By - Quartzis
I think it's just some sort of selection bias. People who are only making 30k don't post their salaries much but if you are making 100+k posting it seems to be NBD. Obv there's your humblebragging situation as well
>People who are only making 30k don't post their salaries
I think this is it. If one was to go by what they see on Reddit, then they would think everyone was a V.P., Director, Lead, Etc......In Reddit land, there appear to be no workers, just managers.
You can be an individual contributor and make upwards of $100k
And also, it depends where you live, for instance 100k in California would be super underpaid because the cost of living is so high you might end up with debt!
Well, I’m a worker… in construction. Self-employed, I make roughly 90k pre-tax. If I worked for someone else doing the same work with the same skills and same tools, I would make a third of that. So I long ago decided if I even get two days of work on my own a week I would be doing as well financially as working full time for someone else. I have since filled in the rest of the week.
This is reddit and online communities in a nutshell. And not just about salary. About everything. Look at the amount of negative news/information about the USA/China that makes it on here. No one cares to post positive/neutral stuff because it doesn't get upvotes.
Another similar example is looking online to see if people are happy/sad at their jobs. The unhappy people are the ones that tend to go online and complain. No one who is happy or content is going to go out of their way to make a post or vent.
This is just life. We are less aware of the mundane and it registers less in our memories while the exceptional, good or bad, is more likely to make an impact and be stored in our minds in turn biasing our perspective
People also lie out of their ass constantly on Reddit, and a lot of these people live in big cities where the cost of living is 5x more than places where people make 50-60k a year. Some dude in New York making 100k isn’t living better than me making 70k in a city 1/10th the size as New York.
Reddit is filled with engineers and software devs living in CA where cost of living is obscene and they might make $170k or whatever but it’s basically the equivalent of $70-$80k in a lot of other places
>I've seen people on Reddit talk about things like 300k a year, so is there something I'm missing or are there that much people that are just... Well... Rich ?
A mix of salaries are higher in the US (also, when we compare, we tend to use pre-tax salaries. other countries don't), and also demographically the type of people who post on reddit tend to be in those well paying jobs.
Going by google, $100k is ~top 5% in the US. So 1 in 20, then add up demographics etc. It's not super common but also not terribly uncommon, either.
> that's a salary of an engineer or a doctor.
Generally true here. Lot of engineers or software engineers etc on reddit, relative to generic population, though.
Agreed that in the US talking about pre tax salary is more common. Taxes vary so much per state, tax situation etc so we talk about wages without any deductions.
To be fair talking about gross salary is also common in Europe as far as I'm aware (and I'm an employment law lawyer). People only mean net salary if so specified.
Interesting. I'm from Mexico (but currently live in the US) and my friends in Mexico mostly mention their take-home.
Is there a flat tax in Mexico? In most countries the tax you pay depends on your pzrsonal situation (kids, partner also works or not etc).
Comparing your take-home pay seems rather useless than.
In mexico the tax rate goes with the salary. The more you make, the more you pay.
Amounts for 2021, monthly in pesos, gross income:
.01 - 644.58, government gives you a small bonus.
644.59-5470.92 : 6.40%
5470.93 - 9614.66: 10.88%
9614.67 - 11176.62: 16%
...and so on until you reach 35%
There is also a fixed cuota, wich starts at 0, and goes to 101,876.90 in the top tier (top tier starts at 324,845.02)
You only apply the tax bracket to the amount that exceeds the lower bracket amount. (example: someone earns 11,000 pesos this month, you apply the tax of 16% to the difference from 9,614.67 to 11,000 or 1,386)
I dont have the %'s on hand, but in the US it works the same way (especially the "you only pay the higher % on the amount that is over the previous tier" This is something most Americans dont understand tho because it was never explained.)
I know, and it's frustrating when I hear the myth that making more money will result in a lower take home amount because of tax brackets.
I mean it's not a useless comparison in that take-home pay ultimately determines the amount you have to live on. But I see what you're saying that pre-tax numbers are more appropriate if we're trying to compare apples to apples without all the confounding variables.
Take-home is a more reasonable outlook though than flat salary. I roll my eyes every time I ask someone how much they earn because they're always afraid to say what they actually earn and instead tell me their salary after working X amount of overtime or commission or just flat salary.
It makes it annoyingly tedious to gauge how much of the things they're saying are useful to me when considering a new job or career path.
"Oh, I make 2000 a fortnight", actually makes 1200 a fortnight.
My take home is artificially inflated. I don’t withhold as much as I probably should, trying to balance my forecast charitable donations and other deductions and make sure I still owe a little bit come tax season.
