T O P

Stereotypes Suck

Stereotypes Suck

dreamtofalligators

God damn is "transbians can't be butch" a weird take. This isn't the 1940s, women can present however they want.


WyrdAlice

Terfs: Gender is a construct, just because I don't shave or wear makeup doesn't make me any less feminine. Also terfs: That transgender person is wearing trousers. Clearly a man.


eponinesflowers

Terfs have such misogynistic ideologies while pretending to be feminists. Like reducing women to their anatomy and ability to carry children in order to exclude trans women. I’m cis, but I have PCOS, as well as fertility issues in my family, so it would likely be extremely difficult for me to have children biologically. When I mention this, terfs are like “well I didn’t mean people like YOU” and I’m like “you literally just said that people who can’t become pregnant aren’t women??”


whomstveallyaint

This 100%. according to r\*wling logic you need to menstruate to be a woman and people who don't aren't women and people who do are. this means once you go through menopause you are no longer a woman according to our favorite (least favorite) author.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Yeah, we girls/women are not just some baby-making machines. There is more to us than just having ovaries and uterus.


QueerBallOfFluff

It's not like having those are predetermination of genitals or AGAB either. I'm AMAB but ended up with a (mostly undeveloped) uterus. 🤷🏻‍♀️


barleyqueen

Most of these bigots scream about biology and chromosomes and genitals while completely ignoring the fact that there is so much diversity out there.


alicethewitch

Don't worry, constantly moving the goal post is pretty much Bigory 101. If you've already selected your major in Hating Yourself and Women in General then it might go under Terf 101, it's pretty much the same class with except for some homeworks the teacher gives are different.


ComfortableSherbert8

The goalpost bit is spot on. If they were ever to meet a post-everything intersex trans woman with a healthy uterus, they'd still go with "socialized as" or chromosomes. Their arguments have no scientific or statistical bias, only an emotional and bigoted one


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Amethyst-Diamond-45

I also used to be a TERF myself (now I heavily regret that), I hated trans people because I thought they want to reinforce gender norms, but later when I discovered trans subreddits on Reddit, I realized I was absolutely wrong and I was a bigot back then, I really regret that.


Bitter_Froyo_6742

I think a lot of people dipped their toes into TERF-ism for a few years in the earls 2010s because of how much misinformation and misrepresentation was out there. for a long time, the only trans representation that existed was on problematic trans people. Which yeah, every community has a problematic subsections of people, but it leads to stereotypes and unfounded biases when trans women or black men are ONLY ever being represented by depicting the absolute worst those demographics has to follow. Everyone I know who admits to having been in what looking back were some TERF-y corners of the internet seems to have the same story of "I was hardcore feminist, I saw terrible people who identified as trans women being extremely problematic and sexist and perpetuating harmful norms against women (or more often being used as a tool by others to perpetuate these idea), but then I actually met some trans people and it turns out they're just normal people trying to live a life where their reflection doesn't send them into a suicidal spiral." Jk Rowling would actually be a super cool case study in the online radicalization of feminist spaces in the early 2010s, not unlike what we saw happen with adolescent boys, YouTube conspiracy theories, and the alt-right. Both groups take kernels of truth and then use those kernels to lure in young or otherwise impressionable groups into escalating those beliefs (Caitlyn Jenner *does*suck, and she is toxic sexist trash who's identity as a woman is rooted in harmful stereotypes. But so are a lot of cis women and I don't see anyone freaking out about the churches the way they do about trans friendly bathroom setups.) Rowling is in an age demographic that consistently fails to discern trustworthy from untrustworthy sources of online media, and struggles to distinguish if something online is serious or satire based on context clues. Mix in that her version of progressivism has been viewed as regressive by actual leftists for well over a decade and way too much free time to lurk on the internet, and it's no wonder that TUMBLR feminism birthed so many TERFS


The-Shattering-Light

You learned. Your mind was open to the fact that evidence contradicted a position you held, and so you abandoned that position. Don’t regret that you once believed something harmful, celebrate that you questioned your assumptions and changed your belief - that’s a positive thing which should always be celebrated!


tvandraren

I guess we have the right to be deluded at some point of our lives and what's important is that we overcome those pits of hell. If I were cis, I could have become an incel before that was even a thing because misogyny was rampant on my teen years. And I say, if I were cis, because there was always something that kept all that rage and resentment inside while I empathized with women in everything. I regret being that dumb for so many years, but I guess my environment wasn't helpful. I met my first gf and I became such an invested (trans)feminist that I cracked and many things started to make sense.


