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School attorney enrages parents when he says their children can't read.

School attorney enrages parents when he says their children can't read.

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ohwhatj

It’s a charter school. That explains a lot.


mkat5

Unfortunately it explains everything. God damn its a cruel irony that these became popular particularly among the black community. The thought is the public schools in a lot of these communities are horribly underfunded and unequipped, and the charter school offers a way around that, except they're mostly scams themselves.


IsSierraMistOk

I went to a Christian charter school for grades 1 through 8. It was an all black school that was ran by our church. I don't know what kind of structure they followed, but it seemed like they were winging it every year. At one point, we had a shortage of teachers so grades 7 and 8 were taught at the same time by the same teacher (usually 1 teacher per grade). In 6th grade, we rarely did actual school work. Our teacher was a huge soccer fan and spent most of his time talking about sports or cracking jokes. Our SSAT test was damn near open book. I was accepted to a magnet school for high school and that first year was incredibly rough. I went from being a consistent honor roll student to someone that was barely passing. I eventually caught up and graduated high school on honor roll, but I sometimes wonder if it would've been easier if I went to a public middle/elementary school instead.


NeoKnife

From your story, consider yourself fortunate that your early years at the charter did not completely screw you.


SuperDingbatAlly

Same here, I didn't know what it was called until now, TIL, but I got offered to enroll in a private school for tuition free because my grades were so far above the rest. Though, I was in public school. Then I get to the magnet school, and I couldn't keep up, I struggled until we moved outta state. I was still a passing student, but went from 4.2 GPA to like 3.5. I was in all AP classes, was in Duke Universities Young Scholars Program, and all that and was still struggling. Then again, this happens all over the country, especially in rural areas. Kids will end up with 4.0 GPAs Valedictorian and everything, and end up dropping off full rides to good Universities because of the education gap.


HamburgerEarmuff

It's been a huge problem in California, not even with charter schools, but just with the differences in public schools. California State University and the University of California reserve a certain number of spots to the top fraction of each school class, but often, the best students at the worst schools aren't even prepared for college and have to take a year or more of remedial classes to even place in English and math at the university level. Meanwhile, at some of the better public schools, the middle GPA student is more prepared for college than th*e summa cum laude* at some of the worst schools.


Snarky_Boojum

Same for Ohio. I moved just prior to my junior year and went from being a year ahead in my math classes to being a year behind because the move took me from a small school serving three towns to a large suburb with two high schools for the single town. Grades dropped because I felt so cheated after putting in all the extra work only to find out I was already behind. Never did extra work for high school again and barely passed. Once I got to college I put in serious effort again, but I’m still mad about all of it twenty years later.


NeoKnife

Read a story about some kids from Louisiana that were praised for being so smart at their school and graduated top of the class. They went to Harvard and got eaten alive.


mira-jo

Happened to a guy I was friends with at my school. Rural WV school, graduated valedictorian, got a full ride to an ivy, said he was gonna be a cardiothoracic surgeon because "he wanted a challenge". Got a harsh reality check his first semester. He managed to hang on for a while, the school worked with him and his parents footed as much of the bill as they could but in the end it wasn't enough, he wasn't even close to a degree and now works at a gas station.


ppw23

How many times have stories come out in a similar vein of kids who are super confident since they graduated in the top portion of their class, only to require remedial courses in all the basics once they reach college?


SuperDingbatAlly

Yeah.. it happens. A lot. I went to a 1-A school for a bit. My cousins happened to attend there and my mom thought it would be good to have family at school. Something that wasn't a thing for me growing up until I moved up here. One of them had 3.9 GPA and had a full ride to Purdue. She dropped out due to grades, couldn't keep up. But that's also when the secret came out that she basically cheated the entirety of high school and got away with it. She found out a rotation of people that would trade homework. The teachers sucked so bad, and cared so little, that homework trading and test trading was commonplace among her friends. Then it came out, they her entire friend group had created a racket for grades, that spanned 2 generations AFTER SHE LEFT SCHOOL. It made the local news here, but the damage was already done. It was only hearsay and conjecture, because they couldn't actually prove she and her friends kept it going for their siblings. It was a nightmare for her, for a bit. She had to move and change her name, because our local little city wasn't havin any of it.


c_pike1

Don't know about where you're from but your description fits the public schools in my area perfectly (plus loads of extra violence of course). If I had to guess, I'd think your experience would probably have been the same either way, but good for you for gutting it out and rising to the occasion


InconspicuousBastard

I had to look up what a charter school was. So it's a public school that no longer has to abide by any local, state, or national accreditation/oversight? How does that even work? I mean clearly it doesn't, but geez, that sounds like an awfully bad idea.


