T O P
quoral

I respect someone that can maintain their boundaries and honestly you know you best. Don't change and never compromise this for anyone.


SummerFurBall

Single for 10 years and met my husband at 38. Been married for over 3 years now. I genuinely believe they are out there, but it is a slog. Like you I felt that I would be single forever or stuck in unfulfilling relationships where my choices were always my second or third choices, that just were not right for me. I never had a wedding fantasy, because I never thought it would happen to me. 💜


pleaseletmehide

Hah! Same. And now I'm married! It's awesome. But I have no idea what we're going to do for a cord-tying ceremony. Congratulations to you and your spouse! And OP, they not competing with other men for you. They're competing with your peace and happiness.


Loud9010

Just went on a dreaded tinder date this weekend. Legit told the guy just that, he's competing against me; and I love myself and how my life is. I have never felt more powerful saying that. Dating is supplemental, NOT necessary. Needless to say, we are not meeting again; and I'm perfectly happy with it. lol.


pleaseletmehide

Good for you!


SummerFurBall

Congratulations to you too. Good luck with your quest to find a solution to your cord-tying ceremony. I also agree with your last statement as well ☺️


Livid_Upstairs8725

I totally agree with what you wrote. Similarly, I got a whole rash of crap from men and women for having boundaries and standards. I really thought I may never get married. The only difference is that I never had a wedding fantasy because I am just not wired that way. I also hated princess fantasies as a child. Lol.


SummerFurBall

Yes, like I could never understand the whole 'lower your standards ' crap I would occasionally get. I get women were genuinely trying to help, because to us society is telling us we need to be paired off. But men were only saying that to get into my pants. Both similarly blue screened when I asked them, why should I go into a relationship when I am not sexually attracted to my partner? The only person who benefits would be the man. (This was when I was much younger and couldn't advocate for myself and was willing to put up with soooooooo much crap, in the name of being in a relationship - sexual compatibility was where I drew the line) I had one man retort to that, 'but you get to have sex' and I said, with someone who will make my skin crawl, where I won't get aroused and won't say yes too. He had no answer for that.


Reasonable-Cup-9143

That's OK. It's better to be alone than wish you were safe


WordAffectionate3251

Stick to your guns. Keep your self-esteem. Do not lower your standards for crappy companionship. You will be all the better off for it. As a female who got married for the second time in her 40s, I wasn't looking but found someone when I was enjoying a hobby of mine. I was single for 17 years before that and had the time of my life. Don't settle. And be sure to keep your finances independent in case you need to get out of a situation that turns bad.


LexLurker007

OP this is the way. Give up on online dating, that's not where the good ones are. Stop going to places specifically to meet people, and start doing things that *you enjoy* with other people. Make friends, and if someone cropps up, they will be way better than the knuckle draggers clogging up online dating sites


ConcertinaTerpsichor

There’s a lot of toads out there. But life alone is still much better than life with a shitheel.


murraybee

Woah woah woah, no need to disparage toads here. ;)


ConcertinaTerpsichor

I was using the toad as a metaphor, of course, but I appreciate your full-throated defense of our reptilian siblings.


creationlaw

\*amphibian


ConcertinaTerpsichor

Holy crap. Amphibian.


Severn6

I felt that way until I met my current partner who respects and honours my boundaries. Recently, he crossed one without realizing he was doing it and that resulted in a sincere apology, and a deep discussion- no minimizing my feelings, shrugging it off, justifying or gaslighting. Just a calm, mature conversation. It's sad that I feel lucky, but that seems to be the world we live in - lucky to find a respectful, considerate man.


Monroze

So true, my partner is absolutely amazing, communicates well and respects my boundaries. Always tell him I feel lucky and he tells me you're not lucky, you deserve to be treated well... every time he says that I start crying (happy grateful tears) On the other hand how absolutely fucked is the world that it has to be like that??


Severn6

Agreed. Coming out of my horrible marriage that I left in 2020, I can get teary whenever my guy tells me he respects me etc. Very, very happy atm and it's lovely.


Monroze

I'm so glad you're happy and in a positive relationship, it really is lovely!


Severn6

That's a lovely thing to say, thank you. 🌻 I wish I could inject him into most of the guys out there haha. I have complex ptsd and he just knew, from day one, how to support and care. He's been a very healing influence in my life.


angelmasha

I’m so happy for you, you deserve the best <3


Severn6

Thank you. So do you! We all do. 🌻


[deleted]

[удалено]


Severn6

You probably need more context, which I'm not going to provide. Appreciate your point. 🙂


[deleted]

What’d he do


cousin_of_dragons

Being single is amazing. Since life doesn't guarantee us a happy partnership (I was very unhappily married a while back) we must learn to embrace happiness in being single.


puss_parkerswidow

I met my husband after I spent 6 years single and building myself, and we've been together for almost 23 years now. I can't say you or anyone else will have that experience, but I think for me, it was because I'd spent all that time on myself that I ended up in a good relationship. I'd done as you have and learned what my boundaries are and how to defend them. If I'd never met him, I would not regret doing that for me. In a way I was raising myself, because the way I grew up, there were many pieces missing from the puzzle. I'd had the same disappointing experiences as you describe, back in the 1990s. There was no Tinder, but many men I met wanted sex immediately and acted entitled to it. They also acted like it was all they wanted and that being in a relationship was like going to prison. Even men I was not interested in acted like I was a sex dispenser machine and talking nicely to me ought to result in sex with zero attachments. If he should pass before I do, I'm probably going to just be single for the rest of my life, because I doubt I'd find another person as great as he is. We've worked together and built up a good life. I just don't have faith in other men wanting to do anything that means being responsible like that, because so many seem like they just want to take the good parts and bail when things are difficult. I say that as an older woman going through a serious health issue at the moment. I know there are lots of men who leave a woman when she is seriously ill. My husband isn't going anywhere. He's very obviously here for the hard parts too. We've done a lot of that for each other and it's never felt one-sided the way every other attempt at a relationship I ever had used to feel.


cacestvraimentmoi

Can I ask you how you two met ?


puss_parkerswidow

Through a mutual friend


cacestvraimentmoi

Seems like a good way of meeting someone. All the best to you two.


Paradox_Blobfish

There's nothing wrong with being single. I understand where you come from, and I came to the same conclusion. I just don't trust men at all.


Reasonable-Cup-9143

Better to be alone than wish you were alone.


DanelleDee

I felt like that. I found my man at 34, but it definitely felt like I would never find a functioning adult human being, let alone one I was attracted to.


EirelavEzah

Same here. Dating and having relationships in my 20s was a massive fail. I think I needed to really discover myself in order to understand how to weed out the shitty guys from the good ones.


kitty_withlazers

Same here. I didn't find mine until 37 and that was after being single for two years.


DanelleDee

I was single for the better part of *seven* years. (A couple of three month things in there, but no one serious.)


kitty_withlazers

I'm glad you someone regardless


cacestvraimentmoi

If you don't mind me asking : how did you meet ?


DanelleDee

OkCupid. I found it way better than any of the other apps because of the compatibility score. Eventually I only swiped on people who had taken the time to answer a bunch of the questions and were over a 90% match. We were 94% compatible according to the app, and I am constantly blown away at how easy everything is. I also had my deal breakers listed on my profile. After seven years I was tired of dating for a few weeks before finding out they didn't want kids or were a Stan for Jordan Peterson.


