T O P
SmellGestapo

Shared mobility, whether e-scooters or e-bikes, are crucial for living the car-free lifestyle. I can take the train or bus into my workplace but sometimes I need to visit suppliers or clients who are nearby during the day. But they may be too far to walk, but not on a transit route (and during the day the transit headways are way slower than they are at rush hour). The ability to hop on a scooter or bike and, for a few bucks, get to where I need to go quickly and without sweating, is huge. And since I don't have to make this trips every day, it doesn't make sense to bring my own bike or scooter with me every day. This isn't the only use case, of course. There have been times I've missed my bus connection and made the remaining 2 miles of my trip on a bike or scooter that I rented. It's cheaper and greener than getting an Uber or Lyft to drive me there. And there have been times I've *made* my bus or train because a scooter got me there just a few minutes faster than walking would have. I'll always prioritize walking and transit as the cheapest and least complicated ways to get around, but reality throws you curveballs sometimes and having a scooter or bike to rent for 10 minutes is just such a game changer as far as giving people peace of mind that they can live their daily lives without owning a car.


oechsph

I live in a city that has had a number of e-scooter and e-bike sharing services and it seems like this industry still has a lot to work on. As others have alluded to, these things get abused to hell and are often destroyed, vandalized, thrown into bodies of water, etc. In a utopia, the sharing economy would be amazing, but for as long as there is minimal accountability when it comes to maintaining these modes of transport, these problems seem destined to persist. I've seen enough to shake my belief that society could really handle something like this (think a few rotten apples spoiling the bunch). Compounding the problem, the abuse these things get gives a lot of these e-transport devices a very short shelf-life; to the point that I wouldn't say they are as sustainable as we'd like to think. In my experience, ownership of a personal e-transport results in a much different outcome. Riders naturally provide more care of their e-bikes/e-scooters when it is their own. I've never seen an owned device in a canal, bin, or sitting idle on a cycle path.


SmellGestapo

Yeah, it's a brand new industry and every city seems to be regulating it somewhat differently. I'm hopeful these things get worked out because I think the option is hugely valuable to car-free people.


manshamer

The vandals will get sick of them if they stick around long enough, I think.


OlivesFlowers

They haven't gotten sick of cars (edit: or houses) yet, though..


takelongramen

It's ecological nonsense and greenwashing in its purest form. The average life expectancy of an e-scooter in Switzerland is 28 days, after that it's e-waste, including the Lithium battery. In those 28 days you either have underpaid workers charging them at home or Diesel trucks collecting them, starting and stopping their engine 30 times on the route. It's utter nonsense and a nice way for cities and politicians to give off the impression of doing something for "micro mobility". All of this budget and energy would be better invested in bike infrastructure.


Narsil86

Benefits: Cheap way to get around medium-long distances in a city w/o having to carry around a bike or your own electric scooter. Very small footprint for something that can go roughly the same speed as a bike can store them without locking them up since their motor can restrict use w/o the app initializing them, as opposed to non-battery powered bikes Problems: They should utilize the same infrastructure as bikes, but most cities have terrible bike infrastructure, so people ride on the sidewalks so they aren't murdered by cars, leading to inconveniencing walkers The companies run them as a loss-leader, taking on a deficit in order to make them super cheap and take in investments to keep afloat. It's not a long-term strategy, if the companies survive the prices will have to go up, or you'll end up having to trade off something else People throw them into the local rivers. Which makes no sense because that is literally just polluting their own water, and if no one uses them then the companies will eventually stop making them. Potential solution: People use them, so it's probably best we just set up infrastructure to support it. Again, it overlaps with bike use, so it would be beneficial anyway.


SmalltimeDog

In my city they are allowed on the municipal multiuse paths but banned from the federal multiuse paths. 70% of multiuse paths are on federal land, on top of that our transit system is in shambles. I'm lucky to live in a very walkable part of the city.


whereiskansascity

In Kansas City they can only be used on streets - banned from sidewalks


athomsfere

Mine too, your cooler hipper neighbor Omaha. But I see them on the sidewalks all day long.


SmalltimeDog

I have zero issues with that, they don't belong on sidewalks but here they allow electronic bikes on the multiuse paths but not the scooters. Its just senseless.


Dnt_dox_pls

The problem with KC is KC is so heavy on the suburbs, and those drivers from the suburbs have absolute ire for anything else on the road, including other cars, but especially bikes and scooters. People are blatantly antagonistic — feinting swipes at you, purposefully running out out of road, passing extremely close, etc. I absolutely refuse to use the streets on bikes in KC during rush hour, and Friday/Saturday nights, when the suburbanites are commuting to the city to go to work or bars or sports. Outside of those hours, when it’s mostly locals, it’s pretty great though.


hotmemedealer

I think you should be able to buy your own, like you would a Car, and have charging ports. Much more enviormentally friendly, and much more fun.


Narsil86

I've seen them around. In Costcos too which is kinda ironic, no Costco is anywhere I would want to commute by an electric scooter. They aren't cheap, but not much more than a decent bike, less than a thousand.


hotmemedealer

I would much rather pay $900 for an electric scooter than I would a $40,000 car with repairs.


pisspants6996

Don’t want to brag, but my new Costco is accessible via my local greenway and I can get there on my e-bike in 10 minutes!


Narsil86

Nice! Brag away! We need to see compelling solutions like this!


