T O P

I’m livid right now. Someone explain this ammo ban to me like I’m retarded. Is there a time frame or something? What’s the deal? So mad.

I’m livid right now. Someone explain this ammo ban to me like I’m retarded. Is there a time frame or something? What’s the deal? So mad.

tinker_toys

As far as I can tell, no new import permits will be issued for now. However, NSSF said that existing import permits are valid until they expire, which could be anywhere from tomorrow until 2 years from now. So, the panic buying will dry up supplies almost immediately, but more ammo may still come trickling in for up to 2 years.


KorianHUN

I'm pretty sure lobbyists are just bribing them to do this shit. Good for business when everyone cal sell overpriced ammo and all of the idiots are in a buying frenzy for like two years now.


ridge_runner56

Well, this has finally motivated me to order dies and reloading supplier for all my commie bloc calibers (although I'm still working on sourcing primers).


SpareiChan

I make sure I have brass and dies for EVERY caliber I own... just in case they disappear, I also own quite a few dead calibers that are harder to find too. Is it likely that Remington 223 would stop being made, no, but I'm sure people said the same thing about Remington 222...


ridge_runner56

Smart move. I have the NATO calibers that I shoot, but not the commie bloc calibers... until now.


steviebee_tao

I am with you. It drove me out of ceiling this evening. Running around to find 7.62x39. All gone off the shelves


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MadeinArkansas

That’s never the case though. I’m sure not planning for some shtf event. I just want to shoot and train regularly but I also want my kids to be able to as well.


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MadeinArkansas

I bought most of mine back in the day when things were cheap and plentiful as you did. I did get a case of Yugo x39 on SKS clips today. I know the ban isn’t for ammo out of Serbia, but it’s all selling out the same and I don’t want to wait a year for more M67.


daonly1991

How do you go about cleaning after you fire m67 I’m planning to buy a crate for my reserve


MadeinArkansas

•disassemble AK/SKS •spray all metal parts with hose •dry all metal parts •lightly (or heavily) oil all metal parts


daonly1991

Are you just wiping it dry or blowing it with compressed air?


MadeinArkansas

Just wiping it out with paper towels or a rag. Compressed air would work pretty good though


hujiklo

I think its mostly people preserving their ability to practice shooting a lot


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iamnickallen

As much as we want so just shut the fuck up


zmannz1984

I, personally, like to go shooting without worrying where the next case is coming from. From 2017-2019, I was shooting a 1000 rounds of x39 and 2-3000 rounds of 9mm a month. Since 2020, I haven't shot more than 1000 of each, total. My hobby is no longer a hobby and the stress of that is costing me my health.


ass_cash253

You ever hear that special word called *training*?


Ratmole13

Nope. It’s forever. Just like the Chinese ban before it. Executive branch LOVES to pass changes and laws that manipulate markets and screw over everyone.


punguns

Same as it ever was.


TheMawsJawzTM

Goes into effect Sept 7th. Lasts 12 months at minimum. Only a miracle of God and Simonov would keep the sanctions from being renewed. Panic buying has already driven the prices up to brass prices anyway. Hopefully GoA and FPC and others could do something about it but I won't hold my breath.


JollyOlDiggerNick

Can they import shit loads until sept 7th?


TheMawsJawzTM

Seems like it. At least to me. But the panic buy that's incurred because of this has already driven prices way up again. Cheap steel Russian is almost already dead


SilentiDominus

If they can rush through 10 years worth of paperwork they may be able to backlog some imports. Part of the ammo shortage problem has been the completely f'd up supply chains though. Even if they could get 10 years worth of paperwork through the actual ability to import them is still crippled & will probably run at a snail pace for a few years. So it's effectively just screwed up the ammo market a second time & probably for a lot longer than the 2 years we've just dealt with.


Panzerschwein45

Relax brah. Nothing we can do about it now. Basically Biden put sanctions on Russia that says no more ammo. It will last 12 months at least and will only end if Vlad Putin admits wrongdoing for poisoning Navalny and promises to never use chemical weapons ever again, which will NOT happen. It boils down to that. Russian ammo is a thing of the past and will not come back.