I have two colleagues who make the same amount as me. Without knowing how they structure their deductions, I’d guess that they have a lower take home than I do.
Yeah, in the US you typically have medical and retirement taken out pre tax on top of the taxes and social security. Plus folks may have child support taken out, etc. The difference can vary wildly. My gross salary is about 64k, I actually take home about 1500 biweekly. That's around 40k. Pretty big difference there.
Another thing that varies wildly is the cost of living from state to state or region to region, even amongst cities of similar size. A 100k job in the heartland or Midwest can buy a lot. In somewhere like New York City or many costal cities in California and you're barely making rent.
This is super true, I gross around 90k in PA and live comfortably, but im sure I'd be living in the slums in Califonia.
I made $700k this year and took home $344k . Which is still awesome, but a shit ton of taxes. I work nonstop and on average get 53% if I’m lucky
Yup, $100k after taxes, benefits, is maybe $60k
$100k gross would be net about $66k in New York. With New York being ballpark 50% more expensive than Paris, that’s be equivalent to a net of 44k€, which would mean a gross at 60k€ for the same lifestyle as a $100k in New York.
This salary in France would be for an Engineer with good career progression (not a top performer) and 5 to 10 years of experience. Adding to that that the US just generally pays more, the gap is significant but not outrageous all things considered.
Question is how much would earn a typical Engineer in NY with 5 to 10 years of experience?
There's also the aspect of what governments provide for those taxes. We'd need to take the cost of childcare in the US and France, average annual healthcare costs, K-12 abd higher ed and so forth. I'd imagine they are higher for the US, which would also count towards a need for higher salary to cover those costs, but ultimately would bring the US salary a few notches lower in the comparison.
Yeah, my dad in France was making 50k-ish after taxes and it was more than enough to be considered high middle class even with 3 kids and a stay at home wife ( and I'm talking about 2000's and 2010's here, not the 80's)
I don't think there is ever a point in my career where I would make that much money, even with my master's degree.
I'm in Texas making just around 100k. With taxes and benefits my take home is around 72k. Engineer with 7 years of experience
Take home varies based on taxes and contributions for things like 401k, HSA or FSA, insurance and so many other items that it’s worthless to know someone’s take home.
I believe, in 2021, someone in the US making $100k would fall into the 22% Federal tax bracket ($9,358 plus 22% of the amount over $81,950). So, if a redditor says they make $100k, they are probably taking home $86,713 minus their state's taxes, which could be the 13.3% of California to the 2.9%, 3%, or 3.23% of North Dakota, Pennsylvania and Indiana, respectively, or somewhere in between.
It is very possible I have that incorrect though.
And then there's deductions like for insurance, transit, retirement accounts, etc. On paper I make ~105k, in reality I took home $74,299 in 2021
That’s not how tax brackets work either.
You don’t pay a flat tax based on the amount of money you earned. It’s tiered.
Let’s say your taxable income was the full 100K, you’d pay:
10% of $0 to $10,275 +
12% of $10,275 to $41,775 +
22% of $41,775 to $89,075 +
24% of $89,075 to $100,000
In total the amount of tax owed would be:
$1,027.50 + $3,780 + $10,406 + $2,622 = $17,835.50
However because of how tax breaks work, it effectively reduces your taxable income. You’d actually pay less because of the tax breaks.
Someone taking the standard deduction would be able to reduce their $100K down to $87,050 and only need to pay $14,768 in taxes.
It’s 0 in Tennessee bro
That's purely income tax. On top of that you have approx 8% for SSI and Medicare. Generally, it's safe and easy to use 30% as a rough estimate to include federal, state, SSI, and Medicare/aid.
I’ve never heard anyone talk about anything other than gross salary in Europe.
Plus the people most likely to talk about their income are the ones with a high income
Underrated comment. It’s the same with dicks.
And in both cases, exaggeration is rampant.
It is also worth mentioning this is the internet and anyone can say anything. For example.
I made a million dollars last year.
Oh yeah? I made 2 million and only work an hour a week. The rest of my time is consumed with training to climb mount everest.
Ha! You haven't climbed mount Everest yet? I did that 10 years ago with only 5 Nature Valley bars and my bare hands.
Lmao JUST Mount Everest? 12 years ago, with only my penis, I climbed your mom
Every management consultant I know is on Reddit too. Starting salary out of undergrad at a good firm (MBB, Big 4 type) is 80-90k+, and post-mba, 175-200k+
By mid-30's, most that stick with it are are sitting pretty comfortably at 250-300k+ either in industry, consulting, or PE/VC. Travel and hours get rough, especially as you get older, but if you *really* stick with it, salaries go to 500k-1 million a year or more.