DMelanogastard

You forgot the negative that they’re a corporate fucking eyesore in public spaces and they take up physical space in already cramped sidewalks when parked (plus the problem you mentioned of riding on sidewalks)


internet_spaceships

Still way less of an eyesore than cars. My solution: park them on the street in car parking.


wishthane

Here they just allowed Lime very recently, but they set it up so you're not allowed to ride on the sidewalk. They also put the scooters in some places without bike lanes that I don't really even like cycling on because there isn't really any place to comfortably stay away from cars


DirtyJuggler

We talked about these in my sustainable transportation class. One of the major problems with these is the durability of them. People treat them like absolute sh*t since they don’t own it. They last something ridiculously short like 2 weeks on average in the US and like 4 or 5 weeks in the EU.


blackwe11_ninja

My city has Bolt, and it's awesome. I have my own scooter to quickly move around neighborhood, but sometimes I use the app to get home from city center, which at night can be quicker than a bus and cheaper than taxi.


skynetdotexe

Unless you have to deal with people leaving those things in the middle of the road. Have had a couple of near misses with bolts and think that they should have special spots where people have to leave them.


blackwe11_ninja

That's exactly how it works here in Bratislava. You have to leave it at designated spot, or you have to pay fee, I think 20€ or something like that.


skynetdotexe

Nice, here they leave it in the middle of the street, bit we do have the city bikes program that has parking spots for rental bikes. Both normal and electric versions. They are so much nicer.


Electrical_Age_7483

People leave cars in public spaces and gave near misses


davidty2006

Im not much of a fan of the apps. Since it leads to them just being dumped. And some nations like the UK made them the only ones legal pretty much fucking them up entirely....


artogahr

In Turkey you need to tie it to an acceptable place and take a photo, otherwise they have the right to charge you for inappropriate parking


Kirmo13

From what I know, this is the case everywhere. The only problem is that it doesn't work. The angle of the photo can make it really hard to see if it is parked correctly + they can be vandalized after the photo is taken.


WraithCadmus

The test scheme seems founded on good logic, but between the pandemic and people just buying their own it feels events overtook it.


ZeroNullAnon

First, Some [groundwork needs to be laid](https://youtu.be/T9aeMccUPY0). Now that you've watched all that, let me take it a little bit deeper. Keep in mind that a lot of what I'm about to say also applies to bike shares and car shares. These things are great for municipal politicians. In smaller towns, where stroads are the only infrastructure and public transportation is just starting to become an issue, escooter rental companies are like mana from heaven to the mayor. Why? Because they literally don't have to do anything. All they have to do is permit a company to move in, make a big deal about it, and then ignore the public transportation issue for another year or two. This doesn't actually solve anything because, most of the time there is very little, and/or poorly maintained, pedestrian infrastructure. Bicycle infrastructure is almost never present. So the end result is, predictably, that accidents happen and citizens direct their anger at the escooter company for bringing in these vehicles rather than the City Council that did nothing to improve city infrastructure. City government gets a free pass to collect a paycheck without working while deflecting all blame onto the escooters that didn't have any usable infrastructure in the first damn place. So between the escooter Ponzi scheme and the natural laziness of city officials, we get this in-virtuous cycle that ultimately fucks over the rest of us. These things are . . . not good, to put it mildly.


NaCl10

Agreed. They're a shitty excuse cities use to avoid actually improving their infrastructure.


Jeremycycles

People in my city can't seem to grasp they are to be ridden on the road and not sidewalks. Anytime I open my building door there is a chance of someone slamming into it on these.


Stimpy3901

Drivers will legit slow down their cars to yell at you for riding them in the street.


Jeremycycles

Drivers yell at me for riding my bike also, doesn’t mean I go 20+ down the sidewalk instead


Stimpy3901

Specifically responding to your point that people don't understand they are road vehicles, that includes drivers. I agree they should be ridden on the street.


Jeremycycles

I should have probably elaborated on my first post, we have a greenway across the street from my front door that they are allowed on. They choose the sidewalk in front of me instead because it is closer to the bars


Stimpy3901

I mean yeah, that's super annoying. I also don't like how much of our already limited sidewalk space they take up.


Cantshaktheshok

That and pretty much every other criticism is also 100% true for bikes. Many cities don't have the infrastructure built for anything but cars, dodging the few pedestrians on a scooter or bike is a much more appealing than cars passing at close distances.


cfa_solo

I ride them on the sidewalks on roads that have inadequate bike infra, but that's mainly because I live a bit further out into the burbs. Hardly any pedestrians to begin with, but closer to the city center I definitely void sidewalks


coconutman1229

That's not the scooters fault, it's the cities infrastructure fault


Jeremycycles

The infrastructure is there, half the people can’t comprehend it’s a road vehicle not a sidewalk vehicle


Sylente

This is one of those things that technically true but only in the most useless way. We have them in my Midwestern university town. Should you ride it on the road? Technically. But the roads here are not smooth, and those things can't take a pothole (nor can a road bike, really). You hit a bump, you will fall. And probably get run over by a car. Driving them on the roads is often just straight up impossible. So people use them on the sidewalks. The solution is obviously better infrastructure for fast, super light transit. On some of the downtown streets with dedicated bike lanes, people ride them in the bike lanes. But until then, they *have* to be on the sidewalk, otherwise they're too dangerous and uncomfortable to justify using.


Agile-Lie-5530

Everyone can comprehend it, it’s just more dangerous so they don’t


SolemBoyanski

A better point here is: Why does your door open outwards straight into the line of traffic? What moron designed that?


Jeremycycles

Our building was built before the road was moved closer to it and the sidewalk so that on the others idea they could build a light rail and greenway


DirtyPenPalDoug

You want them in the streets with cars? That's asking them to put themselves at far more risk than a door hit.


Jeremycycles

The road is very safe in front of my building, safe enough for bikers and children to ride bikes. Also across the street from me, there is a greenway running through the city that they are allowed on. They chose to ride on the very narrow sidewalk in front of my building because usually they are drunk and it is quicker to get from one brewery district to the next that way.


DirtyPenPalDoug

Roads are for cars. Cars have stupid meat bags piloting them. They arnt safe, and scooters shouldn't be there.


fire2374

I once had someone on a scooter ask me to move over for them on the sidewalk. The funny thing is, the road was closed. There was no reason any of us *had* to be on the sidewalk but this woman on a scooter still expected pedestrians to move out of her way.