SpareiChan

> Russian ammo is a thing of the past and will not come back. it's not like steel case is gone, ukraine, serbia, and other comblock countries are imported just fine. I also suspect that some items go thru the middle-man method, like how the chinese SKS get into the US now by sitting in a country for a while before getting imported from there or being repackaged and sold thru that "factory"


SilentiDominus

How much will they be able to get away with? I don't see much Chinese ammo here anymore. Russia supplied huge amounts (50% I read earlier) of ammo to this country. Don't forget all the brands that get shot regulary. Wolf, bear, Tulammo, red army standard from Century arms & of course milsurp ammo. Ukraine basically stopped exporting after their peace ended & civil war started. They brought in a little ammo for a few months though. Romania WAS bringing in ammo regularly through some of the weird rebranders & the Hot Shot brand from Century but I haven't seen much of it for a few years now, even before the shortage. PPU from Serbia & S&B from Czech Republic ammo is more expensive brass usually. Still good ammo & often a bit cheaper than US brands. Still not sure who else you're counting on to bring in cheap usable steel. I haven't seen much but some odd surplus from other combloc countries. People that like to go plink 1000 rds in an afternoon are looking at a real clusterfuck thanks to Biden.


deeperthanthedeepest

Truly shocking that he decided to punish American shooters along with the Russian government.


Ratmole13

Even more shocking that he waited this long after the “poisoning” to ‘put pressure on the kremlin”


deeperthanthedeepest

Well of course! No way this is an attempt to get conservatives talking about something besides the colossal debacle that is still going on in Afghanistan. The whole thing is just weird honestly. Ironically, the timing is perfect for Afghanistan to become a new market for Russian ammo/guns considering I doubt the Taliban will be buying from the US. Pretty wild that we’re actively taking steps that will bring our enemies into closer relationships.


CRAPLICKERRR

What a coincidence that it happens around the time when the ATF’s stupid decrees are about to take effect


TxCoast

Especially since the damage from this is way less than the benefit they will get from the pipeline they just decided to let happen. It's almost like its an excuse to price people out of gun ownership.


Deus_Probably_Vult

Is it though? He hates us.


Panzerschwein45

You’re shocked Biden is against us shooters??


deeperthanthedeepest

I was kidding. Personally I’d bet this is more about screwing us than it is hurting the Russians.


SilentiDominus

Wow... Some real galaxy brain thinking there. You'd bet that 1:1 odds longshot? Really? ;)


SilentiDominus

Just like Trump's trade war that's still fucking people over. Embargos are a tax on American imports & hurt our purchasing as much as Chinese sales. I'd love to see an actually good Republican candidate come in promising to fix the mess Biden has made. We've seen 2 of the worst Republican losers & now a Democratic loser in the last 20 years. No wonder this country functions like hot garbage lately. Roll back the ATF bullshit, import ammo from China & Russia again, get the economy functioning, knock off the Covid BS & get back to normal, get housing market back under control. Give him a 1-2 punch about how he's senile & doesn't understand briefings or foreign affairs. Whether it's all followed through or not the ability to steamroll Biden just writes itself.


deeperthanthedeepest

I’m not saying the trade policies didn’t cause some prices to go up in some industries but we also had the highest average wages in US history, extremely low unemployment, and the market (which means everyone’s retirement saving and pension funds) was doing perfectly fine prior to Covid lockdowns. So far only the markets have come back fully.


SilentiDominus

I'm not 100% sure what you're attacking here but I'll bite on the interesting convo. Wages will always be the highest in history. It's called inflation and it's built into the system. You can never contract the money supply here, only expand it. The trade problems are still creating issues for import costs & farm export retaliation. Market is the same as wage inflation. It can never go back down, going up is baked into the pie. As long as there's more money more will end up in the market. The actual cost of goods (the food market) is not tied to the stock market though. To pretend a big bank account for rich assholes is the same as a healthy functioning economy is part of the problem we're all stuck in. Most workers I know don't have enough money in there to matter. They really rely on Social Security which could evaporate any time. If people really had to live on pensions (rare now) and 401ks I think you'd see a sad state of affairs.


deeperthanthedeepest

The amount amount of increase matters. From 2012-2016 (inclusive) they only moved from 44321.67 to 48642.15. That’s a 4,300 increase in 5 years. From 2017-2019 (inclusive) they went from 50321.89-54099.99 that’s a 3,700 increase in 3 years. Pretty massive difference in the rate. https://www.ssa.gov/oact/cola/AWI.html From 2009-2015 wages rose $1/hr, from 2016-2019 they rose $1.35. https://www.statista.com/statistics/185335/median-hourly-earnings-of-wage-and-salary-workers/ Obviously 2020 numbers are hard to judge due to economic disruption. It’s funny you say that because I don’t know anybody who is planning to rely on social security. Everybody I know has investments of some sort and/or a work pension and I’m 30. Maybe regional or age differences?