IniMiney

Reddit helped someone be LESS transphobic? Wow. 👏🏿👏🏿👏🏿


Amethyst-Diamond-45

IKR, TERFs accuse trans people of enforcing gender stereotypes, but they also invalidate GNC trans people.


drunkbeforecoup

Nah, terf would say something about a woman's jaw or her hairline because being a terf directly stimulates the phrenology center of the brain.


LiquidCryptic

It seems like a waste of time for a true feminist to go after and put down trans people. Feminism should be open to any human being who cares about women's issues and rights. Shutting the door on your own supporters is a good way to lose support and shut down your own issues.


walking_in_the_wind

Sorry, I’m a bit behind, what are terfs ? Thank you !!


WyrdAlice

Trans Exclusionary Radical "Feminists". Social conservatives and reactionies that have co-opted feminist gender-theory to justify blatant transphobia. Because of the fact that a lot of vocal transphobia has become completely entangled with "feminist" thought (paticuarly in places like the UK) the term terf has become synonymous with publicly active mainstream anti-trans activists.


walking_in_the_wind

Ohhh, okay thank you. And that’s fucking stupid, if they’re feminists, they should support trans people too !! Idk their reasoning doesn’t make sense lmfao


sorryimindisguise

Most terfs will unironically call themselves feminists with one breath and say that trans women aren't women because women have "xx chromosomes" or "women have a uterus." They will reduce being a woman to bodies to exclude trans women, while also often rejecting gender non-conformity


QueerBallOfFluff

It's biological reductivism or biological essentialism. If you've heard those terms before alarm bells should already be ringing, if you haven't it's saying all human behaviour, rights, and social roles are determined by our biological development. And yes, it's pretty obvious what that means for AFAB people, it's the same as what incels consider women "for".


walking_in_the_wind

Ugh jeez, that’s annoying. Ffs when will people realize that your sex isn’t your gender ?!


sorryimindisguise

Oh, the issue usually goes deeper than that, sadly. Take JK Rowling as a great example, her most recent book has a villain who dresses as a women to kill. It's literally just what Terfs think trans people are; potentially dangerous, mentally unsound men pretending to be women to take advantageof women's spaces.... That fear is informed by Rowlings own sexual assault (which she brought up herself when she tried to defend a transphobic comment she made). She's projecting her fear onto trans women, as a lot of terfs who aren't conservative often do.


butnotTHATintoit

Right? Transbians can be whatever the fuck type of 'bians they please.


damnitsdeirdre

shameless hijack but r/mtfbutch living proof


eatpoetry

Tbh as a cis woman Ive never even had to think about that one, but I can imagine it. One of my good friends is a trans guy/ace and he struggles with how he wants to do things like grow his hair out or paint his nails without getting misgendendered.


angelicravens

I know cis men that have long hair and paint their nails. It's pretty gnc but they're still men same as your friend would be. Most people that would misgender him for doing so will likely midgender him anyways unfortunately


eatpoetry

Yeah. Ive told him that. He has a lot of childhood trauma and stuff (me too) and even if he knows it logically it's still hard for him to convince himself it's okay.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Tell your friend that a random internet stranger is saying he's absolutely valid.


eatpoetry

I will!