Specific_Criticism98

These scooters are the reason I’m able to be car-free. These and the similar e-bikes are how I get to restaurants, bars, and concerts in a city with bike bad bike theft issues and not great public transit. I know I could also Uber but that’s way more expensive, especially with surge pricing. Plus I think they’re really fun. I love showing out of town guests around town on these. People need to do a better job of not parking them in the middle of sidewalks though, it makes it tough for wheelchair users and strollers


Ketaskooter

In theory the shared bikes and scooter are great. They absolutely need fixed return points. I've heard the escooters are fun but complaints from everyone i've talked to about them being left everywhere and vandalism.


AntEaterApocalypse

I like the basic idea behind them and such things are going to be important as we strive to be more and more car-free. But so many of them have the stink of tech-bro startups that will go tits up in six months once investor money dries up. I don't use any of those services as I have my own ebike, but I have looked at some local ones out of curiosity and their prices were offputting. In many cases it would just be cheaper to take a cab or Uber... which is exactly what most folks do when faced with the choice.


GM_Pax

I am not a fan of **dockless** bike - or scooter-sharing systems, because I've seen some of the downsides of them.


kendallvarent

I wouldn't necessarily require docks, but dedicated parking areas are a must. I like the approach taken by (forced on?) VOI in the UK, where you have to put it back in a designated parking area or it can't be locked - and keeps charging you. This leads to an acceptable compromise between (not) having scooters littering the pavements, and having scooters distributed closely enough to be a useful mode of transport. It also helps that they are banned from riding on pavements or roads >30mph.


GM_Pax

Fair enough on the dedicated parking. :) Especially if you can't stop payment until it's in one. But even that, I find ... questionable, at best. My experience was with a company called **VeoRide**, in Lowell Massachusetts. Their bikes - not electric, as the legality of eBike-shares is problematic in Mass - were often in poor repair because people would, arriving at their destination, literally just throw them on the ground (not even using the built-in kickstand). Or worse, would throw them in the river or one of the canals. Once the cafe lock was re-engaged, you stopped paying ... but then, nothing stopped you from picking it up and throwing it over the railing / wall into the water right below you. Alternately, people figured out quickly how to break open the lock, disengage the remote control and GPS tracking, and simply **KEEP** the bike as their own. ... Hence why I am more a fan of **docks** \- you don't stop paying, until it's SECURED somewhere you can't pick it up and move it from.


kendallvarent

That makes sense. Yes, mitigating anti-social behaviour is another aspect. Not sure how VOI deal with that, but I suspect a large part of it is that when enough people see them as a good thing that they want to use themselves, they are less likely to vandalise them. In Norway, the antisocial behaviour comes from - of all demographics - old people! They go past the rows of scooters and knock them down when they think nobody is looking :')


WaldiIO

well, the river hates it...


No-Significance-7355

Big arse nope. The business model is absurd (like many tech crap it only works on a constant influx of new investment cash) The lifespan of these are also really bad and contrary to e-bikes, once it’s dead it’s basically a brick Moreover it’s hard enough to adapt our cities to bikes but these just make everything extra chaotic. It’s too fast it takes space on the sidewalks and on the bike lanes and people usually are utterly dangerous and disrespectful on these


ivialerrepatentatell

>The lifespan of rental scooters > >Rental electric scooters have an average lifespan of __1-5 months__. Privately-owned e-scooters with proper care and maintenance tend to last at least 2-3 years or longer. > >Privately-owned e-scooters have a completely different lifespan that is nowhere near as short as rideshare companies. Rental scooters are left out in the rain and bad weather conditions, so they tend to deteriorate quickly. > >Private owners take better care of their electric scooters. Obviously, individual parts break and need to get fixed, but in most cases, the scooters are not as heavily used as their rental counterparts, so they last much longer. 1 to 5 months is insane.


Stimpy3901

With the now common speed caps that cities have put in place, they are too slow for the street and too fast for the sidewalk.


Sylente

They're perfect for bike lanes. Awful anywhere else.


OhNoMyLands

Wow, I looked this up because it didn’t sound right, but it is… wtf. On the other hand, the e-bike shares last 4-5 years. Proof that Viking is still the best form of transportation


DMelanogastard

True. You need to go to the grocery store? Call up your local Sven or Erik who can give you a a piggyback to the store, help you pillage it, and then carry all the bags home in one trip


OhNoMyLands

Hahahaha Well I am in Minnesota, so it adds up


mperlaky

Agreed, I also see little to no real benefit compared to a bike or just a normal scooter. I’m not against it in general, I’m fine with private use too but the business model that could support it is not there yet. And in my city the car sharing costs basically the same, bike sharing is virtually free too (it’s 1,5 euro for a month and you can use it for 30 mins long trips as much as you want, great for my commute for example. But of course that’s not turning a profit either)


No_Bend_2902

As a visitor to big cities I love them. If I lived there I could see it getting old real quick.


[deleted]

It depends on where you live. Here in the car-dependent suburbs where over half the population is under 18 and about 10% are over 80, they're limited use at best. The good: 1. They might work for the few folks who work from home and happen to be within walking distance of using one on a day where the weather permits (they probably have a better chance of being hit by lightning). The bad: 1. They're only available for legal and/or realistic use to about 30-40% of our population. This population also drives everywhere and most work outside the city during the day. 2. They're marketed toward the under 18 crowd who then can't legally use them. 3. They are predominantly used on sidewalks and left in the way of wheelchairs and other actually useful transportation modes. 4. They're expensive. If you use one for regular transpiration (and not the novelty they are intended to be) and travel more than a mile every day (first/last mile), you might as well buy your own. 5. They aren't well-maintained and create a safety hazard. The hazard also falls on the user as a waiver indemnifying the scooter company is required to use them. 6. They are collected every night in an automobile (or multiple automobiles) by people being hosed by the gig economy who (in our case) drive them at least 20 miles away, charge them at home, then drive them back to town for destruction. I'd be surprised if this doesn't entirely cancel out the automobile trips they're supposedly reducing. 7. To serve our low-density population, they are distributed and focused around civic centers like the library. This results in people literally driving across town to use them. Again, novelty. 8. Adding to the last point, there are ridiculous limits on where they can be parked, making realistic access to parks, shopping, and other amenities inconvenient at best. Because they are contracted with the City, they also follow city boundaries which aren't consistent and create significant gaps in operable area. So, if you have a critical mass of a demographic who can and likely will utilize these things and have destinations concentrated in a reasonably accessible area, that's great. Outside of dense cities and tourist areas, I don't see that happening. For more than half of the US (as an example) who don't live in areas like this, these are a terrible idea. For-profit public transit almost always is.


