You like trains because they are more efficient. I like trains because they go choo choo. We are not the same.


Average choo choo fan: 🤪 Average chugga chugga enjoyer: 🧐




While they weren't efficient I do miss the chugga chugga


Chugga chugga is still more efficient than vroom vroom


I feel like we need to include the chugga chugga on new trains as an aesthetic choice like how electric cars still have radiator grilles.


I like trains because both. You have never seen someone with my power before.


I like ones that go HOONNNK


I like trams because grassy tracks




I think the selling point of increasing the social coefficient by using public transport is not used enough in discussions. I know this is a meme and it's great but for general discussion I feel as if there is too much hostility we have to show them the vision not tell them why cars are bad. Build don't destroy!


Also (again I know this is a a meme) ignores the one thing where cars have an absolute edge against trains or generally public transport; flexibility, especially in low density areas and anyone would realize that in three seconds flat. I think there is too much focus on hating on cars in general here. They have their use, and without acknowledging that, people that are indifferent are just gonna write all the good stuff off as 'extremism' (using the word lightly here, just couldn't think of a better one). Cars are terrible for dense areas, so let's get them out of there and encourage them to stay in their lane: flexible transport in sparsely populated areas where there's no real alternative anyway.


> Too much focus on hating on cars Sir this is r/fuckcars lol In all seriousness though, you make good points, i just thought it was a funny sentiment <3


hah yeah I know - I am just a little tired of people not focusing on the solutions rather than just bashing which while maybe cathartic, is pointless and ain't nobody got time for that.


Yes, the main selling point of cars is that they're flexible. But that flexibility does come at a cost, as in injury, illness, death, pollution, waste. Trains are the best way for intercity travel and if they're the main way to do so, that also means more trains and therefore more flexibility and less waiting times. Besides that,(e)bikes offer quite a bit of flexibility and it's doable for trains to have a wagon for cyclists to hop on and off. Not to mention having rental bikes at every station. I'm sure there's still going to be occasions where a car is more convenient, but I reckon the overwhelming majority of people arguing in favor of keeping their cars are just making up excuses because of their emotional attachment to cars. Nobody cares if those few folks living in the sticks or particularly small towns still drive cars.


I completely agree and that was what I meant; we need to replace the cars wherever feasible for a long number of reasons, but there will be places it's not happening and that's ok - It's just that sometimes it gets a little wild around here for no good reason.


I swear to god I'm going to jump in front of a car if I see one of these comments again 😐


That sparely populated area still has people needing to access the densely populated area So their is going to be cross over. I agree with what your saying but you will still have cars entering some areas. Just have to make it so that after they park at the hotel/ house they are fine with other modes of transportation


Yes, definitely; an area of improvement is how to better interface so people can actually conveniently commute first leg of their journey in their car if they live outside the cities, and then the rest in public transport. Currently there's often simply no real alternatives if they can do the commute in a car much faster than the hybrid solutions - obviously we can't target everyone, but there is much room for improvement.


this place is **literally** THE place to go to hate on cars. there is no amount of it that can possibly be too much.


When it crosses into stupidity it ceases to be useful.


I live in a low density rural area where you actually need a car to get anywhere


Exactly - and large scale public transport is not the solution in those areas and that's ok. Cars aren't the problem in themselves, it's when someone thinks cramming a million cars in a city is a good idea it becomes a massive issue.


This, this is the problem with most activism I find. Too much focus on hate and not enough people propose solutions. While yes, they exist, the focus should be on highlighting those solutions, it’s the same with each sticking topic, such as climate, workers rights, social inequality, etc. Too much posting is focused on us vs them, instead we should be focusing energy solutions that benefit both. Because you just drive those who you’re meant to help away. An example of this is the climate protests in London, they blocked the underground and train travel which many working people relied on for transit, and ironically is the best economic method travel method in London. Since you know.. trains. All this did was sour the working class’s opinions on climate protestors, and made people switch to their cars to get to work.


I agree, there's a lot of of activism that is actually mostly focused on antagonizing the opponent, rather than convincing and/or working on overcoming the obstacle they present; and it's often useless or straight up counter-productive. I totally get various frustrations, such as too many cars in cities (and I even live in a city where the problem is not *that* big), but my personal focus should be on convincing those that can be convinced (I preach the local electric rent-a-car-with-app a lot for instance, for all of those people that truly only need a car a few times a month like myself), voting for those that will help and doing what I can personally - instead of spending my time on the people that think we need more cars in the city.