BotulismBot

Yeah! Travis McElroy rocks painted nails and hair and he's manly AF.


littleone82

Tell him that another internet stranger also supports him and agrees that he is absolutely valid!


eatpoetry

I screenshotted it and sent it to him ❤


IAmEvasive

Hopping on the support train because your friend is absolutely valid and a beautiful soul and should be reminded of this!! Come on everyone we got more spots on this train so jump on!


eatpoetry

He said he was currently painting his nails when I texted him and sent hearts


etherealparadox

this is me (here as an ally), I really want to wear a skirt but im scared lol


itsnotthecounty

As a former butch lesbian (now FtM) this “argument” is bizarre to me — and massively misogynistic! Women can dress, act and behave in ways that are not typically and traditionally feminine. Femininity is not a monolith. Inferring otherwise is just sexist and is not just harmful to trans women but to all of them. Well, it impacts all of us on a broad scale too — I would love to harness my divine feminine energy without my own identity being invalidated too. Or scorned because we treat being feminine as the least desirable outcome. Silly. To all butch/GNC transbians — **dress however the fuck you want!** You are killing it.


QueerBallOfFluff

r/MTFButch for all you trans women who have masc or masc-adjacent expression.


PiscatorialKerensky

Bless you, trans butches. I'm not trans but my gender identity is literally butch, and I hate how people conflate masc expression with masc identity. You guys are valid af.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Same, I'm also cis and my gender expression is soft butch/moderately masc, i made this post to validate them.


ErroneousRecipe

😲 hello my people!


warlordzephyr

THANK YOU


PassTheSaltJeremy

The gender envy I get from looking at that sub lol. I really wish I was able to pull of a more masculine leaning look without coming across as a man.


Fluttering_Moth

Yeah it's uncomfortable feeling like you need to overcompensate with how fem you present in order to pass. Personally I really like dressing like that anyways, but I could imagine it being really sucky if you felt forced to present yourself in a certain way.


QueerBallOfFluff

Those are feelings... But at the end of the day it's subtle things that can make a difference, and confidence goes a long way. Like, assuming you're wearing the same flannel shirt and jeans as you already have: Pull the jeans up slightly more, wear a low cut cami under the flannel, and only do it up to the button 2 inches below the neck hem of the cami, then roll the sleeves up to just above the elbows. Even plain makeup helps, even if you can barely see it! It sounds ridiculous, but it really does make a difference.


NoAutumn

also, r/GuildValkyrie!


GenniTheKitten

Thanks for the shoutout :) We can’t wait to see all of y’all over here!!


HollyFreak33

Honestly fuck those stereotypes. I’m gonna wear a Slayer tank top whenever tf i want. Edit: Btw, just a question for everyone. Is cutting off the sleeves and widening the arm holes for better air flow on a t-shirt mangling it? My mom has been yelling at me for it and i think she’s fucking dumb.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Yeah, be happy being yourself. :D


notbrokenjustgay

Nope that is being creative and resourceful and pure amazing! It’s also a legit thing people have always done - t-shirts are like a basic design one can style however and sometimes that involves scissors for cutting off armholes, changing necklines, cropping, fringing etc Maybe give her that perspective...it’s not thrashing clothes in a negative way, it’s making awesome styles that you like!


Regreddit4321

Pls do❤️😍


spring_goddess22

My mohawk says "fuck you"


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Haha, Your comment is really funny.


spring_goddess22

Thanks. I try lol


estu0

Throw the whole idea that trans women need to be hyper feminine away


damnitsdeirdre

the whole idea


postpostpostleftist

Or that they need to pass or be feminine at all, or that they need to medically transition. It’s all a fucked-up culture we don’t need.


sorryimindisguise

God damn, I love to see this kind of stuff. I struggled with my presentation for years in an effort to avoid misgendering, but slowly started presenting more masculine in the past year. I've always loved things like short hair, comfortable clothes, and strong women, but assumed those things couldn't apply to me if I wanted to be seen as valid. Now, I enjoy being just a few steps shy of biker dyke. Occasional misgendering be damned, I like how I look and I know for a fact that I'm hot


Peeper_Collective

I’ve honestly mastered the vibe of Butch lesbian, my friends tell me I just resonate Butch lesbian vibes, so yes, trans women can indeed be Butch lesbian. We don’t owe anyone femininity..


