow for hydropower, minimum generation 10 kW
* Large wood lot on the property
* Largely flat terrain
* Approximately 300 miles from any major city (one tank of gas)
* Small town (<5000 people) within 20-30 miles
That's pretty much the perfect list. I struggled to think of anything to add.
Sucks that a lot of this criteria will change (climately) in the future. Rain and temperatures are going to fluctuate wildly
Somewhere remote near the great lakes...a lot of my other choices are going to have drought and water quality problems as the climate changes (and sooner rather than later).
Since 5 teenagers were able to survive 15 months with no planning and minimal supplies it's seems like this Tongan island could make a pretty decent homestead, assuming you brought in the right gear to set yourself up. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tongan_castaways
Highly automated mega yacht or submarine with 20 years of supply and automated freighter with building materials and supplies to resettle. Hidden caches of supplies and building materials strategically placed around globally appropriate for the environment. A trusted crew of like minded individuals with overlapping skills like (surgeon, electrician, construction, agricultural biologist, hunters, etc).
Kind of reminds me of the premise of Snowpiercer.
Ok, if money was no object, and other things were real, like I am not going to run off to other nations and the like, nor would I run off to some place I have never been to.
My advice sits from directly living in this region, and so take that as it is.
With that said, ideally, if money was not an object, I believe that one of the most ideal locations would be PNW, up near Humboldt County California, Myers Flats or Redcrest, would be my first choice areas, but Garberville is also a good location as well, pretty much anywhere near or in the Avenue of the Giants, or within the Redwood Forest itself, if you can buy land in there.
This is an absolutely peerlessly gorgeous area, that has a deep rich history of frontiers and early settlers in the region.
Their is ample amount of water, forest for hunting, and really good variety crop growing conditions as well.
Now, I worked in that region for 2 years, and there is no way in living hell, I would ever return there if I had to work there again, but, if money was no object, the place is amazing.
A ***remote*** private island in the south Pacific with good soil and enough elevation to deal with occasional bad weather.
Three words: ring of fire.
The west coast of the US (where I live) up past Alaska, all of that is in the Ring of Fire.
If the island is an extinct volcano, then it would be ok, except for a possible tsunami, which is one reason I mentioned elevation. Ideally, the island would have somewhat level land elevated at least several hundred feet above sea level and no seismic/volcanic activity.
An island like NZ's south island would be very good if you were away from the lowland coastal areas and far enough away from the volcanoes. They have seismic activity, but there are ways to mitigate that, especially if price is no object and you could stay on your own land (not be caught in the lowlands).
The islands within the ring of fire get destroyed if there’s earthquakes near by. Just make sure if it’s a private island you’re not so remote your unreachable for evacuation purposes.
Honestly it would be less a "where" and more a "what"
For any fans of sailing you've probably seen Sailing Uma in YouTube and they've made a fairly efficient solar powered sailboat. The earth is approximately 70% ocean so being able to travel on the largest biome we have seems like a no brainer to me. Admittedly I probably do something much larger than their set up, but the concept is there and it's solid. A bug in fortress / shelter / whatever is a temporary solution. EVENTUALLY you will have to travel outside of it for whatever reason, making the safe Haven transportable seems like sound logic to me. Massive solar banks on a Pelagic 77 specifically.
Somewhere in Vermont
Yes! I made the right choice!
Did you move to Vermont?
Bought a homestead and beginning the transition. You?
A girl can dream.
That’s so awesome though!!! 100% legit choice.
Hey, keep working toward that dream. I only paid $200 k for mine and it has an old fixer upper house and a huge barn. It's half the price per acre compared to farmland in rural UT (my current state), and here in UT you have to irrigate, and good luck finding water rights. Practically requires a ritual sacrifice.
Thank you! I’m working my ao. One day soon!
Your land sounds like a dream! Can’t wait to hear about how it’s coming along.
Aw, thanks. It'll be a while, we only bought recently and can't do anything this year except fly out and winterize it haha.
LOL! :) I picked Smugglers Notch, then looked down the responses and saw all this!
What do you mean by water rights ?
Here in Canada you can drill a well anywhere you want on your own property.
