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eminemcrony

This thread is going to be updated with any additional tweets or comments by 343 on the system when/if they happen. Copying my stickied comment from a previous thread below. --- Just to summarize the implications of the changes: * You get a consistent 50XP for playing games. Before you got 100XP for the first few games, which eventually scaled down to 50XP, and then later less than 50XP (if you managed to finish all the games to get that XP in the first place) * Weekly challenges are far easier now, the hard ones were adjusted/removed, and they properly track now. For reference my weeklies currently are cap a flag, kill three enemies in slayer, play a stockpile match, and kill 15 enemies in PvP. There may still be more specific ones thrown in but by-and-large they're more generalized now. My personal opinion: >!the XP lost from those first few games of match XP should be more than made up for by the easier weeklies, and past that point you're getting more match XP regardless. 343 have said this is a temporary bandaid fix while they make changes to the system (like I believe performance-based match XP), and leveling up seems much quicker and better than before. I'm not saying this is perfect. I'm just including this blurb because I see many people focusing on the lost XP from the first few games, when in general everyone should be getting more XP from this.!<


fleetze

I'm still getting challenges involving the wraith tank. Which at least as of my btbs today the spawn rate doesn't seem to be any different-that is I'm not seeing them. That's fine since we don't really need to do the challenges this week but if it doesn't change those are going to require a challenge swap in the future. They still kept the "flatten with a repulsor" challenge as well, just reduced needed kills to 1. I've already taught myself a few methods to do it but it's going to frustrate a lot of players and I usually go out of my way to get it done. A lot of the issue with the weeklies is the fomo around the weekly cosmetic. They could throw it into the middle of the challenges somewhere - say after doing 10-weeklies the capstone unlocks to be completed. That way one single problem roll on the weekly's doesn't lock you up completely until you get it done, but instead locks up one of your slots still tempting you to use the swap but not messing you up completely if you can do the other tasks.


Donnie-G

There needs to be some maps/modes with a proper tank spawn. In my BtB experience, Scorpion/Wraiths only show up if the match draws out. Stockpile and Control are usually fairly quick, though I had a weird Stockpile match where the power cells glitched and dropped into that big AA turret thing and were completely unreachable. That match drew out like mad since there was exactly enough cells for one team to win, and eventually the pelicans just kept dropping off Wraiths/Scorpions.


docdrazen

That glitch happened to me, except there wasn't enough cells for either team to win and it happened in sudden death. So the match was just in purgatory until everyone quit out. It was wild.


NathanielHudson

It’s weird to me that sudden death isn’t very… sudden. I’ve had matches go for a *long* time post-sudden-death announcement.


Bri-The-Li

I've got a 5 kills with wraith challenge and I've only seen the wraith spawn in with time left once. I've had heavy vehicles being dropped in for the first time in the last 10 seconds of most BTB games so far, which is nonsensical.


iMightBeWright

With the help of /u/JBL_17 and /u/theEpicPineapple , this is my math to compare the Old Dailies vs the Nov 18th Dailies: http://imgur.com/a/SjqlL5B Once you get into Practice Makes Perfection 10+, it becomes win-based, so my table just extends the XP gain from PMP 9 for visual continuity. **Findings: from matches 11 to 19, new XP gain bobs between 150 and 50 fewer XP. From 20 on, the PMP 10+ challenges become win-based, so it becomes sort of an incongruent comparison. For guaranteed XP gain, however, matches 20+ are better than having to get wins, imo. It's also important to note the easier weeklies are going to help in XP progression faster than before.** Edit: added additional context per updated weeklies Edit 2: revised a mistake I made in my table formatting


Matictac

I was hoping someone had done the math. The change to 50XP seemed like a bit of a sidestep to actually address the problem, though combined with easier weekly's I suppose it's better overall.


AntiAttorney

It feels faster even if it’s not


Matictac

Probably a bit of psychology behind that haha. Hopefully with the updates to weekly challenges we're getting ahead overall. I think they should add a second repeating challenge that gives 50XP for a win. 50XP for a loss and 100XP total for a win seems good to me, until there's a total overhaul anyway.


AntiAttorney

Oh yea totally. If you see the moving bar as opposed to a rock.


DMF51

At practice makes perfection 12 it used to become wjn 3 matches and 13 was win 4 matches


ICODE72

"To better serve players of all skills" bro skill has nothing to do with challenges that require you play a mode that the matchmaking is just not giving you.


Benti86

Having to play modes the playlists don't give you and now objective modes are usually just straight up not fun. I have played 3 rounds of capture the flag today. All 3 games barely anyone outside of me attempted to cap the flag on my team. The only times my team capped the flag was when I hauled it 90% of the way across the map and then I died and then they just took it and scored the points. Then I played BTB. Got stockpile on high-power. Secure the drop on the cliff. Throw all the seeds off to my team's side and then died. Maybe 1-2 guys actually went for the seeds...


dafighder

Had a game go to a tie. We were at 0-0. Finally out of some luck, they decided to drive a mongoose directly to their base, steal it and drive directly back uninterrupted. Most bizarre shit.


EaterOfPenguins

I actually love objective games in Halo, and have had pretty good luck with 4v4 games mostly (although, like you, I'm aggressively focused on the objective itself) but I'm with you on btb objective modes like stockpile for sure. Almost uniformly my team doesn't give a shit about the objective on big team.