> I think the selling point of increasing the social coefficient by using public transport is not used enough in discussions. Because in NA people associate the trains with either the poors, the homeless, or the drunks. They don't mention social issues around trains because it's such an uphill battle in most people's minds as what the typical person thinks about when they hear "subway" is some drunk/drugged out freakout video they saw of the new york subway.


Make the wheels steel


~~Too hard in MS paint~~ Uhhhh, that comes under "More efficient"


This is unironically how we can sell public transport to Americans. "It's a bigger, faster, and more powerful car with 1 billion horse power" what kind of wimp wouldn't want that?


America has misunderstood the instructions, and now everyone is conducting personal full-sized locomotives.


***OH NO!!!***


Due to the design of locomotives, people are getting into more accidents than ever before


But most of them kill people *outside*, so the obvious solution is more huge locomotive-cars!!!


Is that a coal yard preparing to load the fleet? No that's just a Walmart parking lot.


CHO CHO mother f....!!


I know this is supposed to be bad, but driving my own personal train sounds cool as hell.


[Move to Germany!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NL5sRCRa7AE)


...in the bike lane.


On the upside this *would* mean more rail lines.


The biggest stretch Hummer limo you can imagine!! With its very own lane. So you’re like tough AND fancy.


Instructions unclear. Now driving my 18 wheeler to commute


They should put ads on the side of trains that make fun of cars as they go by. "Stuck in traffic, we're almost to our destination"   Or something about reclaiming your time instead of sitting in a car stuck in traffic.


i have seen some of these for metra in chicago and the T in boston. more are definitely needed to raise awareness!


Just leave out the part where they have to share


You can ride in this multi million vehicle with 1000s of hp for only 20$ and throw in a large coke because americans seem to love that


and it wins in a car crash,


But can we put truck nuts on it? Maybe train nuts?


Better yet, we'll stick a giant dildo on the front of it and say that we're dicking down climate change whenever we take the train.


I hate it and love it at the same time! 🤣🤣


Have you seen the shape of modern trains? At that point just make the whole thing a giant dildo. 😂


A vehicle so powerful, it can replace a 6 lane highway.


The sort of wimp who doesn't want to turn a 35 minute drive into a 3 hour walk/ride, if I had to guess. That's your hill to climb, not the horsepower.


Buh buh buh... gotta walk to train station!


Real reasons: I actually don't want to walk to or from the train station. Also I live in a suburb with poor access to public transport. I also don't want to live in a box with hundreds of other people (and pay for the privilege) in a city center. What if I go buy a big item from home depot or whatever, do I really have to walk to to train with it somehow and use public transport with it. What if I get a massive load of groceries? Also people are gross. I took the bus in university and it was gross.


You can chose to live in a giant house away from society your whole life, that's fine. Don't force everyone else to have to do that too by voting against basic things like public transport.


Where can people vote for this kind of stuff? I WISH we could get some mfing trains so I could nap on the way to work!


Are you serious about the billion horsepower thing


I am not in the USA, but Australia where we have a similar driving culture. The way to sell it is to make it be less effort. I prefer public transport to driving in the city but in my new job I can either drive for 45 min or 1h30 min by PT. If I go to work at the right time I can be driving for a hour a day (30min each way), compared to a minimum 3 hours on PT and there are frequent delays. Doing this for months wrecked me, and I lost motivation at work and at home. I now drive until I can move closer to work.


Bu but where's the FREEDOM in that?


...that you can never own, can't decide where it goes, zero privacy while onboard, can't guarantee a sitting spot for hour long trips, can't bring more stuff than you can carry in your hand, and will often take twice as much time to get to a destination due to it stopping every 5 minutes or so for new passengers. I think all of that matters more to an average Joe than the amount of horsepower it has


"It weighs 849,212 lbs, it's not fast at all, it used to be the world's most powerful locomotive in the 1960s, it technically has two engines, it takes two separate units to move this thing down the rails, and it has a combined fuel capacity of 26,500 gallons. Of course, I'm talking about the UP GTEL 3rd gen."


I have said the same about trucking. Until about 10 years ago, double/tandem trailers were not legal in my state. The feds shoved allowing (on the interstate) them down the state's throat via withholding highway funds. Then triple trailers. "Its more efficient". (No, its lower labor costs.) You know what would be even more efficient than triple? A TRAIN! ​ **There is NO REASON to transport goods across country by truck!** All goods should be shipped via train to a local depot, then short hauled by truck. (Like they used to!) Having a triple trailer pass you at 85+ mph is no fun! ​ Its not just the trucking companies. There are tracks that are designed for heavy freight at high speeds. The trucks couldn't compete, so the Teamsters Union lobbied congress and got long sections of them limited to 55 mph!