Oh that's a pleasure enjoyed by any agrarian-minded residents of the arid American West. All the water that falls from the sky is a claimed resource, owned by someone before it even hits the ground. A "water right" is a deeded certificate (property that can be bought and sold) which entitles the owner to a certain amount of water each year, and maintenance dues are paid to irrigation companies that maintain the infrastructure (reservoirs, canals, pumps, etc) to deliver the water to the holder of the right. Water rights can also be used to drill private wells by filing paperwork with the state, an application which can be contested by the public or other rights holders. The older your right, the higher you are on the totem pole, and if you don't use all your water, your rights can be claimed and forfeited. This encourages waste in a region that is drying up. And what happens when insufficient water is present in the system to satisfy everyone's rights? Well we're about to find that out. In fact, it's already begun- see Ammon Bundy's recent violent threats at the Klamath Reservoir Gates this summer, when irrigation water was completely cut off to farmers downriver due to the worsening drought conditions. If you've ever heard the phrase "water wars," this is what it's referring to. I wouldn't start a homestead anywhere where there's already not enough water, because climate change is going to make it even worse.
Growing up in the Midwest, I had never heard of water rights. Still don't really understand it fully
"Water wars" for Canadians means Americans invading.
Kalalau Valley on Kauai. Already proven as a bug out destination. Only one way in via land.
And protected by both state and federal law, and therefore not available for you to "build" your dream bug-out "castle".
Some people have squatted there, but they do enforce the law every now and then and remove them, so honestly it seems like a pretty poor choice.
Sorry didn’t know there were rules to this fantasy thought experiment 🙃
Missile Silo #124
Hey neighbor. I’m in #125. Could you please turn your music down?
That’s not music, that’s the monthly test of the generators and rocket boosters you are hearing, 379.2 miles away from my site….
I'd buy mammoth cave lol
West side of the Appalachians - if money is truly no object, I will import Stirling castle from Scotland :) but will also tunnel deep into the mountain for storage, panic exits, and firing ranges.
I'd stay in America, the most likely to remain stable (enough) and unconquered long-term. For location you'd want to be back from the ocean due to tsunamis and hurricanes, but I'd stay nearer the east coast because fires and yellowstone. High ground to avoid floods, of course, not right next to a river or anything. Cooler climate to buffer for global warming. Somewhere with few people and no natural disasters, there's lots of choices. Maybe in the Adirondack mountains.
The ideal for long-term living would be a nice well-stocked house in the middle of bumfuck nowhere, but I would love to go full Bond villain doomsday bunker, a house carved deep into a mountainside cave or an old nuke silo. The kind where you can seal the door and not open it again for a decade if the world goes to shit.
Don't have much first hand experience but I've seen alot of nice spots in the Ozarks. Contemplating a farm there. If money were no object? A self sufficient floating fortress. Not tied to any landmass or country or people.
Middle of ocean
Ocean base is always a classic
Top of Bear Lodge Mountain Wyoming, (also known as Devils Tower).
Lately I've been thinking Peru or Ecuador some where at the foot of the Andes mountains.. possibly western Argentina
Smuggler's Notch, and what makes it ideal is we know it like the backs of our hands. Alternately, I could see West Texas, we've spent enough time there, and it's low population density.
Hey cowboy. Believe it or not, I'm originally from West Texas (I'm the person from the other Vermont thread). Texans refer to the Panhandle as West Texas, Dallas area as North Texas, the area south of that as East Texas, and the actual west arm of the state as the Big Bend region or just "El Paso." So I'm not sure if you were referring to the Panhandle or the El Paso area when you said "West Texas." The Panhandle is doing surprisingly well water-wise the last several years, but I'm concerned about its water future. It sits over the Ogallala Aquifer, a fossil water source being quickly depleted by agriculture. There won't be much access to water there after it's gone, and that's without climate change. I don't know much about El Paso as it is, except that it's even drier than the Panhandle.
Well not the Panhandle, but not all the way out to El Paso. Haven't lived in Texas since before I was in Junior High, so not sure I know the dividing lines when locals refer to areas. I always considered anything west of San Antonio or Abilene as West Texas. For me it's where you start having 60-70 miles between off ramps and the night sky is as dark and full of stars as it could get. We always looked at the McCamey or Fort Stockton area, and the Pecos River as a source of water. Maybe even as far south as Big Bend National Park area, near the Rio Grande. It's just nice that it's sparsely populated, pretty open between settlements, and with the right location you can get good sight lines in all directions. I won't be so nosey as to ask where in the Green Mountains you got your homestead, but most of my core group grew up in the area right around Stowe, which is why I said the Notch. Actually if money were no object, I'd buy all of Mt Mansfield all the way out to Putnam Forest, and tell those Von Trapp fuckers to go kick sand, but that's a whole other story. :'D
Haha! My homestead's not too far from there, but I wouldn't be in your territory. I'm northeast of you. Maybe I'll run into you sometime, I'm sure we'll be out that way to see the beauty. Hopefully before SHTF and you stake your claim, or, if not, maybe I could trade you a good lasso for safe passage ;)
LOL :) Trading will definitely be top of our agenda, and we won't look unkindly on people who are already in our AO. Not sure if that will be where we land, there are always multiple contingency plans, but if you ended up northeast, then you picked the right direction. If we weren't picking based on our knowledge of the land the NEK would be our choice as well. I will say, when you do get out there to look around, take a trip to Stowe. One of the best prep things in the whole of Vermont is there: an old school working blacksmith. He usually just does wrought iron gates and art, but he can make a good blade or tool for the money.