Ed_Thatch

It’s hilarious how this is THE EXACT SAME feedback people gave on progression in the flights and that wasn’t changed at all. Like what did they expect?


Chilidawg

I suspect a lot of game developers push out a really greedy monetization system early on purpose. Then they are able to scale back to a moderately greedy monetization system after everyone complains. That way the greed is presented as generosity. It's like that sales trick of putting a way overpriced item next to a slightly overpriced item to make people think item 2 is a deal.


Woo-bin

They want to see how much they can get away with before accepting what the community will actually take


Rockyrock1221

Bingo. Business 101 It’s like say you have a product you believe is worth around 50$. You mark the price as 100$. Then slash that out and put “50% off!” In red text To make it seem more enticing to the customer who thinks they’re getting a sweet deal.


MethodicallyDeep

It’s that illegal in some countries? Like what Bethesda did with their Santa pack in the FO76 shop? Correct me if I’m wrong


Finaldeath

It is illegal if it is always at that discount price, most of those laws let it slide if it goes up to "full price" every now and then. You can see this in action all the fucking time on the switch eshop, quite a few shovelware games on there are on sale almost every second since they got released except once every week or two it goes back to full price for a day or two. I stopped looking at the switch eshop sale section just because of this, all you would see whenever you looked at it was the same 20 "games" that have been on sale every time you looked for the last 3 years before you would see any games ACTUALLY on sale.


Hoenirson

Yeah, this happens all the time.


banevasionac

Don't need to be suspicious. It's just a correct observation. The industry literally hires psychologists to tune their systems to maximize profitability.


StudlyPenguin

I like to think the suits upstairs ignored the beta feedback. Then, the frustrated developers hauled ass to release multiplayer early so they could gather all of our shouts and cries and force the suits’ hands before December 8th. Now they have leverage against the suits: “fuck boss we gotta fix this or nobody’s gonna buy your campaign.” To be clear I’m not disagreeing with you. I just like to think the developers managed to stage a rebellion and we’re all part of it. edit: punctuation is hard


NicCagedd

Word on that. I've already seen people run around the level 100 rewards. The games been out for three days, no way did someone legitimately get to that without buying levels.


ForgiLaGeord

Presumably they expected the general public to care less than the hardcore fans who played the tech previews. Pretty big gamble, I'd say, but obviously I have the benefit of hindsight.


Stopthelemurs

They gambled, and bet that people would get over it. Obviously the backlash was bigger than they thought.


KoalasaurusRexxx

Just played two matches. Challenges aren't so ridiculous now. Finished 2 with no extra effort, plus the match XP. 500xp in two games. That was considerably more satisfying. eta: Sorry for the sideways pic, but for anyone curious/still at work/can't look yet, here's what challenges seem to look like now. Also had one for 3 melee kills and 10 assists before a couple of these. http://imgur.com/gallery/BPubHyI


TheGreatValoo

Exactly, and we have to remember that this isn't what it is going to be like permanently. They are still working on the system and made this as a quick fix.


tomerz99

Whether it's a quick fix or not, it never should have needed to be done anyways. They had this feedback almost a year ago now, and still decided to test the waters without a backup plan for release. Now we have to play 20 games a day just to get a single tier? If you ask me, the bandaid should've been 100-200exp per match minimum.


TheGreatValoo

I definitely understand and agree that it should have been fixed sooner. Like you said, they had this feedback during the flights. However everyone seems to forget that you will complete the other challenges by just playing the game now. They don't seem as specific as they were before. So sure, if you somehow don't complete the other challenges along the way, then you will need 20 games to level up. And I do understand that after all the weekly challenges are completed you will need to play those 20 games, but hopefully that is something that is fixed after they have worked on the new progression they are talking about


AlerionOP

If it was 200 per match I would complete the pass before the game fully launches. 100 would be best imo but I am sure this is fine for now.


Meowcat88

Good to hear. Now if they just add performance based XP I could live with it


JustA-RedPotato

Exactly just finished a capture the flag match with a capture and 20 kills and earned less XP then my match before with less kills and less objective participation. All because I completed a challenge.


cakeharry

The new challenges seem more like Reaches challenges so I'm happy, although I wanna see more challenges with broad criteria like for example:"get 10 kills with unsc weapons or banished weapons".


BatmansShavingcream

Wow. Those challenges are…really good actually. It’s still a band-aid fix, but that was a lot quicker than I was expecting.


thedrunkentendy

I used swaps on challenges already and they wiped out all the ones that were half completed. I'm glad they added more but wtf?


klausbarton

I’m also wondering about this. Will my swaps be refunded? Some I received from the season pass purchase, so it’s either lost money (me) or lost time (others who didn’t boost to level 25). In both instances, that’s pretty crummy even if this is officially a beta.


thedrunkentendy

No refund as of right now lol. But overall challenges are easier but I had used it to get a better challenge to originally finish the weekly.


PleaseRecharge

Your swaps and my money that I spent before they reduced the store price for coins and the BP are in the same boat. No refund.


pen-ross-gemstone

did we just get the ol’ monkeys paw


JerikTheWizard

Yes https://forums.halowaypoint.com/t/you-currently-get-less-experience-from-playing-games-after-the-progression-update/18019


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DeathGP

I would like a 100 for a win but 50 kinda good. It's a 6 month season so I think 50 would be good for a flat rate.