Sea_War_3437

What the hell is wrong with being single? I was married for 15 years my friend. I’ve been single for 5 and they’ve been the best years of my life. Normalize being single. Don’t lower your standards to ever be “not alone”.


No-Transition-8705

I think you need to reframe and adjust your outlook. Think of it as you have your entire life ahead of you and you WON'T be shackled to someone who isn't up to your standards. Look forward to making your life about you and making plans for YOU. Worst case: you end up alone with a great life, friends, family, and occasional/short-lived bouts of loneliness. Best case: your amazing attitude and approach to life attracts a man that will make that same great life even better. My point: I think so many of us are coming to the same conclusions that you are, but we can't allow their shortcomings to diminish our life plans and contentment. They're not worth it :)


MyNextVacation

My single friends are meeting men and starting promising relationships off the apps. I know women who have met men at wine tastings, the gym, regularly cheering for their college or home town team at a sports bar, volunteering, professional networking events, through out local live music scene and as new people moved into the neighborhood or building. I’m sorry you’ve been dealing with these entitled, misogynistic men.


lilkangaroo

That gives me hope. I do have men in my life that I respect so I know they exist but for some reason I can’t meet any :/


CosmicAnosmic

Many of us are in the same boat. I stopped using dating apps because my experiences were giving me such a negative view of men. The same with some of the threads here. However, I have fantastic friendships with a few men who are absolute gems. They're all with partners and it's actually been reassuring for me, seeing what equal and healthy partnerships are meant to be for both to thrive. I can not and will not be in anything less (I tried and my marriage was a disaster.) In the end, I'd rather have these terrific "brothers" in my life than the absolute nonsense offered by others. Life is short and precious, keep pursuing and celebrating your amazing success, and surround yourself with people who respect and treat you well.


Xarpullido

It's better to be single than in bad company.


13Lilacs

This. Every time I am dating someone, or with a lone male friend, I am worried that if we are walking in the woods together or are driving someplace isolated, that they might hurt me/ kill me. I think it's because of the power imbalance. There is no way I could defend myself if I needed to.


lilkangaroo

Yes, it is so scary. Last time I went on a date my hands were shaking so badly I had to hide them under the table and I couldn’t even drink because my stomach was in knots. I feel the same way that they could just kill me or hurt me at any time and I wouldn’t be able to do anything about it.


LussyPips

I understand your concerns. But this comment kind of struck me - your stomach was in knots and you couldn't drink because I'd the fear they could do something to you while in a public space? If that's so, I 100% agree with your boundaries and men should respect them when not knowing you well, and I know plenty of men who are educated and would understand your hesitance and low access to you until you are ready, and only public meet ups. I'm in no way trying to talk down or belittle your feelings, but just to give you perspective, I would say that being that concerned for your safety in a public restaurant where he doesn't know your last name, where you live, and despite having the checks and balances in place for a public meet, is well above and beyond what most people would feel. Your fear may be overcoming your ability to make connections and enjoy your time. I would say, at least in North America where I live, the risk of transporting yourself to a public place like a restaurant, talking, and transporting yourself home (Uber, cab, a friend you check in with before and after with a password word, or heck even a friend under cover monitoring at another table, etc) bring the safety risk down to very very very low- low enough, personally, I would not fear for my safety anymore than a walk down the street. If that's happening, it may be worth chatting with some trusted friends or a counsellor about some tools you can use to help you feel safe enough to at least engage in the meetup more or not feel as scared when you have them?


Tanagrabelle

I understand. So many hugs!


ArimaKaori

I don't think you would need to worry too much if you were in public, but I would never get into a stranger's car or go to a stranger's house.


AbstinenceWorks

Even with a male friend? Would there be things that your male friend could do or not to keep you know that not only was he not a threat, but that he would defend you from harm? *not* to get sex JFC, but because he's your friend.


13Lilacs

Often it's more complicated than that. Predators are normal people with normal lives. It's not easy to suddenly rid yourself of them. For example: A close male friend of mine had a small business and we all went out together one night to celebrate. His partner, who seemed kind, and was a single father to a young child, spoken of highly by my friend and others I knew, followed me back to my apartment and raped me while I was drunk. I said "No", and tried to push him off of me. He didn't use a condom. My friend and my rapist had contracts and deadlines and employees and were one step away from the business going under if they miss-stepped. It completely changed my friend's and my relationship and we had been best friends before that. He confronted his partner, but what could he do? I never pressed charges because it would have been he said/ she said.


AbstinenceWorks

Holy shit... 💔 I let this sub relatively regularly, and each time, I'm at a loss for words. There is such a high level of misery that it leaves me with a feeling of hopelessness (?) Paralysis(?) Similar to when I see the results of war. I actually don't know what to do about it. It feels like attempting to bail out a sinking cruise ship with a cup. And no, I'm not trying to make this about me. I'm merely expressing how I feel. One of my personal rules is, "No sex while drunk." Even an enthusiastic "yes" from a woman who is drunk doesn't count. My response would be something along the lines of, "Tell me that when you're sober." Beyond my consideration for her, I have my own self-interest/self preservation reasons. At least where I live, consent can't be given while drunk. Even if my partner really wants to sleep with me while drunk, she may not feel that way the next day. That would change everything. I want my partner to feel good about being with me. Now, if we were in a long term relationship, where we both feel safe and secure with each other, if she jumped me after we got home, I wouldn't say no then, because I would know her individually and intimately. But, I feel that it's an entirely different scenario than when people don't have that level of intimacy. I would like to ask you, what would you like me to do, not necessarily for you individually, but just in general. I may only have a cup, but it's better than nothing. (It's this derailing? I don't know...)


13Lilacs

I've been assaulted by male 'friends' before. I've been assaulted by male strangers when walking alone on a hike. I've been assaulted by men when at a party in front of other men. I've had handymen come on to me when I was trapped and couldn't leave. I've had people buying things from me via Kijiji who said inappropriate things. I've had cab drivers try to take advantage of me when I was ill. I've had strangers take upskirt photos of me on stairs when I was a teen. I've had landlords ask me out on dates 'to get the apartment'. I've had people with rental advocacy groups ask me out on dates while they were 'helping' me. I've been stalked by delivery people, come onto by managers at restaurants where I ordered food, and physically attacked for refusing advances at bars. I've been spoken to inappropriately when engaging in hobbies I am interested in. I've been flashed multiple times on multiple streets I've lived. I've been assaulted by family. I've been assaulted at work and I've been assaulted at home. Every time a male friend has done me a favour or hung out, there has been disappointment and resentment on their part that it wasn't a date. When fathers bring their kids over for playdates the weekend they have them, they often come on to me. I had a married man once slap my ass when picking their kids up from class. I've had my friends' partners make outright advances or try to steer conversations towards sex over-and-over when I am alone with them. It's ruined friendships with women I love. I'm not special. A lot of women have similar stories.