If_haven_heart

I get this alot from people when i tell them i’m a trans tom boy Like, i dont mind the whole ‘pretty in pink’but it aint my style, i’d love to wear darkish colours and leggings withmy skirt evtect


PheerthaniteX

Tomboys too!


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Yeah! :)


Awesomewunderbar

This is a stereotype??? Man. I feel so sheltered sometimes. Lol.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Yes, unfortunately, trans women are stereotyped as hyper feminine women.


HollyFreak33

Well a lot of trans women do like being hyper feminine. It’s still just as valid as every other expression, though.


PassTheSaltJeremy

True, but growing up and being inundated with all that imagery while on the early parts of trans internet was one of the biggest hurdles for me in figuring out my gender. I thought I couldn't be trans because I wasn't feminine enough, even though I've had crushing dysphoria for as long as I've remembered. Luckily, it seems to be better nowadays. I really hope trans kids don't feel the same pressure to conform to gender norms nowadays.


Awesomewunderbar

That's dumb. So yes. I very much agree with your post! Trans women can be any kind of lesbian they want! :)


friedashes

Trans women suffer from a warped "damned if you do, damned if you don't" misogyny. If we are feminine, then we are living out a sexist fantasy of womanhood. If we are masculine, then we are obviously just men who call ourselves women. So it's not really a stereotype so much as you're not actually allowed to be anything at all as a trans woman. The same is true for sexuality. We can't be gay or straight because they have a pathological explanation, complete with published papers, for both.


gansgar

Yeah me too. I'm so happy growing up as trans woman in an offline safe space that gives a frick on gender norms. It really helped me settle with my identity early on.


halloweenynuna

But like, what if that's what you want? People need to let people people they way they wanna person.


NoAutumn

trans tomboys, too! r/GuildValkyrie


Shronkey1

Yes! Burn it!


Skye_17

Not a binary trans woman (despite the flair) but heck yeah I'm butch


damnitsdeirdre

NB BUTCHES


Skye_17

Hell yeah! edit: also hi lol deidre


damnitsdeirdre

hey skye :P


goodlostbonding

Yes! There's nothing less butch, less lesbian or less lovely about a trans butch woman. Love yall.


Leather-Contact

Trans women can present however the fuck then want.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

True


aureliaprimera

Am a trans woman. Am relatively butch atm. can confirm.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

:)


damnitsdeirdre

r/MTFButch


littleone82

And you are 100% valid!


Grave_Tunes

Lol. Express your gender how you want. Its none of my business.


70701

Trust me, yes they can....they reeeeeally can >:)


shdwfng

One of the most liberating things in my trans journey has been reclaiming masc clothes for myself. I still definitely lean fem, but sometimes just wearing a tank top and baggy sweats (that my butt looks a lot cuter in now) is really nice


PiscatorialKerensky

I once heard a good that eventually during your transition you end up "cautiously approaching your AGAB from the other side", i.e. re-asserting expressions usually associated with it into your actual gender. There was a trans dude on RuPaul's drag race recently that really embodied that.


Igotbored112

Its almost like anyone can do whatever they feel like doing and dress however they want with whatever gender identity they have because imposing artificial social dress codes for people based on their gender, trans-ness, or sexual orientations is bigoted, arbitrary, and narrow minded.


alienwithissues

This and the "trans men can't be femboys" stereotype disgust me.


IniMiney

Trans lesbian tomboy checking in: I hate heels to death and stopped wearing skirts and dresses years ago (I might still rock a nice goth or punk dress/skirt look tho. I don't even like makeup that much and long hair annoys me but I feel like I HAVE TO do that to not be called sir or asked if I'm a boy or girl and that shit sucks.