Evil-Cetacean

maybe 100 for a win is more fair than 100 flat for just playing, kinda like halo 3, if you win the match you get rewarded if not you still do for just playing just a little lower edit: nvm after reading some comments i’d say 100xp for playing and 150xp for winning


ColdAsHeaven

Look at [this](https://i.redd.it/8mamk6ckfe081.jpg) The old system for dailies was significantly better. They actively slowed you down. Doesn't matter it's 6 months or 3. You shouldn't be expected to play 25 matches a day for 6 months to complete a Battle Pass


DeathGP

That's excluding the fact that weekly challenges are much easier to complete, you can't base a graph on dailies without including weekly challenges


Jayce800

Plus the daily challenge eventually required you to win games, whereas this should be always just completing them, unless I have that wrong?


masternoob654

Nope, I had the Practice Makes Perfect 11 and it still required to play games, 5 to be precise


Jayce800

I got at least above 13 and remember seeing something about winning games.


AftermaThXCVII

And when you run out of weeklies, which many people did in a day or two? See the problem yet?


Karinfuto

By the time you complete the weeklies, wouldn't you already have hundreds of XP already gained? From what I can tell, the weeklies are bot-levels of easy and can be completed in the first day. Treat them like a weekly XP boost that can be completed in 4 days or less, because that should more than make up for the XP you lose in the first 20 of the day. Granted this fix is two steps forward, one step back. Not a huge fix, but 343i claims to work on more changes down the line.


Venusaurite

I don't really like tying progression to wins IMO should be based on individual performance. That way I get rewarded for playing well but won't be bothered if my team sucks.


DeathGP

I do agree with medals also awarding exp but winning should have also have a reward on its own.


Drpeppercalc

I disagree. It's a team game.


fanciestmango

This guy Halos.


Venusaurite

Assuming their matchmaking algorithm is perfect (otherwise it hurts solo queuers and encourages pub stompers), it still would encourage players to quit/not try if their team is obviously going to lose. Individual performance would encourage players to be at their best at any point in the game. People would be less upset if they were thrown into a losing match mid game too with individual performance. All while rewarding the worst player on the winning team better than the best on the losing team, which to me seems unfair. Also it’s not always a team game, that system would just not work for FFA types and Infection.


Anarchyz11

Why not both? I'm not a fan of Reach's entire progression system, but the way it awarded exp was best. Based on performance, winning, and time.


T0M95

Currently seeing an issue where no challengers are progressing at all. Got to 4 out of 5 Sidekick kills and they stopped tracking. Also not tracking completing a Total Control match.


HaMM4R

I’ve had this several times also


T0M95

seems to have been a small blip, it's tracking again now.


StopItTickles

I've got the same issue, shade turret kills not counting


RickJames_SortsbyNew

I made a spreadsheet for an over-simplified EXP system to use as an example for the style or approach I'd like to see implemented. I'm curious what others' thoughts are on something like this. Essentially, you'd be rewarded with EXP for finishing the match, for earning medals relevant to the game mode, and for performing well in the match for the game mode's play style. I looked at some average data for myself and threw it in to get ballpark numbers for per match EXP. And I multiplied all EXP x1 for social and x1.5 for ranked because ranked game play should be encouraged. I only did this for slayer and for KoH because I couldn't find or remember scoring numbers for other game modes so easily. Here's the breakdown: * Win = 100 EXP * Lose = 50 EXP * Kill = 1 EXP (extra 1 EXP if hill kill or kill on hill) * Assist = 1 EXP * Hill time = 0.1 EXP (so, 10 hill points is 1 EXP) * Syle medals = 1 EXP * Multikill & spree medals = 2 EXP (slayer only) Using numbers from my 22 games played, I would average about 100 EXP per match, which is obviously double what 343i is giving to players per match with this recent update, but it seems we all feel strongly that better play should be rewarded better. What do yall think?


packy17

A couple things: 1. I don't really see how the 50xp per match is functionally different from the previous system. Instead of playing 2 games for 100xp, 3 games for 150xp or 4 for 200xp, all this change does is grant you the xp a little sooner. Sure, this makes xp boosts somewhat more usable, but otherwise it's the same thing. 2. The new weeklies seem better so far, but why can't they all be active at once? Depending on which four you have active, you may still be forced into playing game types you aren't in the mood for. I know there are still changes to come, but this seems like one of the easier changes to make.


Ratabat

The answer to your #2: artificial barriers to keep you playing longer


DustyF3d0r4

Also they wouldn’t be able to sell you a 4th challenge slot with the battle pass.


TiffTumbles

Wait, is that actually in the BP?


DustyF3d0r4

Yeah F2P players can only complete three challenges at the same time, but if you buy the battle pass it unlocks the fourth challenge slot.


TiffTumbles

Well then. That seems a little... uhh... odd. I do wish I could just work towards all the challenges at once. Might make them feel a little more natural.


Ratabat

Oh my god I didn’t even know about this, that’s incredibly annoying


RocinanteLOL

Yep, the way the current system works you likely need to either play one day a week all day or play nearly every day for a couple matches to complete them all. 100% this is to satisfy some concurrent players stat benchmarks for executives.


TheHumdeeFlamingPee

As far as your first point goes, the main benefit I see, is that if I finish the night with my daily only partially completed, I would have just lost that xp. Now I will at least get something for those matches. I’m hoping that will at least somewhat make up for the lesser reward on those first few games.