AbstinenceWorks

I don't know what to say... I am heartbroken that you live like this. It's no wonder so many women are afraid to be alone or not with (many) other women. There is safety in groups. I don't even know how to place myself in your shoes other than, I can place myself in prison, for example, at least from the perspective of constantly being on guard, and knowing that any other person there is a potential SA perpetrator. Any favor comes with strings. I'm a target. Does that sound right?


13Lilacs

I think, yes. Women often feel they have to be guarded. That being alone makes them vulnerable to attack, and being alone with a man, also makes them vulnerable to attack. I truly wish it wasn't like this. I know there are good men. I don't worry about them, I worry about predators. There are a LOT of predators.


AbstinenceWorks

And I know that from your perspective, you can't tell one from the other. That ultimately places you in the unenviable position of guarding against everyone. Predators ruin life for everyone, but especially for you.


Severn6

>And I know that from your perspective, you can't tell one from the other. Here's a real example of this. I used to catch the bus home when I was married to a husband that wouldn't come and meet me in the dark because "I could look after myself." It was about a 7 minute walk home at 8pm in the dark. Here's my experience on three separate nights: One night I'm walking home and I hear pounding footsteps behind me on the path, I start getting nervous, tense up, ready for the worst. A man's friendly voice calls out "I'm just going to pass you, don't want you to feel nervous" and he passes by on his run. Another night I hear quiet footsteps close behind me that persisted the whole way home. I'm nervous, heart pounding, hoping he's just going home too. I turn into my driveway, that is shared by four houses, and he turns with me. I go into fight mode and spin around and say "hi, can I help you?" He doesn't know what to do with the confrontation and says "oh, I'm just going to that house" and points to the first one in the drive. Was he really? I didn't stick around to find out. And then another night I'm close to home and a man passes me, and under the street light I see him look at my breasts and say "mmmmm". It was vile and I felt vulnerable and afraid. You never, ever know what you're going to get. Who you're going to encounter. If you're safe or not. The "not all men" doesn't matter, because you just don't know.


AbstinenceWorks

I was about to say, "There's no fucking way I'd be ok with my wife walking home alone at night," but then I realized he's your ex-husband, for good reason. Each of these scenarios would raise my awareness and I'm a guy. But I know it's ten to a hundred times worse for you. The "not all men" argument doesn't work, because the answer is, "It's far too many." If it were one in a million men, then there would be 150 men in the US that are predators, and we wouldn't be having this discussion. Even one in a thousand would mean that there were 999 out of a thousand that would inform that guy that there are consequences to his actions. It must be a percentage high enough that it's within one or one and a half standard deviations of normal, which is *a lot*. I am not sure what to do. Maybe men's groups that have men vetted by women that can act as the equivalent of designated drivers? I don't know. There are apps for everything. I think women are harassed a lot less if they are with a man, but I don't know. There must be enough of us that are human, that even if we can't fix all of society, we can at least walk someone home. I don't know...


Severn6

I definitely don't get harrassed when out with my partner (my very protective partner who wouldn't be comfortable letting me go anywhere alone at night. And after years of living with someone who didn't give a damn, I'm not ashamed to say I absolutely love and appreciate that. I feel incredibly safe with him and it's such a relief). What's frustrating is that I and all women *should* be able to walk down the street at night with no fear. But it's not our reality. To say nothing of abusers within the home (and I acknowledge women can be abusers too).


AbstinenceWorks

I absolutely agree. One of my co-workers did mention that she felt a lot safer when she lived in Singapore. They will cane a guy for SA, on top of prison sentences... I'm not going to say one way or another what my position is on this, but she did tell me she felt perfectly comfortable walking around at 2am at the time.


PlusGoody

Stop online dating. It works for some people but clearly not for you. Dating men you meet in real life will organically go slower. By the time you’re on a “first date” you will have known them for weeks or months. You will know people in common. He will have at least some investment in you’re not deciding he’s a creep or weirdo. If you’re not meeting men in real life, change things up so you are. Focus on men who as a general matter are required to have competence in boundaries.


DworkinFTW

I feel it. You are not alone. There is going to be a tipping point eventually where the audacity of the most aggressive men is going to start affecting the ones who know how to behave, because the former is going to drive such a large number of women away from dating. Men don’t like that- having a sexual partner is a huge part of their personal validation. Your story- and I’m so glad you told it because people need to repeatedly see it- is just one example of an entire wave. When women date *no one*, it’s because it starts to feel like death by a thousand cuts. And sure, while a good guy may be right around the corner or that next swipe, we can’t know until yet another demeaning hurt has happened. Meanwhile, the process of fending off torpedo after torpedo of unsolicited male sexual desire does the damage it does, and she is drained from bobbing and weaving and in many cases, complying for safety reasons. Why should she continue and risk more of that, when she can live a perfectly good life in her own, as you are doing? What will be left of her when A Good Guy *does* come along? Sure, the men who know how to act *can* continue to fixate on “how women are reacting”, but that’s not going to change much in terms of the reality of the situation. I think eventually they will start instead fixating on what women are reacting TO, when those better men are en masse personally affected. And that’s when men start holding other men accountable. It’s really the only path, because the men causing all the problems don’t see women as people anyway, and so there are no words we can say to do anything about it. We can only make them feel our absence, and then it is for feminist—aligned men with emotional intelligence to step in and demand these guys get their acts together because they’re fucking it up for everyone. Successful men they respect and fear taking action is the only hope there is. I know I for one, if I were a man with the emotional intelligence I have, would be infuriated. And not at the women.


Jenna2k

Enjoy your life instead of stressing about finding someone else and if you find someone that's great if not that's ok to.


trumpcansuckmyarse

Same girl. The bar is literally so low and guys still disappoint me :(


Zanna-K

It sounds like you're relying on match-up apps like Tinder - a lot of people treat those as hookup apps first and relationship apps second (as in, if it actually turns out that someone is a amazing then maybe transition over to considering for relationship). It's not a good pool to pull from if you want to avoid sleazeballs and men who just want to get their dick wet. A lot of guys openly say that they treat those apps as a game of numbers. I've always felt like social gatherings and hobbies were the best way to meet people and have better organic interactions. Like someone who's meeting in person isn't going to be like "hey bby, want some fuk?", people are more courteous and cordial because they want to build rapport - especially amongst people that they don't know. Then because of the nature of the gathering there's a much higher chance of some common connection - either shared interests, related careers, or friendships (friend of a friend, friend of family, friend of a friend's spouse). This further reduces chances of people being jackasses because they don't want it to go back to their relation.


GreetingsClawrades

I’ve met most of the men I’ve ever dated “in real life” and not apps, some at Meetups, and the results haven’t been much better tbh. I tend to avoid Meetup events and groups now unless they’re all female because I find a lot of times they’re full of creepy guys who just want to try to hookup. It’s hard because I’ve only lived in my current city for less than a year and it’s kind of a notoriously hard place to meet new friends. At this point I don’t know what the secret is to meeting a decent man unless it’s going out with a longtime friend, or someone vetting by a mutual friend, or just plain dumb luck.