SilentiDominus

All I hear is "inflation is growing" which is what I said. It's always growing. It's not an exponential growth (yet) but a strong linear curve. I think it's probably been on that curve since around.... 1920? When did we go to fiat currency? Edit:1970. "Inflation Rate in the United States averaged 3.23 percent from 1914 until 2021, reaching an all time high of 23.70 percent in June of 1920 and a record low of -15.80 percent in June of 1921." Either way 3.2% average is 1600 for 45k but 2k for 55k. You get the idea, right? It will go up by more next year since it's on a linear curve. Forever. I'm 36 PNW. I didn't say anyone is expecting SS to be there. I didn't say I don't know anyone putting money into a retirement accounts either. I just see that 90% of them (20-50) are basically deadbeat losers. As far as finances go.. most have debt, kids, can't pay off their houses and don't have nearly enough saved to actually retire with that money alone. Which is also kind of baked into the system at this point. Some are already dying on the job. The rest better be planning to work until they die. Might as well spend that 401k money because the piddly amount they set aside doesn't mean shit. At 60k you'd need 300k slowly drawn from 401k alone just to keep up with current costs for 5 years. Then you're flat broke after that without SS or pension or going back to work. Most people I know think they're working until they die, if not dying on the job. Just so we're clear. They don't expect to be able to "retire." I think it actually gets easier to make the numbers work as you get closer. At least with SS still in the picture.


jake9325

*legally*


Left4DayZ1

Forgive my ignorance- is Russia the only source of 7.62x39 available to US buyers? I can’t tell if people are concerned because we literally will not have ammo anymore, or because our options are now more limited.


GucciSalad

Wolf comes from Ukraine and Red Army from Romania, I believe.


Comrade_Belinski

There's also a handful of others, Czech, Serbia/Bosnia and etc


TodayWeEatCrow

All of my Wolf ammo is from Russia


knoxknifebroker

So tulammo too?


TodayWeEatCrow

Afraid so


ChrisThePinkWolf

Glad to hear Red Army is fine. Stores in Idaho love to stock that stuff more than anything else.


SilentiDominus

It is not. It is all Russian ammo. They may be able to replace by going back to Romanian ammo, which is where the Hot Shot was coming from... Allegedly. I always figured that was a Russian restamp runaround but maybe not. https://afte.org/laravel.php/gallery/index/5044


SilentiDominus

No. Hot shot ammo came from Romania but hasn't been around for years. Wolf & Red Army are both Russian imports. Wolf is from Tula factory, as is TulaAmmo which is the 9mm imported & sold everywhere. Brown/Silver/Golden Bear are all Russian ammo also from Barnaul. I think those brands died down because that's what is being imported as Red Army Standard now. We are 100% fucked. Especially the oddball caliber shooters like 6.5 Grendel, 9mm makarov, 9x39 & 7.62x39 Subsonic. All that good stuff was coming from Russia.


Me_Want_Pie

I think primers are from Russia. Basically will make things more limited.


Beretta_errata

They're sending it to Canada. NORINCO is a big supplier but that company is banned by name.


punguns

Ordered 1000rds last night. I won't be shooting the SKS as much now. What a shame.


EuphoricWonder

How much you pay for 1000? I only saw it for $0.49 a round which is crazy.


opesorry9999

Im gettin 1,000 rounds private for $350 tuesday


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MagicGeek123

from my understanding it wasn't an executive order and is instead like most ammo sanctions. I also understand that ammunition sanctions have never been lifted in US history even through administration changes so most are just having no choice but to accept it.