Stickynote20

Well the previous system gave you diminishing returns as it was a flat 150 I believe for increasingly more matches. This give you immediate XP all the time.


Retro_Edge

I wish I could create its own topic about this so it gets the right attention that it deserves, but the stupid auto bots won't let me, so here it is until it's buried under comments in a couple of hours. **The new system is not better, it's actually worse for everyone not playing hours of Halo each day, here's some math** So, before the change you've got: 100XP for games 1 through 3 300XP total after 3 games 100XP for games 4 and 5 100XP for games 6 and 7 500XP total after 7 games 100XP for games 8 and 9 600XP total after 9 games in the old system. It now takes 12 games to get 600 match XP. But it used to take 12 games to get 750XP. So break even point for match XP is now 18 games played **per day** at 900XP. You don't pull ahead of the old system until game **22** on each day. We're talking hours and hours. As soon as those fresh and slightly tweaked weeklies (I still have the same BS with destroying an airship with an airship and Banshee challenges) dry up you're right back where you started. I'm sorry but 343i is trying to fool you, 50XP per match is not better.


filthydank_2099

Here’s how I’d format match XP: 75XP for a loss 100 for a tie 150 XP for a win 25XP for every stacking 5 kills per match (15 kills = 75XP gained) 10XP for every stacking 5 assists (7 assists = 10XP) 50XP for 5-10 kills medals (Spree, Frenzy) and weapon/vehicle/play type niche medals (Splattered, No Scope, Beat Down, etc) 100XP for 10+ kills medals (Running Riot and up) 50XP per objective point/incremental objective score total (Caps, Secures, etc) No need to get X kills with X weapon or vehicle etc


jakehubb0

THANK YOU. Im seeing no one mention this. Thank you for actually doing the math. Stop praising 343 for this. It’s a bs way to make people think they’re better off now


Doccmonman

You’re completely ignoring that weeklies are actually achievable now though. You *do* rank up much faster now. That’s really all that needed to happen until the more permanent fix.


tluther01

such a great game going to be killed by making it so unrewarding


WifiTacos

50 xp 😐


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Ommageden

You need to buy boosts or get them from Pringles codes.


Sloppy_Goldfish

Still no extra incentive to try to win the game though. Should be an additional challenge that says "Win a Game: 100 XP" or something.


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TheEpicPineapple

Doing the math with the old XP chart says that this new system of 50XP per match only breaks even with the old system after around 27 matches. While challenges are easier and offset that considerably (I just got like 500XP for a match I played), I think 100XP for a match, regardless of Win or Loss, is best. Without challenges, that would be 1000 matches. 1000 matches * 10 minutes / match = 10,000 minutes = 166 hours Factor in weekly and daily challenges and that can easily be brought down to 100 hours. I think 100 hours per battle pass is pretty reasonable. Ideally, the system would be something like MCC though. Rewarded for medals and such as well. Honestly, if they add a medal reward, the 50XP would be acceptable. Again, as long as the time for BP completion is around 100 hours.


ThisCrookedVulture

I don’t think 100 hours should be the standard for a battle pass. FWIW, your thought process is right; that is what Jerry Hook said on Twitter tonight, that you should progress about one level an hour. But for a regular three-month season, that’s over 8 hours a week, which is too much for people who work and have other life shit to deal with. And it assumes Halo’s the only game you’re playing nonstop for three months.


TheEpicPineapple

That's a fair point. Tbh, not sure how to gauge what's too long or not because, besides MCC, I have never really enjoyed or played a game with Battle Pass progression. Only game I play nowadays is MCC and Halo Infinite. Maybe less then, perhaps 60 hours. As long as it's not a "full time job" like 343 said


john7071

It's a step in the right direction, but I hope they implement performance based XP payouts down the road.


SolidStone1993

Stop praising 343 for this shit. People complained about it way back in late July with the first flight. They waited until the beta to change anything and this is honestly barely any better.


Tumblrrito

While I agree that game devs shouldn't be rewarded for fixing obvious issues like this, I don't think it is fair to call this "barely any better". 50xp guaranteed per match isn't much on its own, but combine that with the broken challenges that have been fixed and the adjustments to challenges that make them easier to complete in general and it's a pretty significant improvement. Not to mention twice the time on double XP.


JRRTokeKing

343 really did a good job responding to our feedback so quickly. It’s not a permanent fix, but it’s a step in the right direction.


DeathByReach

Let’s keep pushing for more, however. This is great that it’s fast, but it’s a band aid. And the amount of xp per match is low. 20 games to level up once without completing any other challenges. Should be 100xp.


jesuspunk

They’ve literally already said they’re working on developing it more this is just a temporary fix like you said.


john7071

Irrelevant but damn your PC is a beast. Is Infinite running well on it? I wanna know if the optimization is better compared to previous flights.


DeathByReach

4k, Ultra, HDR, 117fps to stay in the Gsync Zone works flawlessly with the min and max fps set to 117fps in all modes I’m sure it’s dropping some resolution to hit that target but it’s not noticeable at all and I’ve tried really hard to look at up close and far objects in taxing scenarios in BTB It’s pretty damn great!


kvlt-puppy

>117fps *Nice.*


DeathByReach

Unintentional, but I love it haha To stay in the gsync range, you need to be 3 fps or more lower than your max refresh rate. https://blurbusters.com/gsync/gsync101-input-lag-tests-and-settings/14/ LG C1 tops out at 120hz so I set it to 117fps :) (Although I already set a universal max fps in Nvidia control panel to 117fps too)


chipdouglas2819

What about responding to this exact same feedback during flights over the past 6 months?