Zanna-K

Damn that does sound really rough :l do you ever hang out with people at events and get togethers where the goal isn't specifically to meet people? That's why I was suggesting stuff related to hobbies and your personal interests. What do you like to do for fun? Are you into board games, music, improv, biking, sports, gardening, anime, books, 3d printing, cars, volunteering, or any kind of stuff where you can hang out with like-minded people? I've often heard that many people find success once they're not actively looking


GreetingsClawrades

I've gone to meetings based around board games, language learning, drawing, book clubs... same result if there are men there.


Zanna-K

Yeesh I'm sorry, that is depressing :(


Yukisuna

Dating apps are really just used by men looking for hook-ups. Personally, i say; let’s be happy with ourselves. If love wants to have a place in our lives, it can come our way on its own. There’s no hurry, and i know i’ll be ready when/if i fall in love, myself. If i don’t? Can’t lose what you don’t have! I’ll keep being happy and free. Of course, some handle loneliness better than others, and i recognize how good it is to have a close friend or lover you can reach out to when you really need a hug, whether literally or figuratively. And while i realize this might be a bit of a hot take, it sounds like you are mostly having an issue when it comes to men on dating apps. How about… Women? If it’s companionship you seek, it might be easier if you don’t mind whether they’re a he or a she.


[deleted]

The older I get the more I'm considering divorce and the better "be alone" starts to sound. Don't sweat it. Being coupled with someone isn't as grand as they make it out to be in movies and books, trust me.


Nihlys

I'll probably get trashed hard for this but it is what it is. I absolutely hate seeing these comments from people saying they want to 'normalize' being single. That's trash. It's equally as trash to be out there calling for 'normalizing' being in a 'traditional marriage'. You say in your post that it's depressing, so what these people are telling you is that you should just get over those feelings and settle for less. To clarify here, you CAN absolutely find all sorts of happiness being single. If you're loving your single life, then be all means keep doing that. BUT, if you feel like somethings missing then you shouldn't lose hope that there's someone out there that's a good fit for you. Even if you've found so many guys already that are just assholes. What people should 'normalize' is being fkng HAPPY and refusing to settle. I know a lot of people that are single and KILLIN it. They're so happy with just focusing on the life Infront of them. But I've also seen so many people that sulk alone and depressed, not because they actually WANT to be alone, but because they've given up finding someone and that's no way to live. Likewise, I know firsthand what it's like to have a partner I'm truly happy with. A person that I genuinely ENJOY hanging out with because she's legitimately my best friend. And I know so many people in that same boat of being actually HAPPY with each other. But for each of them, I know another person that just has a 'wife' or a 'husband'. They fight all the time, they hate being around each other, they don't have any real shared interests, but they just trudge through every day, over and over and over again because they feel like they're supposed to or that THAT is just how relationships work. It's not. It's not how life works, and you only have one. Normalize being happy. If you're sad because you WANT that companionship, then keep that fire burning because that person is ABSOLUTELY out there. There are a lot of people walkin around so, statistically, a significant portion of them are going to be pricks, but it doesn't mean you have to be alone if you don't WANT to be.


AtleastIthinkIsee

There's no winning. And I accept the fact that because I'm not "fast" that I'm not going to be anybody's top pick. But I'm so sick of feeling like I have to change or be pushed to accomodate someone else. I'm tired of feeling like having boundaries or self-respect is a bad thing. I. do. not. exist. to. prop. someone. else. up.


YoungThugsBootyGoon

It's also about the culture. I was pretty shocked to see how much animosity and predatory behavior was encouraged between sexes in America, people treat the opposite sex like an enemy there. You could try a guy who's outside of your country.


robotteeth

being single isn't a bad thing. Being lonely is a bad thing -- but dating a shitty person isn't a solution to loneliness. Having friends and companionship is, and you absolutely don't need a romantic interest for that.


TulipAcid

One thing to consider...so so many women who lose their husbands at an older age... ...after grieving, heave a sigh of relief and go about the remaining 20 years of their long lives in great joy not to have a big baby underfoot. And yes, there are many women in that situation WHO CANNOT GO ON WITHOUT A MAN IN THEIR LIVES and are willing to be a nurse and/or a purse. We must realize that we've been brainwashed by the marital-industrial complex since childhood. Must have a man for...protection??? (see school shootings, murder-suicides, domestic violence) Must have a man for ... heavy jobs around the house (see boy-men who have to be pried from their x-boxes) ...help with the children (see men act incompetent when it comes to planning doctor/dentist visits, keeping up with medications and even noticing if their child has a fever). It seriously has become a situation where women need to ask WHAT ARE THEY GOOD FOR?


LemonLimeRose

I am completely off men all together. I just don’t trust them. They are just mostly not raised to think of women as whole human beings equal to themselves. Every man I have ever loved has abused me either emotionally, physically and/or sexually. Luckily I’m attracted to ladies too so now I’m married to a nice lady and we have an incredible relationship.


sammyg723

I feel like I could have written this myself. I feel the same exact way. Hopefully the right man will come into our lives when we least expect it. Although I deleted all the dating apps because I felt like it was a toxic environment. So hopefully I will randomly meet someone in person.


Affectionate_Type613

I’m not attracted to men and I thank god for that every day because from what I’ve seen they really be treating their partners like shit


EcchiOli

The numbers work against you: statistically, the men who aren't already in a relationship are bound to be disproportionately men who would disappoint you, see the idea? AKA the dating pool is a cesspool. It's not like there aren't good persons, who would respect their partner, have no issues discussing issues, and know a good relationship isn't a given and needs work. Most of them stay in a relationship because they help making it work, or stop being single fast enough. You'll stumble upon one eventually, cheers for you :)


Hetzz87

If you are going to spend the majority of your time with someone it is not unreasonable to have good boundaries for that. Don’t settle.


kpatsart

Yea I'd say keep being your awesome self and delve into more of your hobbies and interests. Take pride in your personal growth and success, and revel in it. Heck have a "treat yo-self" day by yourself or with some friends if they want to indulge. I had struggles trying to look for a partner in the frame of dating/online dating. However nothing ever seemed to flourish for myself through the random date ups. I kinda shut that part off of my life, and have been indulging in things I want to do and like. I honestly am much happier not thinking about finding someone or the need to. I understand the importance of companionship, but at what sacrifice? I made the mistake of dating my best friend a few years ago. She was a few years older than me, but we were on the same page with so many things. I knew going into this would be a risk, because if it doesn't work out the fallout could be tremendous and I'd lose my best friend. That's exactly what happened 😔, we went from small communications to radio silence. It made me realize that sacrificing friendships and or rushing into companionship doesn't often yield the best results. So in my case, I find solace in being single for now, and the importance of self love. That all being said. I'm not telling you to completely give up on dating. Just don't beat yourself up too much about the random matches. I am sure there is someone equally as awesome as you are out there.