> The trucks couldn’t compete, so the Teamsters Union lobbied congress and got long sections of them limited to 55 mph! Are those limits still in place?


Not sure. It was the 70s/80s.


If I ever saw a truck with 3 trailers driving near me, I would be TERRIFIED. No one in there right mind should put something like that on the roads, it just sounds too hard to control, especially at highway speeds.


Saw a double trailer truck in Utah for the first time a couple years ago. It was wild.


Wait until you see an [Australian road train](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT7BWgSoA5sZSW5Plg1AehoBHnflzX69j-3Kw&usqp=CAU)


Department of Transportation stans: We said *Lanes*! Not trains!


Whats that you said -- *more* trains? Coming right up!


IET for the win! Seriously, despite replacing the HST on UK mainlines, they’re actually really good trains (especially First Class, that shit be like a plane on rails)


The line I use when I travel home every few weeks is served both by IETs and HSTs, best of both worlds


Let me guess, the West Country? They’re both amazing trains, and I actually like the IET’s


Oui, the riviera line too so I get to go along Dawlish Warren on them! And same, I was never massively into trains when I was young and by the time I started using them frequently the IETs were just on the horizon so I didn’t have any strong feelings for the HSTs being phased out - I just thought new trains were good. But yeah I do find them really comfortable, and it’s amazing when going to London how fast and smooth they feel between Reading and Paddington.


I’ve been on the stretch between London and Reading a few times before, and I can see your point, racing by at 125 in a train is so much better than being stuck in traffic… and my earliest memory of a HST is a pair of Valenta power cars racing by the RAF Museum towards the midlands, the sound of MK3’s and Valenta engines can’t be beaten imo


Those GWR sets are really nice looking trains.


Objectively the best color


I personally think the livery is meh and suits the other members of the GWR fleet more, but LNER, TPE and Hull Trains have some striking liveries too


I agree, I really like the parts of my journey on IETs. The seats can be a little uncomfortable, and the lights could be a bit less intense, but at least there's aircon and they're smooth and quiet. I think they do get a bad rap. I can't wait for them to take over on the East Midlands lines - the voyagers (and others) are getting really old and grimey.


The IET is fine, OP :) still a hundred times better than cars!


that's a bus no?


It's a bus with extra tracks.


इस आविष्कार के लिए तुझे नो बेल्ट प्राइज़ मिलना चाहिए।


Lmfao your flair


r/dadjokes gold!


trains are not as lucrative as selling 1.5 cars per person though! 😩


*laughs in unreasonably high train fare prices*


Socialised transport ftw


Or a bus


Train is cool IET is really eh but it is train. Chad 1970's trains better tho.


As I put in the tiny note, I have a special connection to the IET, hence why I used it.


What’s ‘really eh’ about them? They seem fine to me. Plenty more leg room, quieter and smoother than the old ones they replaced - not sure what else I’d need.


"imagine a car" *a picture of really just the most awful car you've ever seen*


That was deliberate.


Once again, I gave my free award away too soon...


I prefer a bus, but to each our own.


but train only go where track go


So make track go where people are. We do it all the time with roads!


i am but one man, i cannot make track go where people on my own :'(


Replace wheel with truck tire. Choo choo offroad.


Le' bus is inventrd


“Yeah I know the IET isn’t great but it’s my local train and my dad helped put up the wires so I have a special connection to this train.” 🥺🥺🥺


> more comfortable This fact doesn't get enough attention. On a long car ride, you're strapped into a seat for hours until you find a decent rest stop. On a long train journey, I can get up, stretch my legs, use the bathroom, and possibly visit a dining car as many times as I like without affecting the arrival time. I've always found long car rides extremely uncomfortable.


I used to love dining cars! I always went to get a little hot chocolate from them. I forgot they were a thing. I really hope they become more popular again.


A car is more useful for going camping or hiking.


Cars can be useful in niche circumstances. That doesn't take away from the greatness of trains.


Yeah no doubt. I wouldn't wanna own a car if rent was affordable and comfortable.


It’s not


The convenience and functionality of having a car to go wherever you want at any time isn't niche.


Sure, however the cost to society if everyone has one is too great.


Niche circumstances like lack of rails? Your post mentions nothing of that


For some things they're great. If it's just for those few weeks a year, renting is way cheaper than owning though. Besides, the place where we usually go hiking actually has pretty good public transport. There are busses driving around the valley that also stop at the places where the trails start/end. Plus you get a free bus pass for the region when you rent an apartment there. We hardly ever go there by car and even when we do, we barely use it. That way everyone can have a glass of wine at the mountain cabins, haha.