A lot of truckers on reddit too. I was making 6 figures my second year trucking. Though you're not going to make 300k unless you do heavy haul.
Is heavy hauling that hard to get into or just not many people wanna do it?
It's not hard to get into at the right company. It takes about 5-7 years at a company that does it. A lot of people just don't know how or are afraid of flatbedding period.
Is flatbedding that much different? Sorry for all the questions, I’m an engineer rn and have vaguely entertained the idea of switching careers.
Yeah. It's a lot more physical, dirty, and dangerous. But it brings the best money in trucking along with Tanker. But I rather do physical work than be a rolling bomb.
Sooo how does one get into management consulting?? Asking for a friend....
Go to a top tier undergrad school (at least US News T25; preferably T10) or the same rank for MBA…the vast majority of initial recruiting happens at that level.
Welp gotta go back in time and change my Bio major to Business lol.
Maybe it's MBA time lol.
Sounds like I have to socially interact, I'll pass.
Americans have to talk about their pre tax salary because nobody knows what the hell their tax bill is going to be until some time in the next year. I know they get my withholding wildly wrong more years than not. We should have the IRS tell you your tax bill instead of making you guess and then fining you for guessing wrong.
What did you google to get that?
This site tells me it’s around 12%
You guys are getting paid?
It depends on where you live here. The US is massive with a ton a variance. I’m in CA and my mortgage alone is $33k/year for my 900 sqft flat in the outskirts of a metro area where I still commute 45 min to work one way. Jobs pay higher here but cost of living is even more.
It's just insane to me that people stay in California and live like that. I live in a mid-west city that is always listed on the top 25 US cities to live list and for a 33k mortgage you get a 4000 sq ft home on a 1/3 acre lot in a very low crime area with great schools and you are a 10 minute drive from the city center.
I love visiting places like San Francisco or NYC for vacations but could just never live like that. To each their own though.
When you leave California, you leave behind your California salary (unless you work remotely). So whatever your job is, you’d have roughly the same purchasing power in a different state with a lower salary and lower cost of living.
I agree California salaries are typically going to be higher than salaries in the Midwest but if you look at the home that a waiter, or a nurse, or a software engineer, or a doctor live in you are going to find almost universally that the person in the Midwest is living in a much nicer, larger home than their counterpart in California despite making less money.
Sure, your house is bigger, but do you have easy access to year around good weather, with mountains and ski slopes or beaches and surfing all within a few hours drive?
You forgot: cultural diversity and variety and quality of food and entertainment.
Huge one. I was living in one of the most beautiful parts of the country in the mountains and just moved back to Oakland, and for me the quality of life it so much better here. Great restaurants everywhere, culture, entertainment, career mobility simple things like getting a doctor or dentist appointment are way easier. The mountains are something else but you’re sacrificing quality of life for it.
Nope, I don't have mountains like Tahoe or beaches on the Pacific. But we do have our own ski hills and lake beaches all within a 30 minute drive. And when I really want the CA experience I am able to vacation there.
I was born in the Midwest, grew up in California, and moved back to the Midwest for starting college. The weather and humidity were enough for me to say never again. Transferred to a California school within a month. Also the prospect of being a sociology teacher in the Midwest didn’t sound too great
Plenty of people like me are stuck on the coasts due to our careers. I would have to take about a 70 percent pay cut to move to the Midwest. Even accounting for cost of living, I just can’t make that work.
Pros: rent is cheaper
Cons: you get paid less and everything other than rent is the same price
Groceries, Gas, entertainment all tend to be more expensive in higher COL areas.
But people have to take into account so many things as well. Like maxing out your 401k is a lot easier with a higher pay check. Things like vacation tend to cost about the same no matter where in the US you are from.
And for some people the culture of those areas is a no-go as well, especially if you happen to be lgbtq+ or ethnic, Etc
Im an American and I’ve lived in Europe (UK and Germany).
American salaries are generally higher than in Europe. However these higher salaries are more or less intended to offset things like healthcare premiums, childcare, school and a multitude of other things Europeans would have covered through taxes.
In my field (engineering) I make ~$170k/yr in Seattle which is a pretty HCOL area. I was offered an equivalent job in Munich Germany for ~€110k/yr. When I did the math to take into account all expenses and adjust for COL it was nearly equivalent ( it would have been an equivalent couple thousand pay cut). However my top of line pay is still higher in America and at the end of the day I’m better off in the states, but that’s because upper middle class income is generally better in America than Europe, but if you are middle class or lower you would be better off in Europe. Do note that this is my own personal experience and there are probably better macro level sources out there.