Chipaton

Wouldn't say "quickly", people have been vocal about it since the system was announced. Only now it was affecting sales.


danieldcclark

Yea I agree. I still don't fully like the battle pass progression system but they're pivoting pretty fucking quickly while also responding to players. I appreciate them not going radio silent like other devs have done with other AAA titles. Now when we get Slayer full time I'll be a happy camper!


Glasg0wGrin

Dice should be taking notes... but they aren't 👀


Mrphung

10 games with the old system nets you 600xp, 10 games with the new system nets you 500xp. You need to play at least 20 games to gain more than the old system. https://forums.halowaypoint.com/t/daily-challenges-xp-chart/15489


JBL_17

That's my post! Haha I made that yesterday prior to today's update - good timing so we can use it to accurately compare the two systems. Overall it seems the Dailies are about the same (actually a little worse - previously it was 19 games for 1,050 XP, now it's 20 games for 1,000 XP) - but perhaps the main takeaway is the nerf to weekly challenges. I look forward to seeing how 343i will improve the game further.


Mrphung

You and your chart are the mvp, this discussion would get a lot more messy without your data.


JBL_17

Any time! And I appreciate the kind words :) I was just surprised to find it outside of Waypoint haha - I've been sharing a reddit version around here too if you need it. I just want us all to be aware of how the game is changing so we can give informed feedback and make Halo the best it can be. |Title|Requirement|Amount Needed|XP| | --- | --- | --- | --- | |Practice Makes Perfection 1|Play any Matches|1|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 2|Play any Matches|1|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 3|Play any Matches|1|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 4|Play any Matches|2|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 5|Play any Matches|2|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 6|Play any Matches|2|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 7|Play any PvP Matches|3|150| |Practice Makes Perfection 8|Play any PvP Matches|3|150| |Practice Makes Perfection 9|Play any PvP Matches|4|150|


needconfirmation

This is what live service does to games, the old system wasnt a mistake, ot was carefully crafted, they will fight as hard as they can to keep progression as slow as possible.


Elite0087

50XP per match? That’s still pretty low ngl.


PurpsMaSquirt

And weeklies were made to be easier. They will probably add a few super easy dailies. We have to give this a try and provide feedback after we see how the experience ends up being.


ecxetra

Flattening 5 enemies with the Repulsor in PvP seems far from easy go me.


FunPossession7298

I really just wanna be able to choose my game mode. I find myself quitting when I don’t load a match for the challenges I have. I’d rather not quit but if I am to progress quicker by leaving then I will.


errvin

That's like 20 matches per BP level lmao.


moneyball32

Halo Infinite has a 10 year plan because it will take everyone except professional streamers 10 years to complete one battle pass


TropicBreeze96

they will just throw money at every battle pass and tell regular players to stop whining about it.


9erInLKN

Correction: some random subscriber will throw them money to throw at it


Electrical-Energy896

Assuming you complete literally no other challenges, which is near impossible given how easy they are.


New-Monarchy

And what happens when you complete the 15 or so before the weekly reset, since they're now very easy?


BreadDaddyLenin

if you don’t accomplish any challenges, yeah. The challenges now net like 200xp starting


Baracuta90

We need to have more XP awarded per match, with a bonus granted depending on personal performance. Rewarding more based on win/loss will just get more people angry with their teammates, which isn't fun.


iMightBeWright

~~Does anyone know the exact daily challenge before this fix? I keep seeing people comment that it will take 6 games or 20+ games to see a benefit from dailies alone, but no one has the math to back it up. We know the new slope is 50 XP/match, so knowing each old challenge will allow an actual calculation. I only know the first 2 steps of the old dailies:~~ ~~1) play 1 match + 100 XP~~ ~~2) play 2 matches + 100 XP~~ Edit: See below for a fairly accurate comparison of the two: https://www.reddit.com/r/halo/comments/qww8h7/z/hl5xapk


TheEpicPineapple

Yeah there was a post before, let me find it for you. I calculated it using all of those slopes btw, and the breakeven point I got was at around 27 matches to s tart earning MORE with this system. Up to that point, it's actually less Edit: Here it is: https://forums.halowaypoint.com/t/you-currently-get-less-experience-from-playing-games-after-the-progression-update/18019


JBL_17

I've got the math, I'm the one that made the chart. |Title|Requirement|Amount Needed|XP| | --- | --- | --- | --- | |Practice Makes Perfection 1|Play any Matches|1|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 2|Play any Matches|1|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 3|Play any Matches|1|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 4|Play any Matches|2|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 5|Play any Matches|2|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 6|Play any Matches|2|100| |Practice Makes Perfection 7|Play any PvP Matches|3|150| |Practice Makes Perfection 8|Play any PvP Matches|3|150| |Practice Makes Perfection 9|Play any PvP Matches|4|150|


iMightBeWright

Excellent thank you. I just asked the other guy but you might know also: what happens after you finish level 9? Does that same challenge repeat?