Motobitcrush-

I hate that you can hop on without having a helmet. I lost my ability to smell and taste from a longboarding accident because of my own stupidity of not wearing a helmet. Woke up in a hospital. I thought I didn’t need one since I was crossing a parking lot. Always wear a helmet for bikes, skating, scooters, etc. A helmet saved my life on a motorcycle too


KelBear25

These scooters can cause quite a few inquiries and are operated often by people that aren't familiar with how to ride them. My aunt needs reconstructive surgery on her arm following a fall off a scooter.


jbud69

Prevents intoxicated driving, and forces people to cope with alternatives to cars. Worth the cons, hopefully the cons will be sorted out


Frozeria

Although better than driving, you really shouldn’t use these while intoxicated either.


AdventurousLecture77

Funnily enough.... People on e-scooters get checked much more frequently by the police, at least here in Germany. Just had that happen to me a few days ago and I was honestly a bit furious that they would rather spend their time checking me than the car drivers who move around 2 tons that could actually kill someone.


Dio_Yuji

It depends on how the programs are managed. In Austin, they littered the sidewalks downtown and were kind of a pain in the ass. In San Diego, they were very regulated and could only be returned in select locations. Overall, I’d say they’re good. Fewer cars and all that


theaceoface

Whatever your thoughts on e-scooters, they are certainly better than cars


LizardCrimson

I only like the bikes. Wish there were fewer scooters and more bikes


satanophonics

We tried that shit here and most of them ended up in the river. Oh yeah and a few fatalities.


berejser

I honestly think cars should work the same way. Nobody owns a car, you just book one on an app when you genuinely need one. No tax, no insurance, no maintenance, no parking.


KimJongIlLover

https://mobility.ch is pretty much that.


ConnieLingus24

My only issues with them: 1) they should not be ridden on the sidewalk 2) they shouldn’t be randomly dumped on the sidewalks. Divvy/CitiBike invested in docking stations. These companies should follow suit.


oechsph

2) This is my main problem with them (apart from these things aren't sustainable in the slightest). These companies pump cities full of them, often without permission or notice, and make no effort in contributing to the infrastructure for docking. Not cool.


i_gotta_barf_

I hate these, possibly more than cars. I think even if there was a safe infrastructure for these things there's always going to be the one asshole that thinks they are a toy and goes at full speed without think of anyone but themselves. I've been knocked down by one of these things in the past, the rider did not give 2 shits about what happened to me and sped up.


TerranceBaggz

E-scooters can be a part of the transit solution. In my city, because of its lack of a comprehensive public transit system, they’re used for far more than just last mile.


uosiek

I love them. Convenient way to do some errands up to few kilometers away. Personally owning one (120-150km of range on single charge) I don't need a car in the city as long as I'm doing groceries everyday. They take less space than a bike, when I'm in the office then it charges under my desk.


GlobalSpread3429

There good as one part of a larger concept. E-scooters are useful as a last-mile solution, for example to get from the train station to your final destination. If that can encourage more people to switch, it’s for the good. We have a dozen different companies here and the nearest one is never far. I rarely use them as I bike 90% of my commutes, but I often use them when guests are visiting from out of town and we want to go somewhere together. The more options, the better.


RedLightGreenArrow1

They're fine, but I keep falling off of them. It must be something I am doing, and I am still trying to learn. Once I figure it out, this will actually work out for me wonderfully as they are always in front of my house.


rocksoliddesu

they only replace walking/cycling with scooters. No effects on cars where i am from so i dont like them that much really


LewManChew

I travel a lot for work and love being places with them. I get to explore way more of the city and don’t have to use rideshares to get farther places as I’d rather a long scooter ride.


EmpireStrikes1st

It's an incomplete idea. Like many tech-bro disruptions, it's half-baked. The idea of having a scooter rental for a few hours sounds good, except that there isn't a place to put them when you're done. And the companies are just like, "Ehhh, throw 'em anywhere, we'll pick them up I guess." And on top of that, the people who use them are crazy. It's like people who drive U-hauls on parkways because they don't know any better. You take an idea like the Citibike, where you can rent a bike to get you across Manhattan for 45 minutes, and it's a complete idea. I don't know how practical it is really because I don't live in Manhattan, but it certainly is working well enough to keep the program going.


Rubber_Fig

It depends on where you gonna put them. If you take away space from cars, they're great. But if you take space away from pedestrians, they suck.


Graf_Gummiente

I actually hate them. Not more than cars of course, but I still do. My city once had a lot of them, this went away, luckily. The *idea* is of course cool, just like the ones with the bikes, but since these are scooters, people tend to put them basically everywhere. Bike lane, sidewalk etc. And I haven’t even talked about the kind of people I see way to much on those scooters. But yeah, my opinion, feel free to disagree.


