T O P
r3v

**Just nuked a comment thread here due to pointless bullshit. Take that crap to private messages. It won't be tolerated here.** **This is a contentious topic, so emotions can run high. Try to keep it civil.**


Daveop

Plenty of us still support the club without attending in person. We were STH last year, but have some vulnerable people this year and are choosing to stay home and support in other ways.


eaducks

Mid-week match, but after the challenge cup and the first regular season matches, the loss of GA STH seems clear. The FO has put our fanbase back to 2013, and they will need to do a lot to win back the city.


Turds_McGavno

Only speaking for myself, but with cases up and masks optional, I’m erring on the side of not being in crowds


drieendertig

I was an 8 year STH until this year. Can't speak for others but I need to see some FO change. For me the one-two punch of disclosure of the 2015 Riley harassment, followed a few months later by reporting that they protected AND RE-SIGNED wife beater Polo (while actively doing damage control for the former), means I don't feel comfortable spending my dollars at the stadium. Minimum, I want to see Gavin Wilkinson GONE (and that PR guy who tried to encourage players to stay closeted). Bonus: Get the Thorns their own domain name. I don't want to go to timbers.com any more to find their roster and updates. If it's ONE TEAM or whatever have them both use ptfc.com or something. I did go to the reign game though because i love to hate the ol' reign.


bananajunior3000

This is where I am too. I've been a STH from the beginning but am unwilling to give the club any of my money until they meaningfully address the abuse they've enabled and hidden instead of treating it like a PR exercise. I'm going to buy tickets on the secondary market this season, but it's hard to imagine picking my season tickets back up so long as Paulson cares more about protecting Gavin's job than running a club that walks the walk of valuing and protecting women. I hate that I can't support the players as much, but I care more about justice than sports, I think.


ixodioxi

I'm curious though, the players are asking for your support and you are basically refusing to support them. How can you justify yourself as a fan of women soccer if you just basically refuse to support them? Have the players asked for the firing of Gavin? From my understanding, they have not made that demand. I strongly believe as a fan, we should follow exactly what the players want and not exceed that.


bryteise

Eh I think you need to be able to exercise your own judgement and make use of personal adjacency. Giving up responsibility for your own decisions doesn't sit well with me. The players should probably be an input into your own judgement but not the only thing that matters as they have their own reasons for things as well. Granted I still am a STH but everybody can make up their own mind and have their own reasons for doing what they are doing.


ixodioxi

So you’re willing to harm the players just for your own values? Gavin has no operations relationship with the Thorns at all. The new front office for the Thorns have mentioned that Gavin has no relationship with them other than the GM reaching out to him for advice. Gavin is a top 5 GM in the league and he isn’t leaving the team at all. MP would never sell the team. I just feel like personally there need to be a balance between demanding changes in the organization and supporting the players. Especially when the players have already said they were disappointed with the lack of support at the games and it led to the Riverters’ change in game support. It’s hard for me to come up with any explanations why any fans would intentionally harm women soccer by going beyond what the players are asking for based on their daily experiences in the organization.


bryteise

I think an individual should be willing to make the trade-offs they believe in. If somebody's position is that it is worse to be paying into this system then your argument would need to show that the thing(s) the person cares about are actually worse off instead of better by not attending matches. It also may be that your assumption is the only thing people are concerned about is the players is wrong as well.


PDXPuma

> So you’re willing to harm the players just for your own values? This can go the other way, too. I don't think the values of Thorns fans have changed very much, but clearly the values of Thorns players have. If we're "harming them" by not showing up, aren't they harming us by continuing to play for a front office that no longer aligns with our values? It's unfair to put this all on the fans. Yes, Gavin isn't going anywhere. Yes, the Timbers / Thorns organization will continue covering up things and hiding horrible things and their "we'll make it better" stances are belied by the fact that the last couple of times they've said that, skeletons in the closet came out weeks later. It might be different if they weren't responding to protests during the match or two sticks saying "You knew" or congratulating Madison Shanley for her stance by escorting the fans out and booking them for tresspass warnings, but that's what their response is. So why should fans support a club that they suddenly discovered no longer shares their values? Why is it the fan's fault that they don't feel welcome anymore? The fans who've left attending the game aren't hurting women's soccer. Merrit Paulson is.


bananajunior3000

Who cares that Gavin is a top 5 GM? Is that supposed to make it ok that he's repeatedly protected abuse? You say there should be a balance between demanding changes and supporting players, but why do you get to pick the appropriate balance? The line for me is money and I'm willing to buy aftermarket tickets that have already been paid for, but I get how some have held their nose and kept their season tickets and how others won't return to the stadium. Why is it "harming women's soccer" to boycott games for good reasons but it isn't harming women's soccer to continue to support a front office that at this point has a terrible track record and zero accountability?


