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Bunker_Beans

Two films completely changed how I look at the relationship between humans and animals. One was *Earthlings*, the other was *Dominion*. These films also further cemented my disdain for the human race. On the plus side, these films did increase my compassion for the many innocent animals that are forced into giving their lives for a bunch of ungrateful, greedy slobs. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy the taste of meat. But after watching these films, I can no longer eat animal products without suffering immense guilt. We’re terrible to the many species we share this planet with. Absolutely terrible. And it’s disgusting. I’d recommend watching the films if you have the stomach for it. At the very least, you’ll gain insight into how the food you eat is treated before its suffering finally ends.


[deleted]

I agree wholeheartedly


Infernaladmiral

While I do sympathize with the animals about to be slaughtered, there's not much I can do about it. Even if I stop eating them,it doesn't mean much if only one person does it since there will be billions eating them on the other hand. But yeah I think I've never slaughtered one, neither do i enjoy seeing them die. But I don't have a grudge against people who slaughter the animals in the most humane way possible, painlessly.


iDiversal

there is no such thing as a painless death bro. I promise you the animals know what’s going on. I grew up on a cattle farm. They all know


Infernaladmiral

Not totally painless, I'd say but ending them in one blow is better than slowly killing them. There's a huge difference between them. I've seen some inhuman acts of people torturing the animal to death instead of slaughtering them normally.


Suspicious-Vegan-BTW

*normally* no such thing


iDiversal

And by your logic the world will never change. Yes you may only have a small impact but taking personal responsibility is always impactful. Also it’s much healthier to not eat meat due to the glycative properties of meat your body ages faster. I’m 24 I look 19 due to my diet that primarily avoids meat


Infernaladmiral

I've not looked up or researched much about meat and veggies but I don't think that stopping the consumption of protein is a good idea.


iDiversal

LMAO. No offence man but you’re really uneducated. Go research Dr Nun Amen Ra. He’s a world record holding bodybuilder who is vegan. Believe it or not meat isn’t the only protein on earth. 😂 in fact vegans actually get more amino acids in their protein sources such as pea protein so it’s objectively better


Infernaladmiral

Whoah didn't know that not knowing a body builder can make one uneducated. I guess pursuing Physics is useless in this day and age. Honestly biology was never my forte. But I do agree that vegans live longer and have a lower risk of heart disease.


iDiversal

And I’m not being a dick or just tryna insult you just pointing out that you clearly aren’t educated in the field of nutritional science, I’m sure you are educated in other fields. I promise you vegan diet is superior nutrients wise. I look much younger than the average person my age due to my lesser consumption of meat as well


Infernaladmiral

Well good for you! Personally,I really don't care about 1-2 years or even 10 yrs being subtracted from my life. Plus I don't really consume meat that much,only chicken several times a month. Even a vegan can die in a car accident or literally anywhere else. Can't be too sure about that. But hey you do you! I don't have anything against meat eaters or vegans,in all honesty. But yeah I do find it annoying when people force their ideals on one another.


LittleMoffle

Eating animals is fine. Farming animals is fucked up


iDiversal

By eating meat you’re exploiting the weak - you’re essentially complacent in beautiful kind animals having their throats slit. You may never realise it - but it’s actually disgusting. And vegans live much longer I can assure you


LittleMoffle

I'm always going to eat meat. Tbh if it were up to me I'd just rather be hunting animals myself. At least i know they had a fair chance, and lived properly until then. I don't agree with farming, not even industrial farming of plants tbh. Large portions of natural forest/ rainforest are cut down and biodiversity reduced to whatever is in demand at that point. Vegan substitutes contribute in their own way to the reduction of the rainforest to grow for palm oils and such, as well as exploitation of the people in those countries. Sames true for meat too though, takes up far more space to grow food just to feed the animals, plus room to graze. Imo the real problem is overpopulation, animals our size aren't meant to break the predator prey cycle and in doing so and constantly expanding were running into problem after problem. I admire vegans, they make their choice and more power to them, they do help. But nothing in capitalist society is exploitation free, to humans or animals. Among those who still support a carnivorous lifestyle id like to see much less waste, so much meat getting binned, off-cuts never being bought etc. Hell we probably have enough cows and sheep being killed to clothe the world in natural leather (maybe not)


Wit-Of-Knit

👏👏👏 Also, no one will know that I am vegan unless they hang out with me for a while. It is a philosophy, not a personality trait.