Well no shit personal cars have their uses but the point is not everyone needs to own two and drive it to work everyday when all they’re carrying is a ultra book laptop, water bottle and two bic pens


Agreed. Even with good public transit, there will always be some out-of-the-way places that don't make sense to have tracks or bus routes there. In the future, I hope more folks will be able to just rent a car for those purposes. And the car rental place should connected to public transit, of course.


Sounds like a good reason to only rent a vehicle.


lol I hike every single day of the year


I hate cars as much as the rest of you but if were going to solve the problem, we gotta be realistic. Looking at the benefits of cars is important too(even though it doesnt make good content)


The time for balance is when we've actually made progress at reducing raw car numbers to any extent. There's currently 0 risk of going "too far"


this is just misleading. its completely different modes of transport. i dont think these types of arguments help us reach our goal of better public transport infrastructure. it just makes us seem like whiney stupid leftists who dont understand the core problem


>its completely different modes of transport. Tell that to everyone that drive from Iowa to California, or Bristol to Edinburgh. Or Miami to Atlanta. Plenty of people do plenty of long-distance driving, that would be much better done with a train. >who dont understand the core problem Then my I ask what the "Core problem" is?


The core problem is a lack of non-car infrastructure.


There's different classifications of rail. There's High Speed/heavy rail, those typically run long distance between cities. There's medium rail, which usually runs between metro areas, and there's light rail. Light rail runs within a city, and along with busses/cycling can completely replace cars with correct city planning. The problem isn't that trains suck, it's that everything is so far apart. We should build cities so that the things people want to do are next to where people want to live. Why shouldn't a grocery store be in the middle of your neighborhood instead of 3 miles away in a strip mall? My grocer is a 5 minute walk up the street. It's a full fledged farmers market. I used to spend $300 on groceries a month, then another $150 or so on fast food because I didn't feel like eating what I bought. Now I spend only about $200 a month on food. I can walk up the street and get exactly what I want for dinner.


Or a buss or whatever


Busses aren't great over long distances, and aren't as fast. They're good in cities, but bad for inter-city.


Even in cities they have trouble with traffic. They work well in cities when they have dedicated bus lanes/BRT. Without that they get stuck in vehicle traffic and then the economics of mass transit rather than a car don't play out as well. They have the ability to kill traffic, if they did not have to a be a part of it.


100% agree.


Couldn’t that also be a trolley bus?


sorry man, i dont have a train in my town


Class 801s are great what are you talking about


They’re a bit of cunts for gauging. The unit lengths and the nose cause massive overthrow on S&C/tight radii. That’s all the complaints I have tbh.


That's a bus.


Now take the train to McDonald’s


There's one at the central train station where I live! Easily done.


Trams and Trains should rule the world. There are clear, extensive blueprints for how to properly add efficient public transportation across a country, it's not like it's a new concept.


What’s missing is the sense of power and control that exists with cars. If only there was a way to recreate that sense of power but with a train. Like maybe a private train that can go on different tracks independent of any authority?


How about the US army’s land train? Which is a long truck lol


Trains are great, hopefully someone has a car to pick me up from the station so I don't need to rent one to get where I actually want to go.


I’ll never own a car as long as I’m in Japan. In the USA though, you need a car.


The main issue is that freight trains purposefully delay Amtrak and other train companies and there's nothing that can be done about it. Only the DOJ can bring charges and they have too much influence and ~~bribery~~ lobbying.


I don’t want to live in an air polluted and light polluted and noise polluted and trash polluted city though


What a great reason to not use cars, which cause all those things!


What cars produce trash?


All of them? What do you think a car is once it's unrepairable? Trash. What are used tires? Trash.


What about a bike or any other method of transport, dumbass


Much smaller amounts of trash. Also it's pretty difficult to destroy a bike beyond repair. A total scrapped bike is 10-20lbs of trash. A scrapped car is 4,000lbs of trash. Do the math if you can.


Either way, most trash in big cities has nothing to do with cars


No? Most dumped trash comes from the roadside as people toss things out their car windows or drive to illegally dump. That's why you always see trash collection crews on the side of the road.


Cars won’t get rid of the problem, people will just illegally dump somewhere else


Can't illegally dump if you don't have a car to carry the things you're dumping. Think man, think.


If it moves, it would almost certainly benefit from a seat belt.


Technically it only benefits from a seatbelt if it crashes. And with trains we went for trying to stop them crashing, and it being rare that they do already. Though I feel this argument falls down a bit thinking about planes, maybe there it’s more for turbulence too.