MagdaDzo

In Lyon, they take around 200 every week out of the river


No-Significance-7355

Big fat nope


alexbutlermma

With new tech there will always be teething problems and then acceptance. When the debate is "do we want to keep these?" we don't spend time saying "how can we make them better?" They're here to stay whether we like them or not - let's put energy into advocating for better rather than a ban Cycling infrastructure can and *should* support e-scooters. Similar speeds, masses and protection levels means low chance of conflict between user groups. Cars have higher mass, speed and protection so don't care about a collision with a cyclist - an e-scooter rider won't have that and must be safe around cyclists ----- Vs other options They are cheaper than taxis (and less polluting greener than ICE taxis) and like taxis, are readily available at any time and place Lower income threshold required vs a car Less physical exertion required than a bike Direct to destination, whereas rail/bus isn't --------- General arguments against them "Cycling is better" - try commuting in a hilly area and say that. Turning up to work sweaty isn't fun. Good option for some injuries or disabilities, too. "They're expensive to use" - they often have similar prices to public transport options over short distances. If there's no direct bus route these are a great substitute. They're a great addition to a public transport network to, offering the "Y-Z" part of an "A-Z" journey "They're a mess/block paths" - agreed. There needs to be good regulation of their storage rather than allowing them to park anywhere. Docking stations are becoming more and more common. Voi (a leader in the UK) has "no parking" zones in most very built up areas and docking stations every 200m or so. No parking zones are impossible to end your ride in and you get billed until you leave them "They're dangerous" - kind of. For e-scooter users there is a slightly increased risk vs cycling of head injury, but it's not clear if this is caused by the e-scooter users or other road traffic not understanding them. For pedestrians, no difference to bikes really. Again, if you want people to not ride on pavements, advocate for cycling lanes that allow e-scooters rather than bans on them. "They break and become bricks" - sure. That's a problem that will be solved with time. The technology is new, and the only way it will improve is via trial and error. You can't improve durability without extensive, real world testing. No company wants shitty hardware that will cost more in maintenance than building sturdy to start with. "Drunk people will use them" - I'd rather a drunk person hit me on an e-scooter than in a car. If they're dumb enough to ride drunk they're dumb enough to drive drunk - not a lot can be done other than prosecute those who break the law "They block roads" - bike lanes. Make more bike lanes. "They run out of power" - everything does. Recharge it.


Alexdeboer03

I dislike them a lot, they arent required to be stored in sensible places like a lot of bike hires so they end up everywhere


Republiken

Worthless. They replace walking short distances and make it more difficult to cycle and walk


TheodoreWagstaff

The weird thing about them around here is that I literally never see anyone riding them. I do see them being left all over the city and there are two guys who live near me who collect, charge and repositions them. They're both super busy doing that, so someone is out there using them quite a lot. There is a gated apartment complex that I walk by a lot who put [this](https://i.imgur.com/48JUu6G.png) in right outside their gates. My dog assumes it is a little pad they installed for him to pee on.


CamRun

People on these things are a nightmare on my local bike trail system. Riding in the wrong lane, not paying attention, being in the wrong lane going into a blind corner, AirPods, texting.


OverConfidentCyclist

For some reason in LA you need a drivers license to use them. A regular state ID won't work. So they aren't really a solution at all. It would be nice if I could use the scooter to do the driving test.


transgurcu

Just get your own damn scooter. They are cheap, healthy way to get exercise and here me out here people treat things that they don't own worse than their personal belongings. Whew a shocker.


Specific_Criticism98

What about cities with bad theft issues though (most big cities?) my friends with e bikes/scooters of their own can’t take them out to restaurants and bars without a good chance of them being stolen


transgurcu

Idk, maybe keep someone like a friend or family member near the transportation medium is my best advice. And for scooters, its easy to carry them.


Tight_Management_216

I'm not in love them


Ocbard

I've used them in Brussels once, and they were ridiculously expensive.


house-is-life

All for it!


EisweinEisbein

They are bad without a proper infrastructure. In the city I work they struggle with scooters parked on sideways and scooter used on sideways and on the wrong side. I think they could be a valuable addition to the mix, but the infrastructure must be build first. Like the parking situation would be so easy just convert every 10th car parking space into a scooter parking lot. For the driving on the sidewalk, if there is no good biking infrastructure they are no good.


Breaker1ove

Personal Scooter? Hell yah. Rentals? Hell no. Plus the people who use them do not follow the rules most of the time, Well because its not their scooter so they dont care. Or they just end up being chucked in the water and that is pretty shit. I say if you ever thinking of getting an E scooter then just buy one and follow the rules of using one.


MrAlf0nse

They are ok but fail to deliver for a couple of reasons : They don’t replace short car journeys because short car journey people aren’t going to walk 500m to find a scooter, they will drive 500m for milk. So private ownership is the answer With most tech, early adopters are risk takers. And so risk takers are the first people seen to be riding the scooters. This means idiots with little regards for safety and low impulse control or drunk people. This means they attract attention to their stunts. Some would argue this deters drivers from adopting the scooter because it looks dangerous. In the plus side they are better than cars in cities and they force a different type of driving in a city…slower and less aggressive


superalt72

Too much possible pollution tbh, they get trashed alot and are frequently relaced


John_EightThirtyTwo

They don't have those app rental scooters in my town, but I've tried them in other places. They're essentially just like [vuvuzelas](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vuvuzela), those plastic horns that were a fad at soccer matches, in that they're awesome when I'm using them but annoying as shit when used by anybody else.


epoisses_lover

If people leave them in proper places, I’d like them more. Also, people don’t exercise proper safety precautions when riding them. These things can go fairly fast, and a lot of people ride them without helmets. Imagine getting into an accident without a helmet.


Antmelo_

I think it's a good idea, but these companies don't have good intentions. Their ultimate aim is privatized transportation, and their success ultimately undercuts well-funded public transit because lawmakers can point to them and gush about how much it works and how they're truly helping or whatever. Also as others have said, the execution of just dumping hundreds of these scooters on cities literally overnight is awful


bothVoltairefan

needs a bit more idiot/jackass proofing, and also, more allowance for moving them out of the way before the theft alarm thing goes off than I've seen.


dashingThroughSnow12

If one puts an engine of some sort on a thing, it is immediately a problem. Reckless driving. The danger that other people on the road may misjudge your speed. There are solutions for those issues. For the e-scooter apps, they could easily have accelerometers on the scooters and cause more reckless drivers to pay more.


Random1berian

Idk dude but they don't seem to understand thst they are not made for the sidewalk, one slammed into me and broke my arm


NilRecurring

Could be ok, but in reality these last on average for 2 months before they break, and produce pretty great amounts of electronic waste. There also was a study done in Germany that found that these don't replace car trips at all, instead competing with public transport, bikes and foot traffic.