Internauta29

I agree, accept that and overall don't care. In doing all of this I prove your point, you're welcome.


iDiversal

Lol at least you’re honest in your evil.


Carliios

but you literally eat fish?


Asrealasrealcanbe

you really have to come to terms with the fact that all life on this planet feeds on other life. life is literally suffering.. nothing will ever change that. morality is all a human construct and humans being the dominant creatures on this chaotic planet make all the rules.


graevmaskin

I might be wrong here, but to me it seems that humans actually have a choice. We have a choice based on all the knowledge we have gathered across millennia. Why? Because we have learned, and very well I might add, how to eat a balanced diet. We have learned which nutrients we need and we also know how much of it we need to stay healthy. There is no randomness in as to why humans were smaller built a few hundred years ago. Consuming plants cost less energy than consuming animals at zero loss of nutritional value, if done properly. Where did all the factory animals find the energy to grow so big? We feed them the best plants! Humans, like birds, are omnivores which means we can digest both plants and flesh. Birds, as far as I know, do not build huge factories where they breed their cattle and send them to slaughter. Actually, there is no other species in the entirety of the animal kingdom that comes even close to doing so. All the other little critters scattered across our planet have been devouring each other since before human history. Why? Because they do not have a choice. But we do.


Bunker_Beans

A lot of people don’t realize that their large appetite for meat was put in their minds by a massive industry that is trying to sell as much product as possible.


graevmaskin

I know. The economy is morse or less dependent on advertisement. The animal industry is not at all happy with being challenged by plant based substitutes either. We had a big court case here in Sweden a couple years back. One company called Oatly was taken to court for using the phrase "Milk, but made for humans". The danish owned company that filed the lawsuit pumped a lot of money into it's own ad-campaign which backlashed and Oatly increased their sales by almost 50%. They lost the case in court though. In France they passed a law stating that products not containing meat may not be called sausages. There are more examples I could bring up, but this definitely shows that the meat and dairy industry are not particularly interested in being challenged for market shares. They most likely want business as usual and they spend a lot of PR money making people believe that the animals they own are being treated well and with dignity. This is of course inherently false.


[deleted]

I think the key thing is my friend…that it doesn’t fucking matter. Why do you care that we have a choice? It’s irrelevant, animals are simply existing and we take from them because we can. So what? Why is that something that needs to stop? Because all the animal species are gonna become extinct or something (they won’t)? Why care? You will die just like the rest of us, why devote part of your energy to defending something that never asked to be defended and never will? I’ll tell you why; virtue signalling


graevmaskin

I also used to suffer deeply from existential anxiety and from time to time I still do. What is the point of anything when one day my body will cease to uphold itself and all the parts that make me to what I am suddenly cease to exist? The entire cosmos will meet the same fate at some point, when all energy has been spent and nothing moves any longer. The end of time. The problem, as I see it, lies within the system that we constructed ourselves. Living in this technological age is totally devoid of meaning and creates almost zero fulfillment for each one of us. I have worked many meaningless jobs and I still do, just for the sake of survival. If I was not a social being, which most of us are really, I would go total hermit somewhere and take my chances with nature. Humans are social creatures and that is one of the key points to our success as a species. Some anthropologists think this is why sapiens bested our cousins, the neanderthal, who we all know went extinct. I struggle each day with finding any meaning in anything I do. I think our ancestors did to. Some of them though, did gift us with findings that enabled the betterment of society. The betterment of life. I keep going because this dream is still alive within me. The dream of a better society and a better world. I have absolutely no way of telling if it is possible or not, but on the other hand, i cannot stop imagining what could be done with all that money all nations combined spend annually on building and researching weapons. The money and resources are there and they were there all the time! If any person truly believes all is lost, it will also become true. For the sake of yourself and the state you are in, try to conquer the urge not to fail. If you are willing to take chances and fail, you are one step in the right direction. If you truly believe you cannot succeed you are creating a self fulfilling prophecy. I hope you can find meaning in your life! I sincerely believe that we would reach the next level of consciousness if we treated animals with respect and stopped this meaningless slaughter. Just a few centuries ago, humans could not believe that a world without slavery could exist. Now it does.


Bunker_Beans

Apply this line of thinking to yourself. If someone is bigger and smarter than you, then that gives them the right to take whatever they want from you, and you should not be able to do shit about it. If might makes right and you are less mighty, then you are cannon fodder. Plain and simple. Also, I am not sure if you are aware of it or not, but feed animals do not possess the ability to ask a human for help. I mean, I have never met a cow that can speak a human language. Have you?