BellaBlue06

I don’t know if you’d be happier focusing on being your own best friend and developing great friendships. Things have gotten a lot more toxic these days online with misogyny and slut shaming among men of all ages. I think the dating pool of kind men is probably quite small. Perhaps if you focus on just living your life you will develop better relationships and connections outside of actively seeking a guy to date. You might be more fulfilled or get recommendations from close friends instead. People are so depressed, angry, hurt & confused these days. Not a lot of healthy well adjusted people on dating apps I don’t think.


chippytea71

Don't ever compromise your integrity to pacify the needs of someone else. You deserve better. Stick to your principles (which are excellent BTW).


saintgmurphy

That girl pushing her presumptions was crazy, and that has nothing to do with you. Using that instance to gauge your emotional sensitivity toward dating makes you equally crazy. Do what you want, but I wouldn’t advise falling down that hole. Just because a couple of guys didn’t show intent of respecting your boundaries, doesn’t mean you should reserve yourself to only one outcome in life I.e. single forever. Other people’s problems aren’t yours to bare. Get that out of your head. I could go on about how that’s heard mentality and how that’s the exact behaviour men who will respect your boundaries are repulsed by, but you’re not here for advice. You’re here for an answer, clearly. Successful people don’t hinge their entire career on one bad client/project/job/person. Don’t be that person. There are plenty of men who would gladly take you on a date and would be more than happy to say goodbye at the end of the date. It’s not the end.


warbunnies

If you want to find a decent guy, they are 100% out there. My SIL has been single for the last three years and finally found an amazing guy. He's super sweet (they both love collecting cute stuffed animals it's adorable) and well put together enough, job + house. But it did take 3 years of hard work and a lot of shitty dates with shitty dudes -.- the struggle is real but it does pay out so never settle!!


UsualAnybody1807

Don't give up, OP. My son met his now wife in his mid/late 30s, they are the same age and neither had previously been married.


usually_just_lurking

I agree with many of the comments here about holding right to your boundaries. Also wanted to add that being single forever can be pretty great, at least it has been for me. Once I got past the societal expectations, which were a drag when I was younger, I found it incredibly freeing. Many of my married friends, in “good” marriages have said that if something were to happen to their husband, they wouldn’t remarry. And my friends in not so good marriages sound envious of my single status.


reasonablyprudent_

Every friend I have in a relationship is a reminder of why I am single. Not a single healthy relationship I could even be jealous of if I wanted to. People put up with too much in order to not be lonely. Isn’t worth it to me either


Tanagrabelle

You are the champion. I think it's wonderful. My suggestion would be a minimum of six months rule.


square_mile

The apps are businesses. Their customers are advertisers (who mainly target the men) and the users (mostly men) that pay for premium features. They don't make money from or via people in happy relationships. They make men stupider than they are. And the men on them are not representative of men generally.


fluffballkitten

I'm still single at 41 so i think it's most likely too late for me already


IamHysterical

I've been single for the past 2 years now because my ex-girlfriend was a controlling narcissist and I have been afraid to start dating again. Only recently have I started getting the nerve to get back out there. Maybe its because I am using Tinder, but it seems like all the women I meet just want a quick hookup or free dinner or I am just meeting the wrong people. I'm 34 now and not old by any means, but I really hate the dating culture these days.


Alternative_Sky1380

That second last line is everything: their hatred. Once we see it it becomes impossible to deny. ​ And Yikes so many women who are meeting decent men in their 30s. Wait until you're in your 40s and divorcing them. There are no unicorns; only women in denial.


Severe_Driver3461

It’s crazy to see women so sure their man is faithful without verifying it in todays world. On work trips, those awesome husbands were the first to cheat. They hide it well because no or barely any evidence is in their phone. Some male P.I.’s have a tribal mentality to protect other cheaters, so it’s safer to hire a female private investigator at this point. Cheating always involves manipulation, and often neglect or emotional abuse, so it’s best to not wait until already married and locked in to decide to protect oneself


Jaxotea

Met him in my 20's, married in 30's still together in 50's but maybe European men are different. Some people have mature relationships instead of constant suspicion. I'm sorry your experiences have destroyed any trust.


Monroze

I saw that post with the tinder situation! I think she was being roasted because everyone knows tinder is for hooking up and being invited over someone's house via tinder means hooking up. I did feel bad for her though because she still should not of received that response It's awesome you've accomplished so much and have set some boundaries, keep doing you and the right guy will come along and if they don't, it is their loss. It's great you have clear boundaries and can get rid of the red-flags but it would be exhausting and feel super defeating


Superseba666

You and OP mistook most of the whole other post, the man in question in r/tinder didn't even have sex in mind when he was asking where to get the tea, even if he could have been more clear, I also understood he didn't want to go to a pub (which is for beers/drinks) to get a tea but a teahouse instead (and nowhere did that guy make it sexual or anything) Most of the comments are just saying that his tinder match was projecting and arriving to conclusions way too soon due to sexist prejudice and/or past experiences which is not correct to do any new acquaintance neither man or woman, and mind me, I also think most guys and gals on tinder are just looking to hook up.


nostalgeek81

Agree. The jump was quite astonishing.


lilkangaroo

Did you read the OP’s comments on his post? How he already had another hot date lined up luckily. I’m sorry but I just do not believe he had no intentions of trying to hook up with her, otherwise he wouldn’t have had to line up another date just in case. But that is not the point. My point was regardless of his intentions, this woman very nicely turned him down and went on her way. And for some reason this pissed so many men off. She is allowed to change her mind whenever she wants for whatever reason she wants and deserves no hatred whatsoever unless she was crazy or disrespectful or Insulting him. But she didn’t. She said she wasn’t interested and wished him luck and moved on. This is literally part of the problem I’m talking about, it is very concerning that a woman deciding she is not interested causes such a reaction in so many men. And today you have to assume that every single person you meet on tinder is trying to hook up with you because the majority are. If you have ever had someone attack you you would probably understand.


Superseba666

I didn't not read many of the comments, now that I did, I found something much worse than "having another date lined up" from OP behaviour actually Some girls make you feel like anything you say theyll interpret negatively, so you end up only saying what they wanna hear until after youve gotten laid a few times. That OP is an ugly piece of human being for basically admitting to manipulating women for sex if he actually does that and didn't get called out enough for it (though I also shared the feeling sometimes that you need to do that to find a GF or a hookup instead of "being myself"). Still I think that OP's match had an over reaction regarding the teahouse thing and my first comment stays valid. I also don't excuse any personal insults on her, nor I saw many (though it's a huge post with many different people comments so I don't doubt there were). If I were on the receiving end of that "wish you luck" based on prejudice, I would also be pissed and I bet you would be too if an equivalent scenario played out. That's why they were trying to make reason of what happened and agreed with OP. Also in social media and real life every person is attacked in some way or another, as a nerd, as a man, as a woman, as whatever, so I understand, you are no better than me and I am no better than you. Mostly agree on tinder statistics of people looking for hookups or "going with the flow" (which means hookups/FWB). Real life dating is better OR if you want to keep using OLD I would suggest you to really filter out men, transform a few points of standards on "looks" to standards on bio / relationship vibes / no sex talk too soon, look out from dates at each other place too soon, alcohol related dates at night and sex in general too soon or before commitment. I wish you luck :)


Monroze

Idk if it was the tea one or a different one I saw of a girl going over a guys place to hang out, it was a tinder date, and she was upset because he expected sex? And everyone was roasting her in the comments


lilkangaroo

The woman did not get upset at all. It was a little vague whether the man was inviting her over for tea or trying to meet somewhere public so she nicely said she wasn’t interested and wished him luck.