Interesting that the salaries were so comparable in your field (after adjustment). My husband and I are a dual EU-US professor couple (both in STEM fields) and the salaries for us in the US are much much higher.
I’m kind of at the sweet spot to be honest. My salary growth potential is much higher in the US (I’m 11 years into my career). It was also extremely difficult to find a comparable salary. In the UK for instance my same role would have been a 50% pay cut. But that’s generally because UK engineers are vastly underpaid (in my opinion)
Reddit has a very disproportionately high population of tech workers in very high cost of living cities. The median household (not individual) income in the USA is only something like 60k. And most people don't live in the San Francisco Bay area. Yet you're very likely to encounter a software engineer working for Google or Facebook making tons of money on here compared to an auto worker from Detroit.
In the state I live in you would apply for food stamps at $19,000 a year. The average salary for a doctor in the US is $313,000. The average salary for a lawyer in the US is $126,000.
$313k?! That number seems way off. No way your GPs are paid half that on average
I mean a lot of starting salaries for docs are over $200k. A friend of mine started at $212k for telepsychiatry.
Average primary care salary is close to 250k, but that takes into account all experience levels. The salaries get higher with sub specialty surgery disciplines. Average salary of an orthopedist is over 500k, neurosurgery is over 700k.
Nurse anesthetists start at 200k in Michigan...
$313k sounds extremely accurate to me. The lower average would $200k but doctors, especially surgeons, can make upwards of $600k depending on location, experience and specialty.
Yeah my orthopedic surgeon clears 1 million a year here in NYC.
An orthopedic surgeon with a successful practice in NYC is basically an NBA superstar in terms of nerd professions. He’s insanely rare and 99.9% of people that want to go into medicine don’t have a chance of making it to that level.
Absolutely agree, definitely worth the money they are paid. Surgery is no joke when it’s botched.
Have several friends just turning 30 making $700k+ as doctors/surgeons. They make more the farther outside of major cities, which sounds backwards but kinda makes sense (no one wants to live in Duluth Minnesota compared to a cool city…). Those mega salaries skew the average.
one of my HS friend’s dad was a surgeon. he worked crazy hours but their house was huge and beautiful, it had its own tennis courts and stuff
Some small town GP? Probably not. But someone who owns their own practice or has very high client volume? You may be surprised. Doctors have some costs that other professionals dont. Malpractice insurance, facilities fees, etc. Take home pay is not the same as total income.
Actually, small town physicians often make more than counterparts in larger cities due to labor supply shortage.
It's true. I have family that are "small town" Doctors and they make double what they would make in a bigger city because they just can't get anyone to work in small towns, few people want to live there.
It turns out that fewer people from small towns become doctors, and it's not super easy to get people with lots of education/options to move to small towns.
If you aren't gonna be fun, you at least have to pay well. No one with options who isn't from podunk town is gonna turn down an equal paying job in a fun city for McTinyville USA.
My good friend just finished his Fellowship training in neonatal neurosurgery and turned down a job for 1 million a year in Alaska. He wasn't willing to relocate his wife and young kids to Alaska for that wage, and took a job in the mid-700s in a major city at a top tier academic center. He's 34 and finally done with training, he doesn't want to spend another 5 years in hell for a few extra hundred thousand. Also now he works at one of THE top hospitals for his field, vs a medium sized non-pretigious hospital in Alaska where he would be the only guy in the state doing those surgeries.
I know a GP who clears a million a year in a small town in la.
Unlike other professions, physicians in less populated areas tend to get paid more.
It'd be a reverse if anything. Small town doctors tend to roll in it because they have to be paid to live/work there when the "good" hospitals are in a city.
That plus a healthcare system that is bonkers batshit crazy. Don't forget to mention that.
My gynecologist has his own plane that he flies, like for fun
To be fair, one doesn't need to be rich to do that. It's a costly hobby, for sure, but plenty of people own their own small Cessna's and the likes to fly around. Heck, I've been playing with the thought myself, and I only make 1/3 of that
Oh absolutely I love my doctor and he deserves all of that, he really does. It just blows my mind, during our routine checkups and he’s talking about flying his plane and I’m sitting there on Medicaid like “have a safe flight” lol
Yeah can't compare GP, Peds, IM to specialists the gap is astounding. I'm a GP and base and make nowhere near 300k+
Average salaries aren't always useful. Case in point, lawyers
A lot of redditors are probably software engineers and 100k is a common starting salary for software engineers at large companies (like Google).
I Confirm that, 6yo software engineer in london, in a big tech company (not faang) and i am at ~100k £ and i am in the lower end. I know plenty of friend in my company and others (faang and not faang) earning more.
Edit : I meant 6 year of professional experience.