JBL_17

I unfortunately did not get past level 9 in the old system. I did see someone on Waypoint say it ended after 9 - but I found that answer surprising. As I understood it from a prior news post, it should become *win* matches at some point, though I don't know if that was in place yesterday or even in place now.


sadtrader15

Would be nice if your in game performance was recognized in some way. Whether its additional xp for a win or xp based on medals.


CheekySamurai

Weapon Kill Challenges still bugged, instead of fixing these, just delete them. They ruin the flow of play.


Getsiv

The easier weeklys is in the positive direction. I started Tuesday evening and barely managed the first level. Wednesday played a little bit and hit the second. Now after a sesh Thursday evening I hit level 5. Also appreciate that they’re not in a direct order from easy to hard but there’s some mixing. Don’t like how I was already halfway through before the reset but 🤷‍♂️ ETA: still not pleased about zero match performance xp. Reward players who play well. Even if it’s like an extra 25 xp lol.


MrFOrzum

It’s so fucking weird to have xp boosts when your only source of xp are from challenges which can take multiple matches and might not even be completed before said xp boost runs out.


Veilus

Still hate it. I've been crawling at 50 xp a game no matter how well I do fot the last 3 hours because all my weekly challenges are hyper specific like killing an enemy in a friendly zone or getting five kills with the commando or with shade turret. Just let me play how I want and make progress damn it


catsnbikess

Still feel like the xp is still too little.


Tenbones1

50xp is still dogshit. Bring back xp for medals, not this fucking challenge bullshit


Sheazer

No. This actually grants less xp until you hit like 20 matches. This is not the way. You should make it 100 per win, 50 per loss at minimum. But this doesn’t address performance based xp. There needs to be more. Stop drip feeding the xp.


EntropicReaver

> all players who sign-in between November 23-30 will receive this week's Ultimate Reward: the Sigil Mark VII Visor. get rid of weekly rewards, the FOMO for some players is gonna be nuts, for people with less flexible schedules or that just straight up dont want to live on a single game 24/7 (im not a collector but i know some people are and will want to grind out every week) big brain 343 move, make battlepasses permanent so you dont have FOMO but have a FOMO shop that refreshes and FOMO missions with exclusive items every week get rid of challenge swaps and xp boosts while youre at it and just make the system not rely on these things. 40 freaking challenge swaps in the battlepass, give me a break


joansbones

Yeah, they have to do something about it fast. It took me 14 fucking hours to finish all the weekly challenges and another couple just to do the final ultimate one. It's absurd to expect anybody to play that amount of this game every single week. What happened to not wanting it to feel like a job?


jwhudexnls

Weekly rewards are the worst part about this entire thing in my eyes.


EntropicReaver

it's certainly the most concrete, tangible example of something being wrong, stuff like xp boosts and challenge swaps is a symptom of stuff like the progression being *purposefully designed to be slow*. if they change progression according to our feedback, what then will be the purpose of these consumables? the free track on the battlepass has FOURTY challenge swaps. Theyre only good for getting rid of bad challenges so that you can get XP faster, which you only want because the progress is slow. I feel like im taking crazy pills because it seems companies like ubisoft have conditioned consumers to think all these paid xp boosts and level skips and challenge swaps are a healthy thing for a game


dbandroid

I'm hoping that the "weekly reward" is just a rotation and you get a bonus (xp or, hoping against hope,, credits) for doing the equivalent weekly stuff if you have already won the reward.


Ratabat

Nah this is hardly a fix. Still takes 20 matches to level up, will still take hours. Fixes the bugged challenges but doesn’t address the near impossible challenges of getting shock chain kills or repulsor kills.


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Blackie1223

If you do the math, even scaled up all the way to 19 games, you get less xp compared to the old system (950xp now vs 1050xp before). Arguing that the easier weekly challenges now help offset this is a stupid argument because the weekly challenges should’ve never been borderline impossible to begin with and they still distract from objective play by forcing players to do certain tasks. And assuming that you were going to somehow complete all of your weekly challenges anyway before this change, if you don’t have a single day with more than 20+ games played, you now earn less xp weekly. All this change did was punish casual players and 343 somehow found a way to slow down overall progression on the battle pass for people who complete all of their weeklies, and 343 was hoping nobody would catch on since we now get the instant gratification of 50xp every time we complete a match. Overall, this was an incredibly tone deaf response from 343.


jwhudexnls

Challenges are in no way easier, I already have a challenge to get 20 mortar kills with a wraith. Not even going to bother trying to get it. 343 claimed unlocking things wasn't supposed to feel like a job and they're doing a pretty poor job of showing it.


Elite1111111111

Wow, I haven't even seen a Wraith yet. Edit: Saw my first Wraith yesterday! Spawned with 30 seconds left in a Stockpile game.


CanadianNic

I’ve only seen them once on the Halo reach Valhalla style map with the huge holes in the map. Usually it’s a scorpion that spawns but sometimes it’s 2 wraiths.


ecxetra

Flatten 5 enemies with the repulsor in PvP


SolidStone1993

Lol they aren’t going to get rid of all of the garbage challenges. Otherwise you won’t buy challenge skips. It’s all about the money.