C4TERW4L

I (33M) find clear communication and boundaries to be attractive. Emotional intelligence is pretty much #1 for me in terms of evaluating a woman as a potential partner. And I too am still single… I feel your pain, in my own way. When I’m looking for somewhere to place blame, I tend to focus on online dating and the culture around it. I have had better luck meeting better people just doing things that are important to me out there in the world.


Carrier_Conservation

There is a subset of men that actively reaches out the most...and also tends to have some of the worst toxic behaviors. They are overly likely to be encountered in any proposed romantic encounter. My advice? if you see someone you potentially like take the initiative. you are more likely to avoid these prolific "fishers" who want to pose with their trophies for bragging rights.


ttyl_lol

well that's just misandry


Insaiyan117

I cant understand how not wanting sex immediately or not wanting to give your number right away would turn people away. As it is, I try to give it a couple of days of talking before exchange socials or numbers.


johnleemalvo

Sounds like you could use some self reflection. Can’t blame every thing on men! It’s a 2 way street


[deleted]

[удалено]


watchmeroam

The secret service released a report showing that the biggest terroristic threat to Americans is misogyny, growing in popularity because of incel culture and the manosphere. Misogyny is definitely a common problem, and you're incredibly ignorant if you haven't picked up on it by now. https://www.secretservice.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2022-03/NTAC%20Case%20Study%20-%20Hot%20Yoga%20Tallahassee_0.pdf


tekakina

Definitely.


accnr3

This belief has the same root as the historical interpretation that men have oppressed women. It's not accurate, and it comes from a seething misanthropy. Then we teach our children to believe that humans start evil and are good only as a derivative or exception. I'm not american but swedish, but swedish men aren't a different species. American men don't hate women. And it's very sad that this cynicism is so popular, when it brings us to such incorrect conclusions. It's the same sort of misconceptions that make people think that people from other cultures are different. I know every gender, and I know every culture, not only because I'm married into islam and come from the swedish million programme, but because I can derive it from simple philanthropic first principles. If you think differently you just need to get out more. And if you go out more and still reach these incorrect conclusions, you need to take a hard look at your character.


watchmeroam

Oh my goodness, you sound so delusional! I cannot imagine claiming to know every culture and gender and dismiss a well documented phenomenon. I am a proud Muslim woman and I've traveled the world extensively, lived in a few countries, and born and raised in the USA, and still can attest that misogyny exists; but today I am talking about the threat assessment of misogynistic violence studied in the US by the Secret Service. I cannot relate to your views, as they seemed mired in layers of wrong assumptions and naiveté.


accnr3

Thanks for the clarification, but I'm not saying there is no misogyny. You're talking about the rapport, yes. I'm talking about the irrefutable fact that men do not hate women, and the fact that most of those who believe such an evil thing are either motivated by misanthropy, or educated by misanthropes. Misogyny is not a common problem. But cynicism is. And your poor soul suffers. EDIT: You should perhaps spend more time reading the Quran and less time reading internet posts that spread postmodernism and cynicism. And you should absolutely not tell women who suffer from their beliefs that they are unsafe or that any large portion of men are misogynists, that the problem is the world and not their cynicism. OP needs therapy, to help her regain love for the human species. Have you read the Quran recently? It really would help you snap out of this.


watchmeroam

The Quran has nothing to do with the discussion, and I only wish men followed the Quran when it comes to women, which they clearly do not and have not in memorable history. Please do not mistake reaction to lived experiences as cynicism or misandry, and open your eyes to the popular culture and how it stokes hatred of women. I can't get over how young and inexperienced you sound; going around telling people what to do when you obviously have neither the wisdom nor the critical thinking to do so. Spouting theory as reality and ignoring what happens on the ground is what people in denial do. My responses to you end here.


accnr3

Please do not mistake interpretations of lived experience with the fact of the matter. The fact of the matter is that men as a group do not hate women as a group. How can you be so blinded by anger and resentment not to understand that basic fact? And call yourself muslim? I know there is hatred of women. For goodness sake, I'm a millennial swede. I was born into postmodernism, and I understand the issue deeper than you do. Please, please, listen to me. My future daughters might listen to your poison, and grow hateful. Repeat after me: "If I describe the relationship between the sexes as one of hatred, then I am corrupted by evil." That does not mean there is no hatred. That's not at all what I'm saying. EDIT: And don't for a second think cynicism is wisdom. I was born a cynical. Then I transcended cynicism into what looks like naivety to some less fortunate.


Zarochi

It's hard out there. Sometimes we need to compromise a little. Sounds like you're looking at a particular type of man and ignoring some that could be great. I had the same issue until I realized some of the filters on my apps and in my brain were worthless. Just as we want a guy who loves us for who we are we should be looking past simple things that might not be ideal in favor of what's in someone's heart. That's how I finally found someone worthwhile and stopped seeing f*ckbois. You're doing a lot of good things. Don't meet people at home for a first date. Don't compromise on your boundaries. You'll find someone who respects you, but it can be a bit of a slog. Sometimes it's the ones you don't expect to be great that turn out amazing.


Asbelowsoaboveme

Attraction is necessary and shouldn’t be negotiated on.


Zarochi

Yes, but you'll never find what you're looking for if you're unwilling to compromise. There are only so many 6+ foot tall muscular men who help around the house and make 6 figure incomes. People can only help how they look to an extent. We all get ugly one day anyways. You're better off looking at the contents of the jar than the pretty picture painted on the outside.


Asbelowsoaboveme

Compromising on non-physical criteria like income seems much more reasonable than compromising on physical attraction. I like non-fat tall guys with good hair sorry not sorry 🤷‍♀️ I’d rather be alone than be with someone I’m not into, being in a relationship isn’t the end all be all. I guess some people are more ok with settling in the lust department, but I’m certainly not.


Zarochi

As long as you're willing to make compromises it can work out. My experience with the dating world was that the traditionally attractive guys come with the most BS in the departments OP mentioned. They all just wanted me to come over, so they could bang me and nothing more. Maybe your situation is better, but if one is stuck in that rut and wants out then realizing this can help.


Asbelowsoaboveme

>They all just wanted me to come over, so they could bang me and nothing more I completely hear you on this. But, spoiler alert, the less attractive guys want and think exactly the same things as the fuck boys. They’re also varying levels of entitled, sex obsessed, and misogynistic. Sacrificing your own sexual satisfaction in the hopes of being treated better is a scam.


Zarochi

Eh, not really. You're right that all guys are very lust filled lol. I'd rather have someone who takes care of my needs in that department, is patient, and is accepting when I'm not down to clown. That wasn't my experience with most guys. I've had a far better experience the other way. I don't need someone to be tall and jacked to get me off. I need someone who's going to do the things I need to make it happen. It's easy to find an attractive dude to fill you up, and they all seem to think that's all they need to do. Of course, the standard ymmv applies, but I always had better luck with people who paid attention to my needs than looked a certain way.


Asbelowsoaboveme

Sounds like you know what works well for you, best of luck. I do need my partner to fit a specific “type” to get aroused and get off, but I don’t require he be jacked or anything like that 😝 I’m going to keep waiting for the right guy who I’m attracted to that also pays attention to my needs, even if it takes a while to find him.