IRraymaker

Very well said.


browntoe98

I’ve been trying to avoid large crowds…


raptorhandlerjenny

I’m wondering how much change can happen without the support from the Timbers fans as well. MP is still making money from the Timbers fans so the reduced money from Thorns fans won’t make much of a difference to him imo. It’s unfortunate and I wish the Timbers fans were more aware/united/supportive of the Thorns fans.


PDXPuma

People are voting with their wallets.


2drawnonward5

I used to drive 1.5 hours to attend games, but I'm not as motivated to drive that far, on today's gas prices, to Portland's festive street smells, to sit among unmasked crowds, to support *this* FO. No one of these items is that big a deal on its own but the whole adventure seems less fun than Friends reruns at the moment. All that said, I've only been to two or three mid week games when I wasn't already downtown for work.


crumbshots4life

I'd been a season ticket holder from day 1 until this year. We decided not to renew for a number of reasons - the Riley situation was definitely part of it, Covid is still a little bit of a wildcard, the stupid ass bag policy that makes it harder to bike there, the coaching turnover and lack of significant signings looked like it could be a down year, too many mid-day games in past seasons. All of it combined to make us less than enthused to renew. For now we're doing single game tickets on the second hand market when we want to go to particular games.


lonesomedove224

I went last night. Not a STO holder as I live 2 hours away. I thought it was a solid crowd for (a) a Wednesday during the school year and (b) the weather was not looking like it would be nice at all in the 24/48 hours leading up to it. A little rain/wind would have made it miserable. I know that’s not all the factors (I’ve read the thread and get the reasons stated here), but I think those are important too.


PDXPuma

The weather usually wouldn't be enough to do that to the thorns crowds, we love it when it rains. Comparable Timbers matches on wednesdays this year will likely put people up to the midway point of the 200s. We sat on row three of the 207 and could have been in the 100s if we wanted. This is the way Thorns matches are right now. If the team dies because of it, then so be it. The front office hurt people and those people aren't coming back.


lonesomedove224

Guess I’m just wrong because “we” (and apparently I don’t count) disagree. But the team is second in the league in attendance behind what LA has going (which is awesome), so I think you are what you want to see.🤷🏼‍♂️


PDXPuma

I don't think you're wrong, per se. There is a dip from weather and a dip from midweek, but we basically don't even have capos right now, and we don't have trumpets, and the drums are probably 3x louder than they need to be for the small crowds that "the new Thorns" are going to be until the team either gets sold or the front office staff is cleaned out with bleach. Timbers games have not seen this attendance drop. (or it's been masked by new people coming in.)


lonesomedove224

By the definition of “per se,” I think you had other things to get out that weren’t really germane to my post, but I certainly understand where a lot of folks are coming from right now.


schroedingerx

I canceled my season tickets and donated the full amount to the NWSL Players Association rather than put another dime into MP’s pockets. I’ll do it again every season until he’s out.


TobsNutmegs

Yep, no reason to not want MP to leave PDX anymore.


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Shador_Wasabi

The Seattle game had decent attendance. I would say mid week games are hard. I just couldn't make it work.


ixodioxi

I usually drive down from Seattle for a game every month but with the gas prices and the mid-week game, it wasn't worth it though. It's just way too expensive for gas and taking two days from work for it.


McStadium

Interesting question and more interesting answers. So many different reasons why fans keep off the stadiums. In Germany relegation is on its way and DFB Pokal will be on Saturday. And yes, we see same effects here in Germany at the lower leagues - which hurts the clubs. Honestly, I miss stadium visits at all. And I am back, because there is nothing better than in stadium experience. Today - Women Handball Oberliga with VTV Mundenheim (The Hornets) - may be 200 attendance, but great atmosphere and fun.


honeybee12083

Could it be weather related? This late spring rain has me less motivated to go to matches.


calmnscents

I started a new job and don’t have time off for a while :(