[deleted]

I literally want to die dude…like I’m all over the depression Reddit and now I’m here. I don’t really care about life, human or animal. Yes I am aware that I am a worthless chunk of meat just like the animals you are defending. I think you misplace where I’m coming from. They don’t need your help man, there’s no way for you to even know if they want it or appreciate it, it’s pointless. You are trying to save worthless meat


Bunker_Beans

I once struggled with depression. It is not an easy battle to fight, but it is possible to overcome. It just takes time, energy, commitment, and research. In my opinion, a large part of your problem may be the views that you hold. For if you do not value the life of any living thing, then how can you possibly find any happiness. You are essentially classifying yourself as worthless, and that is a difficult headspace to occupy. Also, get off of the depression sub. Do not wallow with others in misery. Your environment will have an affect on you. Now I cannot help you find a sense of self-worth, nor can I help you find worth in other living things. But consider this: the universe is vast and there are a lot of unknowns. That means that anything is possible. You could be infinitely meaningless or infinitely meaningful. It is beyond our ability to know. If you choose to accept this idea, then you can exist as a life form that is both meaningful and meaningless. That is a lot better than believing that you are entirely meaningless. Wouldn’t you say? Additionally, I suggest reading a broad range of books dealing with a variety of philosophical ideas, especially stoicism. There’s a great book by William B. Irvine called, *A Guide to the Good Life: The Ancient Art of Stoic Joy.* It is definitely worth reading. I would also suggest reading books about Buddhism. Sadhguru’s lectures are also worth hearing. He can be found on YouTube. The bulk of humanity may be trash, but there are people who have existed/exist that have devoted their lives to the betterment of the human species. Find these people and devour their knowledge. Getting over depression is tough but doable. I hope this helps. Best of luck.


Raix12

Appeal to futility fallacy.


lnfinity

There are people in the world who see suffering all around and choose to do nothing or even support it, and there are those who see suffering all around and choose to do what they can to lessen it. OP is trying to do the latter, and I would agree that all good people ought to.


saganist91

Civilization is very successful in hiding this fact that all life feeds on other life. Imagine having to hunt down your own food.


Death-Knight9025

Technically nature makes the rules, which is why people die to tornadoes and tsunamis a lot. Plus the whole “morality is a human construct” sounds more like an excuse to do more bad stuff but that’s just me.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Raix12

How does that matter? We shouldn't base our actions on the actions of wild animals.


Death-Knight9025

Even though we kinda are wild animals….. Besides, usually with arguments like this, it’s good to point out certain things if it contributes to someone’s claim.


Bunker_Beans

Did you know that dogs will lick each others’ privates without asking? It’s not called rape or sexual misconduct. It’s called being an animal. This article by *The Atlantic* is beyond dumb. They’re trying to attribute manmade concepts and terms to a species that likely has zero understanding of either. This reminds of the time a feminist told me that female animals secrete vaginal liquid before sex to make the rape more bearable. And she was taught this in college. This is how stupid people have become. This is why dumb shit like this is published and spread around, as if it has any merit.


Different_Credit4828

Ducks too! That's why I enjoy eating them especially


Aggrestis

You are not better than them.


fruitloombob

This subreddit has a odd tendency of attracting vegan loons. OH NO, ONE ANIMAL IS EATING ANOTHER ANIMAL AHHHHH!


lnfinity

Perhaps your ire should be directed toward those who overlook the suffering of others that we can do something about, and who resort to name-calling to avoid defending their views with reason.


Bunker_Beans

Your comment makes you sound ignorant. And I believe you made it because you are ignorant. Nobody here is demanding that anybody give up meat. But if you think that the suffering inflicted upon the many animals that inhabit this planet is warranted, then you obviously haven’t looked into the subject very deeply. We’re single handedly destroying the environment we depend upon and for what? So that we can have meat three times a day and some cheap palm oil. There are some vegan loons out there. That much is true. But if you peered behind the veil and saw how we really treat our "less-intelligent" brothers and sisters, you may find yourself both appalled and horrified. Heck, you may even become a vegan loon yourself. This isn’t about animals eating other animals. It’s about how we go about it. And we go about it in the most disrespectful and irresponsible way possible.


generic-ghost-

This one is especially loony cuckoo dizzy dork


[deleted]

This lonesome loon is going on launching his sperg bombs on everyone not swallowing his gospel.


generic-ghost-

I think it’s called… the cycle of life. But what do I know I’m just a selfish psychopath


Bunker_Beans

Cycle of life? Nowhere on Earth will you find the same level of death and destruction being carried out by one species. What we are doing is beyond natural.