MadIfrit

When I worked for a small bookstore years ago, an older lady came in and straight face asked me to see if we had "how to create a charter school for dummies" in stock. I was really flabbergasted and didn't even fully get what a charter school was. Looked it up and it doesn't exist but she thought it did, which speaks volumes, I think.


DilatedNipples

No - it depends on the state but most charter schools either run as a group of schools within a school district (e.g. Philadelphia) or they run as a separate local education agency (i.e. their own school district). They still have to abide by public school rules and laws against discrimination. It's the administrative make-up that's different, and it basically allows outside organizations to setup schools using in-part public funds while fundraising the rest.


theangryeducator

So much of it is based on state regulations. I have taught in Utah and now Ohio. In Utah, it really was the wild west. One could start a school, in a brand new building, with little oversight. In Ohio, charter schools can only be created in districts where public schools are majority failing. Even then, charter schools have to use a re-purposed or retro-fitted building to save money. Having been in education for more than a decade and taught in a few different settings, there are too many factors to paint broadly. There are excellent charter schools that help the underserved communities that they serve better than public schools. There are some charter management companies that are terrible and looking to make a profit. There are public schools that are amazing, and there are public schools that are doing a detriment to the students they serve and the unions and bureaucracy around them are strangling the districts in which they exist.


Sethlans_the_Creator

Schools that aren't required to adhere to testing requirements and aren't required to service every child, and yet still somehow manage to fail. In truth, they're cash grabs for families of con artists like DeVos


Shallowpools923

In Florida, these schools can expel LGBT students and fire teachers based on their sexuality. Tax dollars also go to “vouchers” for students to attend these schools, just as long as those students aren’t gay I guess...


summonsays

Both my parents were teachers for their entire career. Charter/private schools can be good,but 95% of the time it's horrible. No oversight means no rules, no rules pertain to hiring as well. Do you know every teacher at public schools go through extensive background checks to make sure they arent pedophiles or have other dangerous mental issues / histories? (Obviously it's not perfect and some shit still happens). Do you know public school teachers have to be certified and that requires an education with a focus in their career's subject? Charter schools can and will hire anyone.


sneakyveriniki

It’s unbelievable how much leeway they have. They are 90% money schemes, almost never about the kids. I just wrote a very rambling comment about my experience working in one that was very thinly veiled white supremacist. We would chant “MAKE EDUCATION GREAT AGAIN!” Yeah. However, I actually attended one in high school and it was an amazing school, no joke. They took education very seriously. It was more difficult but more interesting than college was and is ranked one of the best schools in the state, even among the private schools (mine was free, unlike the private schools that cost sometimes tens of thousands of dollars per year). They just vary wildly.


drot525

Where I'm at, they promise the moon, get as many enrollees as they can. School starts late Aug, they get paid for their kids by the state in October, and here comes the suspensions and expulsions kicking them back to the local SD. It's a shit show.


TheCooperChronicles

Well if the public school was well funded then it wouldn’t need to be replaced by a charter school. I wonder why they want to only give funding to private charter schools and not public ones.


Gluten_Free_Pancakes

Can you explain what a charter school is please? Sorry I don't know how this works in the US but I think in Spain we have a similar concept and also, it seems a very similar issue too.


TheCooperChronicles

So basically when a public school “fails” one thing the state government might do is to charter the school out to a private company which will get public funding for operation. This practice is mostly in bad faith as the original public school would perform better, or on par with the new charter school if it had received extra funding.