Im_Human_After_All

It lasts 12 months according to the state department, which means that American manufacturers are probably just going to wait out this bureaucratic bullshit and skip making steel. We’re going to be in the dark for quite a while. edit:a word


Panzerschwein45

It will last 12 months ONLY if Russia does a bunch of political junk that they won't do.


Im_Human_After_All

Sad but true. I should have mentioned minimum of 12 months, maximum of a russian regime change (or maybe when American politicans pull their heads out their asses, what’s more likely)


Pew_Pew_Petey

The ban doesn't allow for issuing new permits on imports, so if a US supplier has an existing permit for a million rounds, that's it. It will suck in the short run, primarily because of panic buying and stupid prices. My understanding is that Russia could resolve the issues but We all know it's not as simple as that. My hope is that Russian manufacturers are currently figuring out a way to shift operations to a non-sanctioned country, if that's even possible. The other thing is to consider that Russian isn't the only player over there, it may just take a while for those other non-Russian manufacturers to be able to increase output enough to be able to fill the gap.


SilentiDominus

I don't know the details but a lot of imports work like this: "I want to ship this container of ammo. It has 1.6 million rounds of ammo on it." "Ok, here is your permit." Which means you don't get to load & ship any more containers. It sounds like a permit is an issued thing upon export, not like a company gets issued a permit & an amount of rounds they can export per year. The problem is they can't get containers. That is already part of the shipping, supply chain issues & why we haven't been flooded with Russian ammo to bring things back the last 2 years. China is using all the available containers & no one else can get any. So they may be able to put a rush, pay more & load like... 20 or 30 containers? (Who knows? I sure don't.) in the next 20 days. Which means we'd get like 48 million rounds which sounds like a lot on paper but every gun in America would get to shoot 1/8th of a round. Just to satisfy one normal weekend for every gun if they're active shooters you'd need about 400 billion rounds of ammunition or 250,000 containers worth of Russian ammo imports. FUCK I wish we'd let the Chinese ammo back in.


Me_Want_Pie

Just Russia ammo specifically is getting banned ' the import itself'. There are still plently replacements, just russia makes a ton of parts for the rounds. So the prices will be high till people calm down.


SilentiDominus

Yeah, just Russia... & Since just the China has already been banned that means just the 0 good ammo exporters are left. It's not going to calm down now. Not if this stands. There is no replacement for 75% of the ammo that would be shot in this country. At least not for a long-long time & a lot of changes the other direction would need to happen. Time to join HomeSec so I can get my share of that 1.6 billion rounds of ammo to plink with. Border Patrol goes out in the woods here & burn up govt. purchased ammo like it's going out of style. My kinda fun.


Me_Want_Pie

Yea... i need to learn to love plinking with a shotgun, only cheap ammo left around.


SilentiDominus

It's at least a fun thing to shoot with some power to it. Hell I'd take 10,000rds of .22 lr just so I can shoot something for awhile until this ammo shit gets straightened out a little bit.


Me_Want_Pie

Ha. Its easier to get sks ammo rn than .22 snifle people are still panick buying all ammo they see, even if its uncommon.


falcon62

Someone is going to have to start ramping up on brass cases 7.62 ammo. Hopefully the prices aren’t outrageous.


Beretta_errata

What's the deal? >New and pending permit applications for the permanent importation of firearms and ammunition manufactured or located in Russia will be subject to a policy of denial. Until the Russians stop using chemical weapons on political opposition.


jumpinjimmie

Im not mad, fuck Russia. They should Not assasinate people with chemical warfare in Ally cities.


Slow_Hold8240

This has nothing to do with him. They don’t care they poisoned that guy, plus we already granted them a pipeline and this is how they’re gonna stick it to us? Cmon dude.


im_kinda_ok_at_stuff

Amen. It sucks for us but I'd rather pay more for ammo than support the Russian arms industry. Their oligarchs have stolen everything from the country so there's little money to support it domestically. By sanctioning ammo they're left with less options.


sksarego

I would but I have brain damage and can't


WranglerJR83

You’re livid and you don’t understand what is happening? Why are you so angry if you don’t even understand what is making you angry? You should probably try to understand that before you waist time trying to understand this thing that is happening.


JollyOlDiggerNick

Dude shut the fuck up weirdo. It’s obvious I’m mad because prices are absurd again.