6 year old?
They start early nowadays
Worth noting that London pays much higher than the rest of the UK, but the cost of living is also much higher.
My boyfriend is IT, last year started working in a great company (not Google-great, but good anyways) and he's getting 17k. Here in Spain it's an amazing salary, so I really don't get USA economy.
US is huge and it highly depends on where you live. I bought a house for 90 thousand that would cost 350 thousand if I moved 4 hours south of where I live now.
17k would be less than minimum wage here but it costs 10 dollars to get a meal at McDonalds.
I bought a house for $350,000 that would be $1,000,000 twenty minutes in one direction and $90,000 twenty minutes in another direction. Location dictates everything. I also work for a company (in a large metro area) making twice as much as a coworker who does the same job at one of our rural offices.
€17k in Spain? Is that after taxes? I’ve been to Spain and it isn’t very cheap to live in. I’m curious where you live.
For reference, I’m in India and I make like €30k a year and it’s pretty average for the kind of companies I work for. Some of my colleagues make like €60k a year.
Welcome to southern Europe/large part of Europe. If you make 60K Euros, you're already in top 5% in all of Europe. It's the kind of salary you make in Europe in only selected profession and in only limited part of Europe. Also large part of it will go in the system to fund health care, retirement etc. By large, I mean at least 40%.
There is big difference between European and American salaries, especially in skilled jobs like IT.
Yeah, I remember I talked to a couple of Portuguese doctors. You earned more working in a supermarket straight out of high school in Denmark than you did as a medical doctor in Portugal. Was pretty crazy to hear.
This is why you don't lump europe into one. I worked with a warehouse guy from eastern europe. He was super happy to be here. Made almost 10x the money as a warehouse worker than what he did at home as a veterinarian.
Of course cost of living is higher, but things like TVs, smartphones, cars and computers don't magically get sold at 10% the price. You have a lot more buying power, after basic needs are met.
Do you live in a small city? I am from India (delhi, the capital city) and it would be considered good but not amazing even here considering how much more expensive the cost of living is in the west.
Hey, i'm from Spain too, and you are tripping if you think 17k a year is an amazing salary, minimum wage here is 13,500+ a year. That's like 250€ above min wage per month, so i guess you live in a family house with no expenses or that's a shitty salary.
Wow! In france I was getting 30k as a PhD student
Keep in mind that (please, don't take offense) the US is a much wealthier country than spain.
The US has roughly \~$65k of GDP per capita, which is just a measure of economic production per person.
Spain has less than half of that at \~$31k (both amounts in USD).
So there is just less wealth in Spain. So people make less money in USD terms, but things also (to an extent) cost less where you live too.
Yeah, I totally get it, it's just an astonishing difference. Anyways say groceries and shopping it's 300€, bills are 200€ and rent is 700€ a month. Minimum wage (and the common salary) is 1000€. So it's so freaking difficult to live on your own, even with a partner, when you are young because there are no jobs, doesn't matter your qualification
If someone offered me 17k for IT work I'd laugh all the way to the door, and then probably keep laughing all the way to my car. You can make more than that doing just about any job in the US. But I'm also guessing there's significant cost of living differences.
You won't see an entry-level SWE at Google for anything under 200k total comp in a M/HCOL state
I don't think this is true. Im out in Seattle and most of the Entry Level positions start at 105-125k with equity that has to vest.
does that include bonus and stock? a lot of the comp for software engineers is not salary.
It does not, but I still don’t anticipate the total comp of an entry level position being $200k+. My partner just accepted a SWE level 2 position at a very big, well known company and his total comp is $175k. His base is $130k.
1. its the internet, people lie for fake internet points and validation
2. murika is big and living expenses can vary drastically. 150k in downtown new york might buy you a cardboard box vs in oklahoma you would be a super millionarie with a double mansion.
Can confirm, cousin in Oklahoma has double McMansions, I in Seattle cannot afford to live in this city.
PEOPLE ON THE INTERNET LIE?!?!?!?!?
"The internet does not LIE!"
That is one of my favorites movie quotes and it's from a children's movie.
\+1 to this. I live in New York and a six-figure salary can afford you a 350 sq ft studio. I've seen apartments with a shower in the kitchen priced at $2500/month.
I was going to mention cost of living, some cities $80/hour is common but so is $5000/ month for rent.
Can confirm 2, making just north of 125k and if I went to my home town I'd be considered doing very well, but I'd need two roommates to afford a space not designed for three people, to live in the city I work. Anywhere I can afford to be comfortable would be an hour commute at least.
I make around the same amount.
In the DC area...it's not so much.