Woah really? That's cool, what's his name or his shop's name? I'll definitely look him up!
Richard Spreda, he runs his forge near where the river runs through town, next to the gas station at the main intersection. He's a good man to know.
That is awesome. Thanks for the tip. He'll sure be set, when the time comes.
No worries man, always happy to help!
Ive heard people say, Texans dont claim Dallas. Or Houston.
i'd be looking for a few hundred acres of land with a deep artesian spring, within 30 min of a busy rail terminal.
I dont know that i would BUILD one, but I would maybe look into purchasing one of those decommissioned Missile Silo and reoutfit it for living in, of course, purchase some land around it. Perhaps build a barndominium for myself and a few scattered smaller homes (or whatever the size home my group wanted. Fence it all off...gosh, now you have me dreaming.
I asked Larry Page and he wouldn’t tell me but he’s moving to New Zealand.
Between central/east Texas and eastern Tennessee, inclusive.
...which includes the Ozarks that I'm sure a lot of people have mentioned.
Mega multi hulled container ship. Nuclear powered.
Have small town on ship effectively. Create a mobile trade hub.
What is my fortress defending against? Zombies, civil unrest, aliens, other?
At the start of a valley in the Appalachians Wv or PA Where ever I get get the most land away from my neighbors.
Except for increasingly strict gun laws, but still worth consideration, yes.
Since when does a money-no-object type person follow laws?
If you can fly your own plane in you could smuggle some guns.
You've never been here have you?.. one of the good things about NZ is that, if you leave the cops alone they return the favour.... it's quite possible to make pepper spray...
Ooof, true. I just realized, you are not even allowed to carry pepper spray in NZ.
And knives are not far behind.
They do currently allow hunting guns and have really good hunting on the south island. But if SHTF?
It is hard to judge - the USA may eventually not be far from NZ with regards to gun control.
The other downside if NZ is that being so remote makes it hard/expensive to get some things, but if $ are plentiful, one could stock up on supplies.
I live in NZ and my thoughts on guns are if you don't have one your alot less likely to be shot. I would much rather give up my stuff than be shot.
I have a LOT of guns & ammo. More than the average US prepper. I've owned guns for 50 years, been shooting guns for 60 years. I was a federal LEO for almost 4 years. Never once have been shot or shot another human.
My "stuff"? Food, water, meds, etc., not including guns/ammo (assuming I had no guns) - all are required for me to survive. I do value that stuff more than the life of someone trying to take the stuff from me, in part because they value my stuff more than my life and more than their life, or they would not be trying to take it from me when I am armed and trying to dissuade them from taking it from me.
You are entitled to your opinion and me to mine. I have not been to NZ - yet. But given what I have read about NZ, I probably would be ok with living on the south island with just a hunting rifle or two. I would prefer to also have a sidearm, even if it was just a revolver - I find them useful when hunting.
But the OP was about the "ideal", and for me, ideally I would have whatever arms I wish, and I would assert that I would not be endangered by them.
Maybe that that difference I do not prep because I'm not going risk my life to defend my stuff. And in NZ anyway its not so hard to be nomadic and live of the land.
Edit I do prepare knowledge and skills.
If I was half my age (I am nearing 70), didn't have bad spinal trauma and a heart/lung condition, I could ***maybe*** survive *without* permanent shelter, etc.
But I am not young or healthy. Plus I have family to care for who also have serious health conditions.
So I do what I can. Hopefully I will never have to rely on my own preps, but I believe that my family may have to after I pass on.
That said, being nomadic in a SHTF situation, is not optimum for most people, skills, knowledge, not withstanding.
“You may not be interested in war,” goes a line usually attributed to Leon Trotsky, “but war is interested in you.”