IMFlorecentFace

Still not used to thinking of myself as butch but it also strikes me as generally the correct term


damnitsdeirdre

Hello! We over at r/MTFButch are living proof! Come say hello :)


ARealCis-Girl

As a trans lesbian, I respect that


CollaredWitch

Question for clarification purposes: Does tomboy count as butch or is it a whole category on its own?


rs505

Butch is a specific lesbian subculture, while tomboy is an umbrella term used for masculine women, including straight women. So, I guess that butch lesbians would fit in the tomboy umbrella? I know that some people do have issues with the term tomboy though, so keep that in mind!


tangyhoneymustard

I mean they’re different words. I guess tomboy can also be a term that straight people would use too. You never hear a masculine straight women call herself butch. I know that for me, tomboy feels a bit more like a childish term so I don’t use it. A lot of butches were called tomboys when we were little so some still use the term. Idk just my take on it


damnitsdeirdre

gender nonconformity is gender nonconformity


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Well, I have always thought tomboy as the synonym for butch.


SammySoapsuds

I personally associate "tomboy" more with kids (was called one for being sporty but am pretty dang femme in my presentation) but I also would never like...argue with someone who referred to themselves that way! I think it's interesting to read all the different regional/age associations with words like that on here.


CollaredWitch

Then I can confirm: am butch, am trans, am happy!


SiyinGreatshore

But I


ekta_sissy

True stereotypes is like illness ladies.


beanswitha_b_emoji_2

r/guildvalkyrie


__LesbianQueen__

If that can’t be, why is this my type then??? Anyway my genderfluid butch self just gonna vibe over here, I like people like me.


yellow_halo

Butch trans women are amazing and valid!!


bertrandite

there's a butch trans woman who works at my local grocery store who always flags me into her line every time she sees me and compliments my outfits and it makes me blush every time butches make my nonbinary femme lesbian heart do a happy and trans butches are no different


LuminousQuinn

Like honestly I think I get read as butch sometimes. I am really just an athlete, and my work uniform makes me look that way.


tvandraren

Some of us may struggle with masculinity a little bit and this statement can be so hurtful. I identify as trans futch woman. I wouldn't mind going even more masc with leather clothes and some Marteens like a badass biker, but I'll definitely want to have a femme expression for anything else. And how can that be not valid? Fuck TERFs.


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Also fuck truscums! :)


tvandraren

Apparently my initial comment is at the top on controversial :')


tvandraren

Yes, I knew I was missing someone 🤔


orbcat

Nice flair


tvandraren

Thank you, sister


tootired117

*chefs kiss*


chartheanarchist

My first "therapist" said I couldn't be a gay man because I wasn't feminine enough. Jokes on him I'm an demi lesbian woman and I'm butch as fuck


The-Shattering-Light

Butch trans lesbians are amazing!


YourFavoriteTomboy

Me, a super butch transbian: *Nervous laughter*


Amethyst-Diamond-45

Your valid. :)


YourFavoriteTomboy

:) 🖤


ladyutena

Transbian butchers make the world go round ❤


SeefoodDisco

They're also hot as heck


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Doglovincatlady

Don’t forget: Tall studs come in all genders! - xo this tall stud!


That1TrainsGuy

HELL YES SISTER


BigRedSpoon2

How... how does the argument even work? If you're a trans woman, then by default you are a woman. It's about as nonsensical as saying women can't be butch.


AlexStorm1337

Me, a trans woman trying to radiate nerdy butch/punk tomboy energy: *nervous sweating*


Noname2137

I immediately scroled down to see if there are any terfs here


rose_anachronysm

Am literally the most butch girl I know, dating a cis girl who is one of the most butch girls 🤷🏻‍♀️ Also, there is such a high demand fot butch trans girls...


EnsidiusSin

There’s a demand for butch trans girls? I’ve been struggling to date here, but it could be my locale.


angelicravens

There's no demand for Trans women where I'm at :(


cryptid-ok

THANK YOU I’m pre HRT so the only reason I don’t go for a smol tiddie tomboy look is because of ✨dysphoria✨


romeoartiglia

Me, a trans


_kusuosaiki

its literally just transphobia. if trans women are women, and cis women can be masculine, then by extension trans women can be masculine. if you disagree ur a terf


oneiroiMoros

That's like me wanting to be a trans femboy top, it's definitely a thing


Carrot_the_dank

#Fine, I'll do it myself


Williams-Miaa1

Hiiii hey u F as👋


DelilaBee

What garbage