In my hometown in PA where the average income for dual households is $32K/annually? I'm fucking Rich Uncle Pennybags.
*Cardboard* box? You were lucky!
America does have one of the highest median annual incomes in the world - but Reddit consists of more tech people than average and they tend to make more money than average....so the comments are skewed to people with even higher incomes. Throw in the Reddit demographic that is full of BS and you get even more claims of $100K+ incomes.
I make $106k/yr. I’m not bragging and feel fortunate to have earned and been blessed with the attributes that have allowed me to get this position.
I make $2049/week. I bring home $1572/wk after paying for taxes, private healthcare, and retirement benefits.
$1572/wk is plenty but I also pay $2500/mo for my mortgage, $200/mo for insurance for 2 cars, $400/mo for speech for my daughter, $300/mo for electric, $200/mo for water, $250/mo for internet and cell phones. That’s not to mention gas and food, both are significantly bills each month.
Edit: In case you missed me saying “is plenty”. I’m absolutely not complaining. My finances are excellent because I’m well compensated for my work. I do not feel that any individual bill I list is too high (except cell phones) and i thankfully can afford all of this, and still sock some away for fun, retirement, and emergencies. My only point was that $100k doesn’t go quite as far as it seems on the surface.
Seriously? 200$ per month for water and 250$ for internet? Do you live in a mansion with a server in the basement or is this normal?
My utilities combined are around $300 and I have a regular 3 br 1 ba house without a basement. It sucks.
We have a dumb agreement for water management for our sub-division (if you’re not in the US, it’s just a group of homes on a small set of streets that typically have only 1 way in-or-out with similarly sized and built homes, typically as a part of a collective called an HOA) that is $40/mo. It’s only irrigation.
And city water and sewer are combined and can be as much as $150/mo.
Finland is supposed to be expensive and I pay 60$ for high speed internet and phone, and 20$ for water. Its for a studio though but still. A house with a pool maybe would have a water bill off 100$ per month.
Normal for me too
Yeah, even with a really good salary, the places that have them also have a relatively high cost of living.
Yep. It's like a Swiss person saying they make 150k a year. That's great...but...
>Yep. It's like a Swiss person saying they make 150k a year. That's great...but...
It's great but... their relative saving rates (relative to their income) is still higher than in the rest of Europe and their actual amount is even higher.
I'd rather make 100k here in Belgium than 150k in Switzerland but the reality is that I make more like 50k gross (that's benefits like company car included) here in Belgium. For 150k a year, I'd move to Switzerland.
Any Swiss people hiring let me know.
Seriously, I can't imagine paying 2500$/mo for mortgage. I'm in Europe, and that kind of payment here would mean you own a \*MASSIVE\* house. Like, genuinely a house that's bigger and fancier than 90% of people's dwellings.
Me and my partner together can carry a mortgage of about 1300 euro a month (so like, a little less than 1500$?) and that's with the both of us working decently paying salaried office jobs as an accountant and functional analyst. We have no kids and can afford a house around 150m2-200m2. If we could afford to add an extra 1k to mortgage payment every month? We'd be able to buy a house \*at least\* twice as big.
I get that cost of living is different; I'm just boggled by how much.
I'm in ontario, canada. $2500 is a very normal-to lowish mortgage here. Especially since covid. I live in a small city 2 hrs north of Toronto, and a cheap 3 bedroom bungalow with a small backyard is 550,000.
It's not just cost of living. America has 330 million people in it. We have the 3rd biggest population in the world and 62% of them generate revenue for businesses. That's A LOT of money flying around. There's just MORE money here then anywhere else in the world. China is still 7 TRILLION dollars behind us.
This is a really good point. If 5% of Americans make >$100k that’s 17,000,000 people….which is what? 25% of the population of France?
Where are you that your utilities are so high? I’m in CA and you’re paying like double what I do.
CA actually had low utility costs, I moved from CA to GA.
I also have a 3k sq ft home with high ceilings, it’s expensive to cool and the AC runs about 10 months of the year.
Salaries in the US are usually higher in the private sector than in Europe. Furthermore, americans pay less taxes and need to use their salary in order to have social security.
Here in Europe it's very common that people in the public sector earn a lot more than those in the privat sector, for what reason ever.
Here in Luxembourg for example the difference is pretty big.
While even engineers often only get about 36k-42k as their first salary - before tax -, they receive about 78k as their first salary in the public sector.
Bus drivers also earn about 30k per year in private sectoe, but get about 50k in the public sector, even 80k at the end of their career - while working less hours.
Also the salaries of people in the public are rising every 2 years.
A lot of people here only earn the minimum salary despite of their Uni degree. (Unless you are IT, medical sector etc) That's why we have a risk of poverty of about 23%.