LinkTheFoxy

i'd prefer private e-scooters nobody touched them before me and they're better taken care of


Hareemoii

I've seen too many drunk kids chucking these into rivers and lakes. I've used them and they're usually pretty good for here and there travel and cheap too. Not sustainable though because the turn-over rate for damage is so high.


Fragraham

This sounds like a solved problem in the rental world. If a renter damages the profuct, they pay for it.


josephe_23

Used that shit for 3 days and paid 70€


SherlockHolmesOG

Dangerous, no place to ride, can’t ride on side walk, cars on road, need mass public transit not tiny electric scooters. Dumb


3cells

Anything with a battery is absolutely terrible for a multitude of reasons.


narodon-

If it is somewhat flat, bikes are a better solution


ekmantii

Some people seem to find them practical and fun, so that's great, but I also found one dumped at a grave in the middle of the graveyard once and I feel like there should be a better system around them, like there is with bikes you can rent in some cities


Fuzzwuzzle2

Well for starters who the hell are those 2 on the left designed for? E bike rental would be better i would argue a larger percentage of customers would have a better understanding of how they work vs a scooter they've never been on


Separate_County_5768

A very good one. I never use them, but makes the city more pleasant.


incrediblynormalpers

I think people should get insured on their own ev's so that they feel more responsible for what they do on them, or something like this, maybe just fk these app scooters in generally because these people are giving us all a bad name on their little joy rides to wherever they abandon the scooter in the end


NorthwestPurple

they're great but have growing pains thanks to car-centric infrastructure and the need of the companies to turn a profit


MouseMouseM

They increase the awareness of the lack of bicycle and non-car infrastructure. I don’t use them and I know people who have been injured on them, so I have a negative perception from a user standpoint. However, getting people out of cars- and increasing the need for protected lanes- I definitely like that.


Skylleur

I don't like it at all, except for tourism where the 6 E scooter brands of Malaga helped me have almost 0 cost of transportation (with free rides)


LongConvexity1

To me they seems just slightly different from bikes and are great for transit around cities. My only concerns are 1) keeping them off sidewalks (just like we wan't to get bikes off sidewalks and into protected lanes) and 2) they get abandoned in random spots and block things. I think the citibike system of have a bunch of places to drop off seems good but I guess that's expensive.


YpsilonY

On their own, I like the idea of them, but my country made it unnecessarily difficult to own one with regulations. Like, you need to get a license plate for them. Way to much effort. In combination with the apps, I also like the principle. I mostly use them when I need to make a trip between 1 and 3 km in a hurry and can't wait for the next tram/bus/subway/whatever. Like if I have to get to the main station in 10 minutes to catch my train, but the subway only arrives in 8 minutes. The usability could be better though. I wish there was a unified app that I could use to ride any of the vehicles in my city or even other cities I'm visiting. I hate having to install and register with a gazzillion different apps that all do essentially the same. Standardization for the win!


JakeWoofles

Owning one? Great! If they were legal on the cycle lanes here in Amsterdam I'd probably buy one for myself and use it for commuting But the mass rental companies seem like a bad impact on a city. They get dumped everywhere, driven wrecklessly, and they cause a lot of accidents Not only that but I think a lot of people don't realise how expensive they are. My ex and I used them to scoot around a few cities in Europe and often we realised an Uber would be abiut the same price.


jingleheimerschitt

I think e-scooters themselves are a good option for micromobility, but I think the e-scooter shares done via third-party apps have been implemented poorly in most places. Every major city in the U.S. that has tried e-scooter shares (Spin, Lime, etc.) has dealt with broken scooters littering sidewalks and roads and even waterways and even worse relations between drivers and non-drivers. Personally, I think the problem is that e-scooter -- and many e-bike -- share apps/programs aren't really trying to solve specific, unique transportation or mobility problems in a given area, they're just trying to make a profit. Municipalities treat these programs as a quick fix for major structural and systemic issues with public transportation. No one who decides to put e-scooters on the sidewalks of a city is primarily concerned with who will use them, how they will use them, what problems they create, or the long-term outlook for them. I'll never forget the state representative in the Colorado state legislature from the Boulder area [voting against regional rail funding](https://coloradosun.com/2020/01/06/front-range-rail-colorado-bill-kc-becker/) in part because she viewed e-scooters as a disruptor and you just don't know what other tech might "disrupt" the public transit "market" so we shouldn't do anything with regional rail right now. Whenever I see one of my city's shared e-scooters knocked over in the middle of a sidewalk, I remember how easily people -- including and maybe especially our representatives -- are distracted by shiny, novel things. What else could that e-scooter money be spent on? Where I live, it could go to improving our bus service!


mittyhands

From a mobility perspective, they're great. My city, Denver, has a ton of them and they're very popular. We lack the infrastructure to properly accommodate them in some places, though, and they are commonly used on the sidewalks which is a problem for pedestrians. Just by adding protected bike lanes and converting street parking spaces into bike/scooter parking areas would get rid of the downsides almost entirely. TLDR they're great but could be better.


Electricerger

Rent-a-bike solutions are nice (Bixi, CitiBike), so I can see why they'd think to try this, but I think cities aren't building the proper infrastructure to make this as clean an implementation. You want lots of distributed stations to dock these in, which is a big ask (lots of maintenance and last mile), but they can be very low impact and high reward. The other benefit that bike solutions like Bixi had over the scooters was that you didn't use an app, and could instead use your metro/credit card at a station. I know it's hard to believe, but not everyone has/needs/can afford data.


Shot_Profession_4176

works cool, just a bit too expensive where I live. But it is in regular use and my city is not a capital at all (90k ppl)


C0smiccuttlefish

In general I like almost anything that is not a car. But, until there is infrastructure that is separate from sidewalks for them (or anything that moves faster than a pedestrian) I’ll wait.