Aggrestis

This problem was caused by agriculture and overpopulation resulting from it.


[deleted]

I think of animals the same way I think of humans, we are all disposable and useless. None of us matter, so the idea that we should stop killing animals to me is absolutely hilarious. Like you do realize that deep inside the only reason you’re fighting this battle for these creatures that don’t even care if you win or lose, is because you want to feel good about yourself. I truly think that anyone who advocates for “animal rights” is a virtue signaling idiot.


Bunker_Beans

If you’re so disposable and useless, then why bother living?


[deleted]

It’s a lot harder to push yourself to that very edge than you know man, a lot harder. Would you come kill me? That would help a lot


Bunker_Beans

Trust me, I know. I used to be suicidal. I even went as far as to procure a tank of helium, which I intended to use. See, inert gas displaces oxygen in your lungs. You breathe it in, pass out, then suffocate. It’s supposedly painless. Long story short, I did not go through with it. I chose instead to get proactive and change the way I thought about myself and my life. I realized that I was spending more time figuring out how to end my life instead of how to improve it. I apologize if what I said offended you. I do not condone suicide. I do not wish you harm, either. I was merely offended by your shallow comment since I am one of those "virtue signaling idiots." As someone who has suffered and knows how terrible it feels to do so, I have developed compassion for those who also suffer, whether they are human or not.


iDiversal

Lol I don’t care about ‘feeling good about myself’ I barely even have a self to begin with. I just know right from wrong


[deleted]

Right and wrong should be factual, like 2+3 is 5, that’s right, and 2+4 is 7, that’s wrong. I refuse to accept that certain things are just right and certain things are just wrong based on societal norms, and based on what you or others say. Killing animals and harvesting them is useful, keeping them around can also be useful. But why bother with trying to save them? I mean I just genuinely struggle with what you get out of it. Keeping animals as pets, that’s a use, if you have a fuckin cow that’s yours and you take care of it, I’m not gonna tell you to kill it. But you can’t keep every animal in your backyard, if they don’t have a use then we eat them that’s how it should be. And yes I’m aware that wanting to preserve animal life isn’t a societal norm, but it’s a trend that I see going upward.


[deleted]

No it does not. Humans are omnivores. We survived the Ice age because of meat. Nature is a cycle of eating and being eaten. I would say you are more mentally disturbed by seeing the consumption of non-human flesh as disturbing. Animals are not elevated to our level of consciousness. Our interpretations of respect etc. Do not apply to them.


Bunker_Beans

"Animals are not elevated to our level of consciousness." Name one animal that will stand there and let you inflict suffering upon it without reacting. I’ll wait.


[deleted]

Keep waiting till you're dead buddy. I don't care for your drivel. I'll gladly consume animals.


Bunker_Beans

Can’t name one? I thought so. It’s now obvious that you’re perfectly content with talking out of your ass. Enjoy being small-minded for the rest of your life. People like you give this sub a reason to exist.


[deleted]

You should know. You seem to have more experience in being this inbred.


Bunker_Beans

Dang. You got me. I’m the product of years of inbreeding. I’m actually so horrendously deformed from all the inbreeding that I can’t even leave the goddamn house. I honestly couldn’t tell you the last time I felt the warmth of the sun on my skin. And yet, despite this horrendous deformity and the pain that it has caused my family, I can’t stop getting my mother and sister pregnant. I’m hopeless.


SquirrelQueenSabrina

I personally would let an animal that was starving eat me so it coule survive. Its only fair but I'm not going to stop eating meat. You wouldn't ask a lion to stop the places that have tried to veganize animals those animals usually succumb to malnourishment. Don't guilt shame other people for eating like everyone and every carnivore on this planet does. I do believe people should be more comfortable becoming food for other animals to be more fair on the foodchain though


Raix12

Doesn't matter. We shouldn't base our actions on the actions of other animals.


SquirrelQueenSabrina

I also dont think being a vegan helps though. Were already passed the point of no return and slaughtered animals die quicker than we will because of the pollution and destruction of earth we've brought


Raix12

It does help. By not buying animal products you're lowering the demand for them. Lower demand means less production and less animals tortured. It also means a smaller impact on climate change. And sure, one person going vegan doesn't matter too much, but millions of people like that certainly do. Especially considering that it's not just a one time thing but a lifetime worth of choices. Also if you go vegan, you may have an impact on other people and make them vegan too.