Most people don't earn over 50k in Europe, in fact it's only a minority.
And let's not forget that Reddit is a filter bubble.
And I'm here working for 350€ a month which equals to 4,2k a year so I'm literally dying for your 19k lmao
I've noticed it too, might be that the only people talking about work and money on Reddit are ones who don't have any money, or value it more than most people. I've noticed there's basically just 2 types of work / money talkers on reddit;
1. Minimum wage worker struggling paycheck to paycheck
2. STEM / Finance bro making $100k a year at age 24
You have to remember that in the US our salary isn't what we take home. I make around 100k a year as a nurse (and had to work up to this point over MANY years and have a ton of student debt) and I probably only bring home 60k. We have to deduct health, dental, vision, and life insurance, state taxes, federal taxes, social security, plus many of us need to contribute to a 401k to ensure we will be able to afford to live after retirement. It's sad when a paycheck comes in and upwards of 40% of it is money you never see.
I gross’d 81, TH 45 last year.
Which is why I always find it funny when Americans make fun of Europeans for having to pay so much in taxes. We're all paying out for the same exact things, it's just that in the US you have to do it all yourself whereas in the EU it tends to just get sorted out for you.
And in the EU your more likely to get what you pay for.
Yeah, we never get the tanks and missiles we pay for.
I should be able to drive a tank for at least 1 hour a year.
And not have to fight for it.
My wife was in a bad accident years ago that had her laid up in bed for months and she spent a few hours every day calling her insurance company or the various doctors offices to sort out the bills. She had to put together a big 3 ring binder with post it notes to keep track of all the bills.
$100k ain't nearly what it used to be
Only 20% of *households* earn over $100k per year (the sum total of both earners), meaning the number of *individuals* earning that income is even less.
This website is disproportionately Americans with white collar jobs that afford them the time to fuck around much of the day (or they’re children of said professionals). There’s going to be a disproportionate number of 6 fig earners (myself included - yes I’m aware my aforementioned comment is a bit of a self-own lol), but we are by no means the US average.
You also have to account for people who have more than $100k in disposable wealth per year derived from other sources (investments, inheritance, etc) when making sense of the amount of wealth people appear to have on this site. Also a lot of people lie and exaggerate their wealth.
If you live in America you would probably make more than 19k working full time at McDonald’s
Is that true?
Nah, he's one of the 90%
I have to work two jobs to be able to make 55k a year and yet that’s still not enough specially here since everything is going up except the salaries.
I think it's worth mentioning that there are drastically different costs of living throughout the country and as a result the same professions will pay more/less in each area as a result
For example, someone who makes 100k a year in a state like Mississippi or Louisiana would be pretty well off and be able to buy a home, but somebody who made as much in California would likely only be doing "okay" and have to rent a modest apartment.
Can confirm. I made $75k in Ohio an lived like a king. Now I make $115k in DC and do okay.
My husband makes that much and yes, pre tax. I’d love to see 8.3k a month.
Edit: he’s not a lawyer or engineer. Union journeyman pipefitter
I work in an investment bank doing sales and trading (of municipal bonds). I won't reveal my current salary but when I started as an analyst, I was pulling in anywhere from 135k-170k each year.
My colleagues in London made half that at best while my friend in Paris made a bit less (typically London's HQ salaries are higher than European ones at the junior levels).
That said, I luckily never had to deal with student debt thanks to working during college and very generous financial aid. My colleagues generally don't have financial aid but one does have some around 5k. My Paris friend has none because he comes from a rich family.
Then when it comes to insurance and rent, it takes out a huge chunk. Paris is the cheapest of the three but London is still pretty expensive. I studied in France so I had free French healthcare which I've experienced before and think is pretty good. It's too bad we can't have something like that in the US.
In my European country i pay a lot of taxes (35-50 percent). But my employer also pays a lot of taxes for me (additional 30 percent at least).
Then my job comes with securities that also need to be paid somehow. One month of health coverage per sickness, sacking expensive, holiday money, insurances, etc…
All this comes out of your gains in some way.
Well I make that much… as an engineer. But I also work an average of 50-60 hours a week. Making 19k in France is a bit easier due to the government aid in things such as insurance. For instance I have relatively ok insurance provided to me which is covered 80% by my employer. I still pay $280 a month and it doesn’t cover anything “out of network” meanwhile the insurance makes it so difficult to to do anything in network, that it’s not even useful. Life and the expenses of living are very different between the USA and Europe and the majority of people on Reddit live in the USA I believe.
Even the region within the US should make a huge difference, from what I've heard. Someone who is living lavishly in one city might barely be surviving on the same income in another city.