Bloroxius

Google indivual scooter life cycle stats from bird or lime. Making more plastic garbage forever is not a plan


ShinyNewThrowaway007

In a country where people are educated and sensible enough overall to not leave them as a sidewalk obstacle course, sure, whatever, the rest of the discussion is cool. But the number of times i stared down someone as i moved the shitty scooter they shamelessly left in the middle of the sidewalk is insane. I understand the spite of the river-throwing folk.


nanabubb

We had problems with this near my work, because people don't wear any safety gear and start going way too fast I really like them, and it was super popular when implemented but I don't really know what could be done about the safety issue


EmilCCC

Think it would be awesome if it could be available to folks without phones and data plans, and the companies were wiling to work with individual communities to come up with plans unique to their infrastructure.


ShyGuyLink1997

Pricey, but I fuck with it.


sutichik

Laughs in Siberia...


pumpkin_seed_oil

Their average lifespan is 1-5 months before they become expensive trash and its just a matter of time before the rental scooter go the way of the seamless rental bikes like Obike or Ofo [This is where they are now](https://heute-at-prod-images.imgix.net/2020/4/26/56062ed1-6b1d-447d-8b41-566e40b708c3.jpeg?auto=format,compress&w=600)


isakhwaja

Noooo, just get your own scooters. Or have shared bikes with specific places to park them and a time limit of like 3 hours so that people don’t keep them outside. In Austin there are scooters EVERYWHERE, on the sidewalk, on the street, in front of my door, up your moms ass too. The point is that people are lazy as fuck and leave them wherever


FrankHightower

I like those giant ones in the picture. How many people fit on those?


sryforbadenglishthx

they brak quite quickly because they are treated like garbage and that causes a lot of waste also they are an alternative to walking and biking and both are better for your health


majorex64

Been to conventions in other cities that had these- fucking life saver getting around an unfamiliar city center without having to rent a car.


crotchrottingplague

[scootin's bad](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbJbGZbsVMw&ab_channel=StyxMan%C3%B3)


MyBroIsNotMyHoe

I know pedestrians hate them because most users drive them on the sidewalks and those who drive cars are annoyed when they are driven on the road, where they should be used. I just hope they stay around long enough for people to realise that we need better infrastructure.


itemluminouswadison

seems good. i've never needed one living in a walkable community though. for far away things i'd take a bus instead


Talenduic

If tthere's nothing else around, why not. But honestly those things are dangerous because even if you have good reflexes , the very high center of gravity compared to the minuscule wheels means that you can't brake hard enough during emergencies without passing over the bars compared to a byccicle and also that you will have a bad crash if your wheel drop in a small pothole that wouldn,t be a problem for a child bycicle with 24 " wheels. If you're an adult agile enough to drive something on two wheels (which means also be capable of turning and braking to avoid absurd accidents caused by others, not just being able to turn the throttle on an e-scooter and be a danger to everyone else), get a bicycle after 200 years of selection it's still the most efficient way of rolling one human on its power adn be able to break and steer effectively.


SadLittleOctopus

I hate them. They litter the sidewalks and are terrible for the environment because of how disposable they are. They require an internet connection and that's not very smart to need a connection to be used. The only thing going for them is that they're solar powered. It's much better to own an escooter of your own. This will cost less in the long run for commutes and everything and you don't ever have the worry of needing it and the ones on the streets may be broken, or not have enough charge. I think, myself, bicycles are better than any escooter as long as the places you're trying to go have no difference in elevation, because then a battery isn't needed to get you places at all, you are the battery and motor there. But I also am a big fan of Onewheels and self balancing transportation technology. They are probably the most fun way to get around. They're much much more efficient than electric cars because you aren't moving 2+ tons of metal everywhere you go, they cost around 2 cents of electricity to charge (at least here in the pacific northwest) for about 15 miles of range, which is plenty for a fun day and short commutes.


Zerodyne_Sin

Same problem as bikes which is that cars will try to assert their dominance with the threat of death. I definitely like the bike and scooters but the only problem they have is that governments refuse to allow space for them in car-centric North America. Hopefully that changes soon


ImWithSt00pid

I hate these more than anything. Idiots running them the wrong way on one-way streets. Or they dump them where they are done riding them. I have ran so many of them over in my box truck when they are dumped in an alley. I hope whoever the last user was gets billed for the damage.


Mccobsta

Escooters are neat but not legal to use in my country even though cops don't give a shit Would be nice to have them to get around city's quicker sadly we don't have the Infrastructure in many of them


Inevitable_Cry_4982

They're a good idea in theory but they clutter sidewalks and make life more difficult for people in wheelchairs/people with strollers


KelBear25

They are a bit of novelty/Tourist trap but I can see how they might be useful to get to bus stops or short distances. I'd much rather see investments in Bike Lockers and bike security. I Could see bike lockers as a business opportunity. Pay like a parking fee.


theorizable

I'm totally fine with them even on bike paths. Our issue in the US isn't that people use scooters on bike paths, it's that we have horrible infrastructure for bikes/scooters to begin with.


richarddickpenis

Eh, I mean I've ridden them twice for fun but bikes go faster than these things. Plus they're kinda hard to stay balanced on, not super safe for traffic. Not a fan of seeing these left in the street or laying on the sidewalk, not that it's super inconvenient, it's just an eyesore.


shavedaffer

As a cyclist, I hate these stupid things. They’re always slower than bicycles and usually in enough of a group to force cyclists into traffic to pass them while they sip Starbucks and take selfies for Instagram. The trade off is that they’re often being thrown into dumpsters and off of bridges so it’s going to be a cost burden on the company that brings them here. They should cease to exist.