FullMetalBiscuit

I got one for Banshee bomb kills, probably not gonna get that done since the bomb seems pretty hard to kill with anyway. That and there's always at least 5 things to kill you. Tanks seems good as ever but every other vehicle is feeling like a death trap.


nokian-gage

Jesus, I thought 10 kills with an energy sword is bad. It would be better if the game let you pick maps and modes and weapon spawns were consistent, but instead you're constantly fighting the game's bullshit RNG and it's not really your fault


SuccessfulRuin

This is a decent start and I’m glad they’re already listening to feedback and implementing change. That being said I still think the current state of daily challenges and progression is lacking. Keeping the OG dailies with the increasing game requirement in addition to this constant one AND a constant win challenge. Rewards both short and long sessions as well as prioritizing wins for any game mode to keep players motivated in playing the objective. Example Daily Layout: Complete 1 PvP - 50XP Win 1 PvP - 50 XP Complete 3 PvP - 100XP


thedrunkentendy

Performance bonuses might be better. Variances of 5xp 10xp 25xp for certain stats. Like 30 kills in arena being 25, a flag score being 10 xp and a killing spree or multi kill medal being 2-5 exp. Think how hard it is to get a perfection or an extermination. It would be sick to know big games get big payouts even if you get a loss and get the same as a dude who dragged your team.


A_River_Of_Slime

I keep trying to figure out how this happened (though I’m personally not as frustrated as some). They’ve had the feedback during the tests, and the vast majority of staff must be gamers who have played games with battle passes and could see this wouldn’t work. My gut feeling is this is an analytics thing. Like a 3rd part analytics company has told 343 the most profitable model “in theory” and for whatever reason they had to at least go with it. They also seem very scared of this battle pass running out, and since we know they were pushed for time in general maybe this new element of the game has just been a massive headache for them that they knew was coming in hot and made bad decisions under pressure. There’s no way it’s sustainable as surely when there are multiple battle passes you want players to get through reasonably quick to buy the next one. Just seems strange all around, would love to know the back story.


Wemwot

>There’s no way it’s sustainable as surely when there are multiple battle passes you want players to get through reasonably quick to buy the next one. Just seems strange all around, would love to know the back story. Next one is in may, so they're not exactly quick passes


SaltyMcMadJelly

So do you only gain credit towards the four weeklies that are on your challenge screen and not all weeklies? This feels like it artificially extends the weekly grind to keep playerbase. Awful design. We should get credit for any daily and weekly we have.


UberGoobler

This, 100% this. Why aren't there any passive challenges either? Like the weapon progress ones from H5


SCB360

Passive XP on weapons for new skins, like CoD does is ideal imo


BinaryPulse

So many issues would be resolved by just offering a decent amount of customisation off the bat. To progress isn’t *that* bad, if we could all be a bit unique from the get go then it would solve a lot of upset IMO.


Tokennugg

I had one weekly challenge left. Now I have all of them again. Ha ha, this is rough.


IsDaedalus

It's a poor bandaid at best, it's still a predatory system designed to take advantage of consumers


Electronic_Pie_8857

Call me Ishmael challenge (Grapple shot an enemy Spartan in PVP) seems bugged. I grappled two guy in the same game even. Some weapon kills don't always register too.


MCTuono

Should be 100xp not 50, that’s way too low


Mira_22

Still terrible. Needs much more work


Lyons_

This still isn’t enough. Please don’t let them think this enough. There’s no incentive to win in the casual game modes, so nobody tries. It should be 100xp for a win, and 50xp for a loss AT LEAST. For example, if you’re playing oddball and lose the first round but win the second round resulting in a third, you’re wasting your time xp wise. Should’ve just lost in the second round to get the game over quicker, and get your xp.


Emperor-MuadDib

Per kill XP MUST HAPPEN otherwise there is no incentive to do well.


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Otter_Lord

Will r/Halo A: Acknowledge this isn’t a proper fix and continue to give constructive feedback Or B: Lose their absolute shit, throw a few tantrums, demand obscure tweaks based on their shitty takes and generally act like over-caffeinated manbabies because they’re so hard done by (Mostly A, but a nauseating amount of B too)


Camerguy65

Yo 343 I'm gonna have to ask you to stop trolling us with this 50XP dump for the refreshing daily.


Veno_0

50XP? This ain't it 343. This is slightly better than the current system, but its still terrible That is 2000 games to complete the battle pass, let's say you end up doing some weekly by coincidence, you might get away with 1500. I just want to play this like a normal Halo game. This is not good 343. It needs to be 100 for a match atleast, ideally we need to be rewarded XP for contribution.


Stopthelemurs

I'd be happy enough if they just added a second challenge that gives you 50xp for winning. Then it's 50 for drawing/losing, and 100 for winning.


Veno_0

That would work.


moneyball32

Yeah as someone that works full time, this is an easy decision to not buy the battle pass. I might get to level 30 by May if I play consistently. I’m able to complete the Rocket League battle pass every season by only playing 2 hours a week and that game is also free to play. I understand the Infinite battle pass lasts forever, but I’m not going to buy it if I have to play forever just to get use out of it.


lilkhakishorts

They made the weeklies a lot easier fwiw. But I’d still like more xp for match performance and medals


Ratabat

My shock chain challenge actually increased from needing 1 kill to 3 kills. Will never happen.


PJ_Ammas

That is absurd. I've played 10 hours and have gotten zero chain kills, unless lightning grenades count in which case I have a whopping 1. That's challenge swap bait


BreadDaddyLenin

The weeklies are now things like kills, play BTB/QUICKPLAY, etc. you will be incidentally doing weeklies a lot so it won’t take as long as you think.


earle117

There’s still a lot of ridiculously specific ones that suck, maybe you got lucky with yours but they’re not all that general.