SquirrelQueenSabrina

I personally want to help ensure we do die. Yes many species will die with us but I'm not sure multicellular life was meant to be anyways


Raix12

Climate change wouldnt ever be able to eradicate all life. There are always going to exist organisms able to adapt. Multicellular life is probably going to exist until the death of our Sun (so the next few billions of years).


SquirrelQueenSabrina

Then there will always be suffering


Raix12

True. But that doesn't mean we should add more to it. Every single individual saved from suffering matters.


SquirrelQueenSabrina

I think death is the only true end of suffering honestly. That's probably why I've got so many near death experiences and suicide attempts on record. I'm too much of a failure to successfully die though so i decided next time I'm going to ensure i do


Raix12

It's honestly highly unlikely that you are a failure. It's just the unrealistic expections that people want you to meet, but you can't (because well... they are unrealistic), so screw them. And it's true that not existing equals being free of suffering, but if you're going to die anyway one day, why not try to see what else awaits you in life, free of toxicity from people who want to put you down?


Bunker_Beans

If everyone behaves as though we are past the point of no return, then we will find ourselves past the point of no return.


SquirrelQueenSabrina

I think everyone might be. I accept that I'm nothing more than a burden at this point


Bunker_Beans

If you are a burden it is because you choose to view yourself as such.


SquirrelQueenSabrina

Its because im mentally ill and too far gone to be helped. Suicide really just is mercy for some people and i believe i fall in that group


Bunker_Beans

If you look at the behavior of most people, nearly everyone could be classified as mentally ill in some way or another.


SquirrelQueenSabrina

I am mentally ill to the point of flashbacks blackouts and uncontrollable lash outs. Its just best if i die now


Bunker_Beans

You’re being kind of hard on yourself, no?


nyarlathotep999

Nom nom nom nom *burp* mmmm mmmm good


iDiversal

This comment is proof enough that meat eaters are less intelligent than vegetarians


nyarlathotep999

Me no stupider than leaf chewers! Faster too! Cow faster than tree!


iDiversal

This comment is proof enough that meat eaters are less intelligent than vegetarians


Death-Knight9025

This pandemic was caused by some dude eating a bat yes, but I don’t know how a man being forced to eat a nocturnal creature and indirectly causing a global pandemic correlates to “meat bad, never eat meat.” Like there are a lot of reasons to hate on people, many of them good reasons, but keep in mind that like half the planet is populated by meat eating animals who would quite possibly go all vampire on herbivores, without even killing them first, so just because we, as a species, like to eat meat does not mean eating meat is bad. Like, I can respect being vegan, it takes a lot of focus and commitment to choose to consume food that didn’t come from an animal, and the idea of being vegan seems really noble. However it is a stretch to say eating meat is somehow immoral when there’s several species on the planet that eat specifically meat and meat only, so you’d have to vilify lions or even penguins cause they, guess what: eat meat.


Margidoz

>half the planet is populated by meat eating animals who would quite possibly go all vampire on herbivores, without even killing them first This happens regardless of the 70 billion we create and harm separately >However it is a stretch to say eating meat is somehow immoral when there’s several species on the planet that eat specifically meat and meat only, so you’d have to vilify lions or even penguins cause they, guess what: eat meat I don't see how it's a stretch They're bound by necessity, we're frequently not They're not comparable contexts


saganist91

It is mind boggling how detached humans have become from nature. I love civilization and the ease of everything, and I am an omnivore/meat eater but take something like eating a ham sandwich for example. It is such a casual, everyday thing we dont even think about. Pigs have been raised in probably quite horrible conditions just so we cold enjoy their meat for the cheapest price possible. Out of sight, out of mind and so on. In the past we could actually witness the animals being raised and slaughtered before stuffing them into our mouths, I am sure we were more grateful for meat in those days. I don't see meat eating ever stopping. If there is demand for something there will always be supply.


Uridoz

Why don't you stop eating meat then? There's tons of people online and websites who are offering you their help if you reach out.


Futuretapes

When did you stop eating meat?


iDiversal

I still eat fish and will be quitting soon but I haven’t eaten chicken and beef in 3 years


Lucky_Plan7855

Agreed 100%


Depressing-Pessimist

And if you decide to go hunt down human(aka another animal) you get jailed 😒


SweetHallucination

I feel you. I think more funds should be allocated on artificial meat production research