GGRollo

I used them myself for about a year when I didn’t have a car and had a fairly long walk to work. In the swampy Hampton Roads summer heat it was a lifesaver. I got a kick out of riding them too it was good fun. I think it’s debatable if they’re something we should commit to though. I forgot where but I think a study took a look at the environmental impact and of course mining for the battery materials was straight up bad but the real kicker were the contractors paid to drive all over the place picking them up. That and their short lifespan leaves it not making much ecological sense to make a big push for these things. Not saying saying no one should ride these things but I think in general the concept of micro mobility has been co-opted by silicone valley tech bros trying to find the next big thing they can sell to your mayor. I would just be wary of big pushes for them and if you really like them just buy your own if you can. You can get good ones these days for less than $500. I think I was referencing this article btw https://news.ncsu.edu/2019/08/impact-of-e-scooters/#:~:text=People%20think%20of%20electric%20scooters,green%20than%20several%20other%20options.


Jek_the-snek

E scooters are a good idea, but the rental companies are really poorly implemented


Sharp-Chard4613

Too expensive


TheSpaceBetweenUs__

Preferable to cars but a bad excuse for not expanding cycling. You can just as easily set up bike sharing in place of scooters.


avskrap

I hate them so much


Poorserver

I fucking hate them so much.


yeah_sure_youbetcha

Love the idea, hate the implementation. I live in a tourist town, so 10% of their use is point A to point B transportation. The other 90% is assholes burning rubber, weaving through walkers on the multi use path, chasing geese across the park, and being just all around pricks.


Geoarbitrage

Some inventor needs to find a way to make them automatically stand up. The downtown area looks bad with them laying on their side all over.


Novanew14

As a solution, it's not enough unless used in Tandem with public transport and walkability.


SnooCalculations141

Where I live they’re ridiculously expensive.


hyggepuppiescoffee

A couple of university students in my city have been killed by cars while riding them. While I think they are great for alternatives to cars, I don't think they can safely co-exist with cars unless there are some big changes. Its already really risky to just cross the street in my city because everyone thinks they are entitled to turn right and cut of pedestrians, but I worry for scooter riders because they dont typically wear helmets and cars in my city don't look out for them, even worse than with bikes.


MyGrandpasGotTalent

I work in a hospital part time. The number of ED patients we get bc of e-scooter accidents is mind blowing.


taylatina

They should have docking infrastructure like city share bike.


Traditional-Lion7391

Bicycles, anyone?


Secret_Guide_4006

I saw someone on a bike crack their head open because someone left one of these in the street and they didn’t see it. They’re a menace and I’d rather have better bus and train lines instead of scooters everywhere. It’s just another individualized solution to what should be PUBLIC transportation


TheXenoRaptorAuthor

I've [heard some bad things about the industry](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9aeMccUPY0), so I'm skeptical.


rurdytoboogie

They give the transients something to take apart


No-Plate-3041

I think it’s great for the people, however it’s known that the manufacturing of these batteries is horrible for the environment, I would just stick to shared bikes honestly.


obidamnkenobi

In most cases I suspect they replace walking, or possibly biking, not driving. Or replace public transit rides? I'd be curious about any studies.


quite_unprepared

Bike and scooter shares are part of the reason I’ve been able to stay car (ownership) free. They’re part of the network of things I use including buses, trains, my own bike, walkable neighborhoods, and occasional car rentals. They also help me transport visitors who aren’t used to being car free or walking everywhere. My city has plenty of the scooter parking and other problems people complain about in this thread, but remember that perfect is the enemy of good.


dalugogav2

Personally, from what I see in my city, ride share scooters are just e-waste. Lots of them around and almost no one use them. Most e-scooter I see are owned by the rider here. Myself I prefer cycling.


Flavourtown69

We just got them in my city and whilst I think they’re fun our city has 0 infrastructure to support them. Most of our footpaths are so small you can’t walk two abreast, there’s little to no bike lanes and all of the road/footpath surfaces are uneven. It’s dangerous to ride them on a footpath and several people have been injured already plus they get left in the middle of walkways creating danger for sight impaired, elderly or disabled people. Overall a no from me. At this time at least.


Panzerv2003

I like them but I hate people who just leave them wherever they want (usually in the middle of a sidewalk)


SockRuse

Small part of the solution. Work out for some people, don't for others. Become a problem in themselves when improperly regulated and end up littering sidewalks or thrown into rivers. The end.


Santuse

People deliberately destroy them and that's why we can't have nice things.


adrien5567

Problem of this : it doesn't replace cars, it replace walking


Practical_Hospital40

They can help streamline bus service as buses no longer need so many stops or deviations that can replace peak bus to rail feeder services in cities like Chicago


crimpers

Unfortunately not a good answer. These things burn a shitload of resources (avg lifecycle of one is just 3mo and collecting them to charge uses loads of vans) which would be fine if they replaced cars or motorbikes, but at least by me they instead only attract prior cyclists and pedestrians making the net environmental impact strongly negative.


childrenovmen

Imagine if apartment complexes had their own ebike/scooter storage for residents, you simply tap your fob on the scooter or bike, it registers that you have it, then return when you get back… did i just create a massive solution to city resident car dependence?


ebiker_bulgaria

In Bulgaria, Europe we have in our capital 3 or 4 e-scooters companies. Despite I'm e biker, I hate those companies as they don't apply any control over where their customers park e-scooters. Our municipality as well don't make any effort to control where people left those e-scooters - the effect is that they are left in the center of squares, in building entrances, on pedestrian and bike lanes, on rails, toilets....anywhere. I blame mainly the municipality, but this issue makes harder for others to move, so it is not a solution. If the above problem wasn't present they might help for short distances around 0 km, thought to rent e-car is only twice the price. So economically e-scooter renting is overpriced. Also you don't pay only for distance, but for time, meaning as you have to use pedestrian traffic lights, often you have to wait 1-2 minutes. In the end if you have to pay for 5-10 km 10 EUR it is not worth. In addition, in EU many e-scooter renting companies are applying for special ecological EU programs, so they actually are exploiting such programs, and they don't depend on actual use by e-scooter users. Not sustainable solution in my opinion (but applied for my local environment).


EmpereurAuguste

Sometime those can be very annoying… They are supposed to go on the bike lane/the road yet a lot of their user still drive at full speed on the side walk…