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Mattele

This. It’s a direct nerf. Why is not everyone seeing it like this?


GodsTool

Nice, we've now recieved the bare minimum.


JerikTheWizard

It's actually lower than before unless you play 20+ matches in a day


The-Cow-Mumper

Glad the team is hearing us, but man it still hurts not getting any credit for all those multi kills and flag caps match after match.


Exangambit

I think it should have at least been 100xp per match but eh, its a WIP


AH_DaniHodd

I hope there’s gonna be actual daily challenges later that’s not just “play a game” stuff like “Get 5 BR kills”, “Get a backsmack medal”, “Hold the Oddball for 60 seconds total”. They could also be bigger than 50XP. Playing the game isn’t really a challenge.


samurai1226

Is it just me or does the daily XP does NOT work on the Bot matchmaking anymore?


generalnormak

If they added 4 more repeatable dailies that gave 50 each, I think that would fix it. The four would be: • earn 1000 points • earn 2000 points • win a game • play big team battle. These four would help players feel they are being rewarded for doing well and help big team battle feel more rewarding.


Belleria

All they did was split the xp gain into being every game instead of every few games, it's still the same amount of xp unless you're playing for more hours than most have time for. This isn't a good holdover until the likely months it'll take to get a better system. tl;dr: afkers stay winning


AYO416

This dosent even make a difference to the BP progression...come on 343


its_me_van

I still got super specific weeklies tho, like destroying choppers/ghosts, flattening enemy with a repulsor (still don't know exactly how this can be done), and kill enemies while they're returning a flag. Also, am I the only one that absolutely hated the last one? There's only a very small time frame between the flag being dropped and returned, not to mention in order for it to happen the flag needs to be dropped in the first place. Why not just kill a flag carrier? I think that would be much easier and happens more often.


scamcitizen999

Ranked playlists should award more XP particularly on win, simple change.


Ohhellnowhatsupdawg

So we're obviously receiving far less XP than we were before. And we traded that for what? Fixing broken challenges and making the requirements less ridiculous? What a shit adjustment. Most people only have time for a handful of games and this only makes it worse. BTW the BP unlocks are still mostly junk. Challenge swaps aren't a fucking reward.


SandManic42

In the future, I feel that changes like these would be better made at then end of the current week/event. These first weeks challenges were difficult but doable, and many of us still put the time and effort in to complete them to obtain the reward. By making the change in the middle makes us feel like our efforts this week now have reduced value. Also, with the changes to the level boosts, I feel that players who have already purchased them from the store would greatly appreciate being granted an extra 1 boost for every pack of 2 that was purchased to adjust for the time difference. Love playing the game. It's been lots of fun and I look forward to seeing the updates throughout the coming years.


shadinski

People in these comments actually defending the decrease to 50xp omegalul


booradd

The fact I have to be lucky enough to spawn in on a map with a shade turret and then by the grace of God get a kill with said shade turret to get a measly 100 exp IS FUCKING RIDICULOUS


bmq1998

50xp per match is really nothing. That's 20 games for a single battle pass level


gravicks

I got a challenge to kill 3 wraths, as far I know wrath’s are not in the game yet


PleaseRecharge

I've put around 16 raw gameplay hours into the game and have played \~70 games while completing every single challenge I've been given and am sitting at Rank 10 (I'm only a quarter of the way through the new reset challenges we've gotten), which will bring me to about 700 games, more or less, before I can complete the whole BP. But wait a moment- That time's gonna be spread out over 10 weeks because I will run out of weekly challenges before I can get to the next 10th rank. In fact, I would probably only get to the next 8th rank because I only got to Rank 8 before I completed the first set of Weekly Challenges. So now I'm effectively timegated with the current numbers of XP they're giving us before I can complete every tier of the BP. If I want to grind out the BP, I should be able to sit down and do it whenever I want. I propose that per-game XP should be set to 100 and every win you get should net you an additional 150. Wins should get you a quarter of a level and losses should get you 1/10th instead of 1/20th. Challenges should never have been the only practical way of levelling your Battlepass, actually playing the game should have. This system promotes griefing and punishes teamwork and playing the objective by punishing people who don't have the right challenges.


Noble6inCave

50XP PER GAME LMAO


Woody_Harryishson

Yeah, this system sucks a fat dick.


CheesecakeInitial

Super cool how I unlock the main helmet I want through the battle pass and can’t even use it with the Mark VII, only on the Mark V lmfao Was everyone at 343 blackout drunk when they were putting this together or what, figure it out holy shit these limitations make no sense


thermalpuffs

Is online multiplayer not working for anyone else? Hasn't been working for me for about 6 hours.


Its_Skecchi

Anyone else have a challenge that still won't isn't progressing? Get one kill with a mangler isn't working for me


cryptek66

lol 50xp that still absolutely awful, what about XP for getting kills, securing objectives an flags? Who are you trying to fool here? This game is amazing, but the greedy monetization system you guys are pushing is starting to piss me off. Because this game is absolutely fucking fun ​ How about 100 points per kill? Or 200 points for capturing the flags, or being a good team player? And then 200-300 for people who have battle passes? Good lord 343, you guys are really trying