Thanks. Every day I go to work I pray for war
With unlimited money, gun permits are not a problem.
Probably not. I don't have the experience to say one way or another though. I assume the worst case scenario; that the gov would go by the letter of the law. That said, money does grease the wheels of bureaucracy, and there are things that can be done (investments in businesses) that make it easier for the gov to approve permits and even citizenship, which in turn would make gun ownership easier.
I’m gonna build a place in the Canary Islands. A little dry, but that can be managed. It’s an island so not easily accessible, good climate and plenty of sunshine to grow crops. I can’t think of any downsides really.
Some guy agreed to sell me some land on one of the islands for real cheap today. Still half a million, but that’s a third of what everyone else was asking a week before. Sent him a 20% non refundable deposit today. Told my boss to shove it and took a dump on his desk.
Can’t wait, it’s gonna be awesome.
This doesn't even sound real, how do you just meet someone that just owns part of an island?
That’s because he’s joking. 😁
(Google the recent news on La Palma Island.)
You can buy some small islands up in Canada for under 200k, I seen a 26 Acre island going for around 170k, fully wooded and untouched
Nice try fed boi
They gotta come around to get their tax money even if it's the end of the world.
Subway car in NYC. I would brick off both entrances and use a manhole for stealth entrance.
Leonardo, is that you???
>If money was no object
Money is **always** a limitation, even to Jeff Bezos.
Can you really think of **no** goals here on Earth to which the amount of money that one person -- or even nation -- can practically spend *isn't* an object?
Under the ice of an Antarctic island.
No fortress. Big ranch. Texas. If collapse is short, keep ranching. If collapse is long and TEOTWAWKI, take up migratory hunting and herding on the Great Plains.
Totally unrealistic, but the French government sells me land in the Kerguelen Islands and I build a giant concrete bunker with triple redundant everything, 10 years of fuel and water and food.
It’s about the most remote place in the world and only has a hundred or so scientists year round.
The only real problem is the only way to get there is via ocean going ship. It’s also super windy and pretty cold year round, although I think it will support sheep as some exist feral from a previous attempt at ranching them.
But it’s never going to get overrun, enough elevation to offset sea level rise, and it’s unlikely to be in the plume of any nuclear fallout or pollution.
I doubt you could buy/own land at any price there, especially buying from the French government. It's worthless land from any perspective beyond its remoteness, but it'd be like buying Guam. It's not for sale.
It's located in the "roaring 40s" -- a latitude where the wind blows hard nearly all the time. It would make the building project difficult. The environment is like sub arctic, and not much use besides marginal grazing.
Building the bunker to which I aspire would be a very expensive project just in construction logistics. It's hard to get there to begin with, I think the nearest mainland location is something like 2500 miles to South Africa. There is no port, just a few bays with marginal shelter for ferrying supplies inland in smaller boats. The French built a kind of half-assed dock/pier at Port aux France for this purpose.
The map makes it seem like with a truly giant investment, you might be able to construct some kind of dock/harbor in one of the bays/fjords which would have benefits in construction and supply. Which maybe long term could be used for permanently docking a ship to get you there and out of there if you decided to return to the mainland.
It's probably not viable as a permanent settlement because you can't really produce much food. You might be able to do some kind of fishing or aquaculture, sort out what kind of grazing you can do, but other than indoor/hydroponics, you're not growing anything.
And if you decide to leave, you need a serious ocean going ship. It's so remote that not even a $10 million dollar transoceanic yacht can make the trip, unless you find one capable of an endurance of something like 7000 mile trips without resupply. And some of this is just the weather/wind/ocean conditions in the roaring 40s.
But here I guess I'd just plan on never leaving and providing supplies for 10 years. After 10 years and modern life runs out, I'm not sure I'm interested in going pioneer/settler, TBH, even back in North America.
After 10 years, you starve.
Underground with a nuclear generator or two and an aquaponics system . (Where?) north (where North?)Nunaya Business￼
Buy a small island off the gulf coast.
I live in NZ and I do wonder when shtf how kind some of the locals will be to these people trespassing on their land
1. Year-round growing season with plenty of vegetable/fruit food sources.
2. Plenty of fresh water.
3. Enough animal life (either on land or in the sea) to make hunting/fishing sustainable.
If you have that, you can live indefinitely.
I already know where there is a bugout fortress that I can access within an hour drive. And the neat thing is, I don't need to build it. If I were to go to it, instead of bugging in, it means things are so F'd... like "The Walking Dead" level F'd.
On second thought, NOT New Zealand