It's like that here in Canada, too. In the last city I lived in, I was just scraping by. But I've since moved to a different city in another province where I make lower income but live much more comfortably.
If we're going to compare our incomes dollar to dollar, we'd have to look at people living in the same area as ourselves. It doesn't mean a whole lot to say that some random American Redditor makes 100k a year.
Exactly! I live in the Midwest and my friend lives in the Bay Area of California. He makes double what I make but his cost of living is more than double mine. Rent in his loft apartment is 4x my mortgage.
>I'm european and I work around 40h a week and in american dollars I'm making like 19k a year
Damn. If it's any consolation, "rent" is $2k a month.
In high wage cities rent is likewise high. Think about what it takes to just exist and persist in a dirt poor place like.... I dunno... Romania. Meanwhile, if you don't make at least ~$50k in NYC, you simply can't afford to live there. And that's like hole in the wall living. Shared hole in the wall. Everyone under that is homeless, which cuts you out of most employment.
But yes, a lot of people on Reddit are simply richer. Certainly not all.
US citizen here, who has worked for 2 european companies and it's true that salary expectations are simply different. So even though these companies operate in the US and have all American employees, their salary scale is often a bit lower. One manager confided that Americans just seemed greedy, he hated that he had to pay a mid-level employee in the US more than his senior directors in europe.
That said, I really enjoyed working at both of those european companies. They had above-market generous benefits and just felt like better corporate citizens in general -- lots of community charity programs. And August was awesome, since all of the European HQ was on holiday, the pace of work dramatically slowed for us too.
Yeah, I work directly with a lot of Europeans from various countries and in general I would trade their work culture for ours even if it meant a salary cut. They're all so much more relaxed and have more work life balance. Like they think nothing of fucking off for vacation for two weeks a few times a year and won't so much as leave the number of someone else you can call while they're gone. I like those sort of boundaries between work and life. I don't want more money. I want more time. More of my time.
It's because it's common for the people that make good money to mention it. All of the rest of us schlubs are making like 30 grand but we don't brag about it haha
I want to say thank you for a perspective I’ve not really ever taken seriously. I had no idea that percentage wise so few of my fellow Americans earned that little. I know perception is not reality but there was always a perception on my part that many people were maybe not wealthy but at the least doing better than just getting by. Damn.
They are in France
I make $115k a year as a grocery store meat manager. Been making over 6 figures since I was 22. No college debt. Basically a stress free job. However, I do have to work a 6 day work week every other week that's the downside. My wife who works 5 days a week and is a stock clerk makes 50k. We live quite comfortably in the New Hampshire.
Wtf. Not trying to belittle your profession, but what does a grocery store meat manager do where you can make 6 figures? I see that you sometimes have to work 6 days a week, but many jobs are like that. I know many people where 60 hours a week is common and they maybe make just as much as you.
I’m a retail manager of 10yrs and make 115k a year… no college great benefits, yearly bonuses and 401k.
Make the company a ton of money, plain and simple. It's a good business model. Pay very well = very little turnover. Profitable system stays strong for years on end. Everyone seems to think retail you can just throw any monkey in there and the system stays intact. Couldn't be further from the truth.
Store managers and general managers can easily make over 100k. Usually takes a while to get there since you have to work your way up.
Why do you doubt this?
They stop hundreds of thousands or millions of people from getting sick due to contaminated/poorly stored products.
Maybe it's easy (I have no idea), but it's vital to our supply chain, so why shouldn't they earn a good living doing it?
Sigh. Why did I go to law school?
I'm a pharmacist and my wife is a nurse. Our combined income is ~$300k plus another $80k in bonuses/stocks each year. I never thought I would see numbers like that, but it sure doesn't feel like we're "rich". We live in Southern California, have a $5k/month mortgage, $3k/month daycare, car payments, student loans, etc. Doesn't leave us with a whole lot of fun money each month
Seriously not trying to be rude here but if you are paying 40% in taxes then you are still making $19k a month after taxes. With the expenses you listed, it sounds like a money management issue.
Edit : typo
My wife and I have similar incomes and I get what you are saying. We did a 15 year mortgage and have 3 kids. Things get substantially "better" once that mortgage is paid off and you have the kids through school. When the mortgage and student loans are paid and the kids are through college, that income will seem very substantial in my experience.
Average salary in my country is about 3 500 o 4k a year.
No matter how much educated you are, it still won't be over 5k
But they are changing minimum wage to 450€ a month now, which is HUGE thing considering that almost no one had monthly salary that high. Everything instantly got way more expensive too, so it will be the same as before lol