Sonechko_K

How many dates do you go to per week? In dating market, it is a numbers game. You create a vortex of men around you, and through individual strategy filter out the trash and keep the quality. I think I went on approximately 1000 dates before I found my husband. Three dates per day on a weekend and two dates per day on a week day. Was able to do 100 dates in 90 days, narrowing down to 4 great guys. There are three types of self-esteem. Professional what type of employee you are. As a person what human being you are. And as a woman, what do you bring to the table.


queen-adreena

That sounds exhausting. I think the odds of finding a serial killer are actually higher.


Eponarose

If you look at statistics...she probably met about 3-5 of them.


Sonechko_K

What statistics tell about me being a serial killer 🤣


watchmeroam

Goodness, no man is worth that level of effort. How did you go to work or rest with all that dating?


Sonechko_K

The best man, best husband for you, best father for your kids is worth every minute of it. Read this sub and see how many failed relationships and marriages are out there. 80% of men would not work for you. The 20% left are not a perfect match. But the men you have kids with will be in your life forever. And you know what interesting? After the marathon of 100 dates I did not end up with any of those 4 men. But I learnt the types and how to filter and vet them from the first text they write me. It saved me time. When you are looking for a diamond, you dig dig dig and dig. It does not come out by itself. Work was fine, I had a lot of lunch spots around it and men would come to me. Also I picked the period of the year when there are the most number of singles on the market.


PinkStarsx

Yikes...


[deleted]

I know you’re getting downvoted but DAMN GIRL, respect for you for being able to go through all that. I would never but you knew what you wanted and executed. 2-3 dates per day?? So let’s say on a week day.. do you have a 9-5 job? So you get off work and then how do you fit in two dates? Just curious.


Sonechko_K

Thank you! The truth hurts. People spend 4 years to get BS in electrical engineering, but do not spend even two dates per month to figure out what relationship they want. I took responsibility for my dating life and my decisions. Understood that healthy people do not fall in love. There are no butterflies in the stomach or sparks flying. The real love is just peaceful. My husband says that he married me for love, calm, and peace. Statistically, Sundays and Mondays are the days when most people are on the dating apps, trying to schedule dates for the next couple of days and weekend. During the weekend 3 dates are breakfast, lunch and dinner. Can be 15-30min coffee and croissant dates, or full breakfast or lunch. Spending 15min to an hour and a half. I have no problem getting up and leaving if the guy catfished me or behaving badly. During the week is trickier for some people. But I was working in the area with a lot of businesses and restaurants where people had work meetings during lunch. I had a flexible schedule so it was 7 to 3 plus 1 hr lunch. So I could meet someone for coffee or lunch. While there, some of the men on a business meetings would follow me to the restroom to ask for my number. Not every time but I could get more contacts while I am on the date. Very bold ones would drop their numbers or business cards at our table.


Sonechko_K

And I want to point out that I did not find love or a husband at that time, this was 4 years ago. But the quantity of dates and the types of guys, their reactions, emotions taught me who to avoid and how to find quality. So my filter and my strategy was built on that knowledge. Also testing out the app’s algorithms was important so I would be showed to the top 20% and I would see the best 10% of the men on the apps. I figured out who exactly I was looking for and what I wanted. The year I found my husband I went on 5 dates in 4 months, the filter and vetting strategy were working overtime to get rid of every men that was not the archetype I was best matching with. And here I am, married, expecting, three days ago found my birthday and Xmas gifts under the bed, feeling grateful 😇 Trying to figure out what to get him more for Xmas 🎄


Zestyclose_Fig_257

if you think the internet and its trolls are the real world you will be very disappointed in life. as other posters have said, close your apps and experience real life, it’s fun out here.


Mostly_Syrup

Stop using dating apps. 90% of woman only click on 10% of guys. Statistically your odds of meeting someone randomly has the same success as apps. Boundries work like this. This is what I won't do, followed by this is what I will do. I've noticed people always talk about what they don't want, but I want to know what people want.


lilac2481

That's true. I can count on one hand how many times I swiped right.


Mostly_Syrup

That's an honest response. My first time being downvoted into the negatives, I'm not sure for which part.


lilac2481

Because a lot of them don't put in the effort to make a good profile.


ricoriiks

Congrats on the promotions!


PookaParty

Single is better.


menishkai

it’s okay to not want to be single. it’s okay to be upset and disappointed and just sick of it. i would say keep looking but never ever ever compromise your own standpoint and opinion. i am so proud of you for growing so much since your last breakup


Sarahkm90

Better to be safe and alone then with a dangerous partner.


[deleted]

I stay away from them because I haven’t met one. Even “ nice guys” often turn out to be a nightmare. Since I completely deleted men from my life except at work where I have to see them, my life has improved 1000 percent


Willma_Bumsen

Plan to live alone. Live your life in a way that you can be happy alone. I had to accept myself to achieve some kind of happiness by myself. Pushing to find a (good) relationship, just didnt work. It happened to me out of pure luck / coincidence. I think it will happen to you too, but until then make sure you are alright and are content with the idea of never finding a partner.


Kukuum

Terrible men deserve no compromise. It’s not difficult to respect a woman, or anyones boundaries. Congratz on your success at your work! :) also I agree that it’s totally okay to want to be single. I hate that people make others feel bad because they don’t fit into their own mold for what’s “normal” or “right”.


purpleprose78

Single and 44. Will likely be single forever and have come to peace with that. If I were to find a partner, I would want them to add to my life and I've not met that person. It is better to be single than in a bad relationship.


Icy_Ease_3892

Harder to find, but respectable men are out there. Its just the rats are usually the ones more desperate and putting themselves out there to get any piece of cheese they can. I must say though I find it a tiny bit sad when I talk with a girl and they say they like me because I respect their boundaries... because how is that not a normal thing and makes me special somehow?? Be happy alone until you come across the one for you.


tomekza

So sorry to hear your experiences. To share my experience. Before I met my wife I was dating for three years and it was a total disaster. I was ready to throw the towel in and say oh well. Things can and do change. Be patient and stick to your principles, I think they are very reasonable. Depending where we live it can go from very reserved to a "pickup" culture. Both extremes are very challenging to find ones footing. All the best.


Juls7243

There are lots of lonely men out there too who do respect women. Sadly they usually lack the confidence to attract or ask women out. Go to a board game convention or other nerdy event as, in my experience, there are lots of actually decent guys there.


cyci

Yes. I felt the same as you describe so I also took a break from dating and in that time I: finished my dissertation, got a new job with a pay increase, and bought a house. No one to hold me back now!


ShantiBlossom

I feel the same :/


various_sneers

Better to be alone than with a douchebag asshole. That said, based on what you've said about who you are, I think if you stick to your guns, you'll find a man who not only wants you as you are, but is thrilled that you're as strong as you are. Real men who want real human beings for partners exist, they're just extremely rare.


dillrepair

Go hang out in bay view or riverwest at some of the cooler more laid back places… you will find a respectable guy down there somewhere … there are a lot of good people in that town but it seems daunting at first to get involved. And if you don’t …. Or someone treats you like shit,,, sounds like you know the right thing to do.