Turbulence isn't the only reason planes have seat belts. Most plane accidents happen on the ground, everything from crashes on landing, to the refreshment truck smashing into the side, or the push back tug moving the plane without warning. Heck a plane can even be moved by another plane powering up it's engines. As of late, even buses have been installing more seat belts. Historic thinking has been that because a bus so heavily outweighs most other vehicles on the road, seat belts aren't necessary. But the dangers from buses rolling over after a crash, where injuries and deaths have happened, have started changing things. An Amtrak train was recently derailed by hitting some sort of large truck, like a dump truck, where an elderly passenger was killed from injuries sustained during the crash.


Plane crashes are pretty rare though (just like trains), that’s what I was thinking of. I suppose however the difference is that “bumps” happen more, for which seatbelts are useful, versus that happening even less with trains. Similarly buses swerve or brake or get bumped more, so I’ve always thought more buses should have seatbelts.


In most situations yes but sometimes just no sadly


True because USA mobility industry is going towards public transportation in the most stupid way possible haha


Today I started feeling ill at work, so I went home and worked from home for the rest of the day. Because I travel by train I just had to get on one and go home, but it would have been a logistical nightmare if I had a car and drove in.


If only the fat cats stopped milking the railway for what it's worth and lowered the fucking price so it become more affordable. I work on them and don't understand why they've put such a high price on the tickets.


What if I do not like dealing with the general public or weird meth people touching themselves and smelling like trash?


But wouldn’t you need to build train tracks everywhere?


“Yeah lemme park my train in the driveway rq”. This is stupid af ngl. I’m down for better long distance high speed transport, but cars are literally necessary for suburban and rural living. You can’t have trains going to every single block, it just isn’t practical and would take *forever*. Some smart aleck might say “well Americans should move out of the suburbs” but that is quite literally the most naive urbanite take you possibly could hold. I’m sorry but restructuring the entirety of American suburban living is just not worth it to take some cars off the road.


We think cars are necessary in some places. we just want to make it so they're not the only real option anywhere. And that may involve reducing the presence of suburbs (which again are mostly the only places to live)


Can only go in predetermined tracks


And it can go anywhere you need to be? Or just like where those rails are?


Can a car go anywhere you need it to be? Or just where the roads are?


Dirt/gravel roads? The beach? Off-roading? It can be done


i agree with you but like this isn’t a great argument.


More efficient, faster and comfortable? Not in Mexico my friend.


I’ve never taken a train and it saddens me


Now put wings on it


And increase it's emissions, require a 3.5km long and 80m wide slab of asphault (runway), and make it harder to decarbonise. Planes are not by default better that trains. While planes work on certain (Mostly long-haul or over-water) routes, there are plenty of routes where trains are better


Trains are considered more comfortable than cars? I’m a train fan my self, but I don’t think most people would agree on that…


My wife did this with freight trains after being annoyed by how many semi trucks were long hauling on the highway.


its hard to go offroading with a train :(


It's so damn depressing that any long distance rail trip in the US is both slower and way more expensive than driving. Massive highway subsidies have to end!


Normal car brained: Now make the car faster, larger! __refuses to elaborate further__


Lemme go to the store and come back IN MY TRAIN


I disagree. What you have made is a bus. To make a train, you need to replace the road and wheels with something that has less wear and allows for fewer accidents.


currently reading this on a train as I get thrown about like a cat in a car, so I'm not sure it wins on comfort haha


Trains are the carcinization of vehicles and you can't change my mind


well your train cant pull over can it btw this is a joke


Imagine being able to read, eat, sleep, or play video games while you drive!


Lmao I love this.


Feckin beautiful


Im on the amtrak to California right now, and honestly its been pretty slow. Thats excatly why id advocate for trains, because i havent had to do a single thing for the whole day and ive travelled hundreds of miles. If we actually nationalized this industry and gave it the funding it needed, this could be amazing and cheap


Unless I can control the train, steer it where I want, choose when to accelerate and brake, shift gears, etc., its worse, not better. Trains are better in some ways: space efficiency, safety, emissions. Nobody but a soul-less automaton would say they are more enjoyable overall though. I want there to be more of them around, but I am not going to pretend they are more fun than cars.


damn they really did the Rivian like that


Oh shut the fuck the up already most of you guys didn't even use trains before the gas prices were high and most trains run city to city not public transit use the bus for public transit if you're worried about gas prices. God Damn.


Except they aren’t viable in many places without spending more money than many countries make in a year. Especially considering the most US states are larger than any singular country in Europe


Yes and make sure that every city has only one train station and about 5 hours of delay. Trains are great 👍


Dad W