Barreling_Burke

There’s someone out there for ya. Hope you find each other soon. Just keep living your life how you want and your paths are bound to cross eventually.


airbornemyles

Men with low self esteem will feel the need to be more dominate than their partners and it’s no one’s fault but their own. Be proud of who you are and that your excelling. Do not dwell on the absence of a significant other in your life at this moment. What will be will be and what won’t…we’ll it just won’t. Enjoy your time to yourself and use this time to try and get outside your comfort zones (kind of like the movie Yes Man with Jim Carrey). A partner is first and foremost and individual with their own hopes and dreams. They should add to you and yours and you to theirs. Do not feel the need to settle and fill that void with a “placeholder” partner because good men will not go for a woman who is spoken for. Best of luck and based on the way you articulate yourself and allow yourself to be vulnerable, good things will happen.


AutofillUserID

You post feels vent-full but you may not be angry in person. I am sorry you are experiencing this from my peoples. I understand men thinking they are the higher income earner and having the head of the house mentality because of how society still portrays relationships. I can say almost all men who are young professionals want to have sex before the first date. That number skyrockets on date 1 and probably becomes 99.9% at date 2. With age and life experience that need to smash before date 2 goes down and may reach 99.9% at date 5 which is a huge difference. It does get better with age (for me at least), because I have seen my 'desire to smash asap' go down to almost zero and I now only think of holistic compatibility and life goals. I didn't think I would have grown up but I experienced a failed marriage where holistic compatibility was missing. You may just be at a place in life where the guys you are talking to are not. You may be evaluating quality long term matching and they are evaluating smash-ability because they are 10 years behind you when it comes to relationships. That doesn't mean you need to find someone 10 years older, you just have to sort through the list to find someone who has similar values as you because they were raised to think like you do. You may be frustrated for a while but give it time and don't loose hope. There is someone out there who has your level of maturity and compatibility. It gets better.


Ancient-Practice-431

Better alone than poorly paired


rossgeller3

We are in the same boat. It seems like dating for most men is focused on sex and only on sex and I can't do it anymore. At this point I don't see how I will be able to meet a guy who actually wants to get to know me and respects my boundaries. I think it's very rare to find men like this and I've just had to start working on accepting that this is the way life is for me unfortunately.


rathrowawaysadgyal

I have also hunkered down and am prepared to be single for the next 20+ years. I’m not going to coddle grown men anymore.


throwaway136900

Took me almost 15 years of dating to meet a man who wasn't scum and actually respects women. They're out there, very sparingly. Sometimes the best things find you when you're not looking!


rnagy2346

31M and been single my entire life, with the exception of a few hookups here.. Still have faith I'll find someone compatible.


AlsionGrace

You just keep doing you. How many women do you meet that are likely to be your best friend? How many human beings do you meet that you actually are able to "connect to" on any level. People make way too many concessions for their romantic partners.


sexybeast525

It depends on where you meet them a lot. Meeting people in book clubs and libraries are very different than meeting them on tinder. Also, people of different culture like british and japanese men are more respectful toward women than american men very often. Find someone who is raised to respect women.


KSD171

That’s what happens when you use dating apps as a woman You’re gonna get a bunch of guys who type with one hand, if you know what I mean.


Chazzyphant

A couple thoughts that might help: --You don't have to date and marry "all men" or even a majority. Without being a obligate monogamist, you only need one. This really helped me with panicky "men are so terrible" feelings. --**Friends first** this is my one weird trick Tinder hates. Now having said that, don't go on dating apps saying you just want friends, that's a losing game. Make friends through existing friends, church/religious groups, hobbies, work, etc. You can be up front "I'm taking it slow--probably more slow that others, but this is my process" --Don't use words to indicate and enforce boundaries or set expectations, whenever possible, use actions--and state it in the positive. "I prefer to reserve intimacy for a boyfriend" etc. There's no need to state that you don't want hookups. Just filter. Speaking frankly, most men (or the wrong men) won't listen/read and won't respect that or adhere to that. My eyes were opened reading Tucker Max that many men view those statements as obligatory disclaimers so that women can then feel okay about being casual. Is this...okay or fair? No. But skip the "disclaimers" on profiles. Just enforce it. Do some work around understanding intent--it sounds like you're hyper-sensitive to men touching you or initiating romantic or physical stuff. I will be honest---on a date, if you're not open to romantic or physical stuff you might need to back off and retrench and rethink. I don't think someone kissing or touching you is always "I believe you will f--- me." But also...don't give men a roadmap to your weak spots and things to push you. Simply be aware of those boundaries and enforce them by removing yourself or pulling away. Someone says something crappy/weird? Turn away with a frown. Someone invites you to a dinner at his house on the first date. "no thanks" and an unmatch or block/delete. --Sometimes former people pleasers swing a bit in the hard opposite and wind up coming off harsh, closed, cold, mean, etc. I'm **not** saying that you are but it's worth looking at. Are you someone you would date? **Look for a way in, not a way out**. Find the good in people. The things in others that drive you nuts are often unresolved trauma and internal struggles, this was a really hard lesson for me to learn.


SeventySealsInASuit

I mean not giving your phone number before meeting is very weird. I wouldn't feel comfortable meeting a stranger I hadn't talked to extensively before hand. I know I'm social awkward but I don't think that is particularly weird either.


queen-adreena

A mobile number is a pretty serious piece of information to give out. They can often track people on social media, find them in data leaks and harass them afterwards with this if things go badly.


SeventySealsInASuit

That is true I do tend to use a seperate phone number I have for such occassions. I have also tracked people down with far less information than a phone number so I completely understand how much it can give away. A couple of my online friends bet I couldn't find out where they live. Turns out with an image of what they look like, a full name and by the grace of god them living in an english speaking country it was not actually that hard.


lilkangaroo

They can speak to me, over the app that we are currently speaking on. We can talk as much as we want on there. People can look up your address with your phone number. Have you ever had a guy stalk you before and try to come over when you said to leave you alone? I have. Sorry but I am not giving strange men over the Internet who could be anyone a tool to find all of my personal information online. Also it is a simple boundary to respect and it is a huge red flag if someone cannot even respect a boundary that small.


theyost

Maybe get a burner (or something like Google Voice) so you can give your number out.


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WomanNotAGirl

Most women aren’t bisexual. Bisexual women are bisexual.


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Jenna2k

So what about asexual women?


WomanNotAGirl

Only bisexual women say that. I say that too cause I’m bisexual but I swear it feels that way but apparently it isn’t.


lilkangaroo

Uh….No? I don’t agree that you can just choose to be gay suddenly. And I know a lot of women who are not bisexual.


PlanningVigilante

This is ridiculously false and really toxic to even say. WTF is wrong with you.


moonletonpause

Read the room. Do you routinely harass people who are looking for advice on how to stay safe from gendered violence? You’re spouting a gross myth which sexualizes bi women. Women here are discussing a very serious issue of safety. Trivializing it by sexualizing women and bisexual women like this is inappropriate, and disrespectful of OP and all the women here who have lived experience with having their lives threatened by men when they were supposed to be on fun dates.


mv0h

find a better class of men? have you looked in your local makerspace?


[deleted]

1. Hell yeah, queen. 2. Abandon OLD. It's a dumpster fire of these sorts of men. They don't deserve the time, access, or energy from you or any woman.