Gluten_Free_Pancakes

This sounds a lot like what we have in Spain and it's an issue there as well. A lot of charter schools getting public funding, while requiring parents to pay too (albeit small amounts in comparison to private schools) and those charter schools in spite of the funding of public and private sources they don't perform any better. There's been a lot of issues with not having proper measures in place to check/veto teacher credentials as well as not actually having monitoring and evaluation measurements to improve in any regard whatsoever what would otherwise be done by a public school.


ilikegreencows

Public school teacher here! Its worse than that. You forgot to mention the core of the problem with a Charter school. The school will then be run using public AND private money. Where does that extra public money come from? The closest public school! It sucks out the life of the nearest school. Know who owns the largest Charter program in the country? Betsy Devos. The Secretary of Education under Trump for the past 4 years! The owners make billions off the schools. The teachers at Charter schools do not need to be certified teachers either. Its a mess.


Dr_Mike_Hunt_MD

The funny part is some of them are literally money laundering schemes, look up Betsy Devos and "Ghost charter schools" to understand why this country is such a god damn joke with education.


chuckalicious3000

They can also pick and choose students so low performers (special ed kids,, families that dont give a shit, ELL kids)are often not accepted and stay in the under funded public school. In areas like Louisiana where the replaced all the public schools with charter schools and they forced them to take all students since there was no public option the performance was actually worse than the public schools.


Gluten_Free_Pancakes

Exactly. This is what I meant in my second point. Thanks for making it clearer.


throwthrowandaway16

That's the most American thing I've read today.


ZukowskiHardware

It’s for profit education using public funds


peekdasneaks

Always comes down to money. Who runs the public schools? Who runs the charter schools? One of the 2 main political parties have consistently been pulling funding from public school systems for decades while simultaneously pushing for more charter schools. This is because they can invest in companies related to charter schools, or take just straight up take cash from them in the form campaign donations. In reality these are payments to government officials to continue destroying public school systems and promoting/voting for legislation that benefits charter schools. Corruption at its finest and all made legal by that same party's passing of Citizens United.


SprinklesFancy5074

Also they enjoy taking money from public schools so that it can be given to private religious schools.


ChiraqBluline

Towns revenues come from community taxes. Community are built and compete with one another, and rely on town data to compete to sell themselves and to lure in new residents. School standings are a big part of that. Your moving to a new burb and have two choices town A- with a public school and town B with a Charter. You look at your sources, do a drive around, looks at test scores and such, and supposedly get an unbiased answer to help make your decision. However Town As public school had to follow all the local and federal mandates, hire teachers with degrees in education with continued Ed courses, allow all kids to enter the school, allow all IEPs and 504s, all ESL, all the kids with behavioral LDs in and with open arms. These are decent schools but the testing reflects the mixed learners population. Maybe it’s got a C+ on the school ratings. Maybe it’s work is strong in community, equity and development... anyways Town B - Charter school, can hire anyone with a BA (fresh young blood), pay whatever they want (usually lower then Public counterparts) and SEL this as “Breaking the Mold”, they can refuse kids who have Developmental Learning differences, they can refuse kids who didn’t test in because English isn’t their first language, they can kick out kids who don’t test well, they can mandate Parents participation (which sounds good, but for working class parents it’s impossible)- They can and do use lots of tactics to keep the scores high. They can weed out all of the variety that creates lower scores, and that A+ standing on the website looks amazing. Which town are parents going to choose based on that online school grader? And separate from this issue: we have Black Americans pushing for a new systems because Public schools have yet to be fair to black children. It’s still white dominated curriculum and Black families are looking to change the landscape for their kids and our kids by leaning on Charters that aim to do this. Some charters are successful at this aspect.


Goalie_deacon

> I wonder why they want to only give funding to private charter schools and not public ones. Back door kick back money. That has to be the why and how of it. Fixing public schools don't kick back money into campaign funds. Private business owners do.


TheCooperChronicles

Yup


HamburgerEarmuff

I mean, it's not just a question of funding. The US is actually near the top in per-student funding in the developed world. Funding isn't a panacea, especially when you don't address the underlying problems of why well-funded schools are often terrible. Typically, the lowest-performing schools get additional government subsidies to improve, but funding alone can't make up for the other factors.


Itzfoodthony

I went to a Spanish charter school during 4th - 6th grade and I can confirm that these charter schools are SUPER underfunded. Hell we had to share our school with another school and that was awful until that other school moved out. This got so bad, in 5th grade we had to rent a trailer for the rest of the school year because there was no space. The teachers were nice but are UNDERPAID. Each year, half the teachers step down or get replaced and it's a shit show. Hell they says they "teach Spanish" but they fucking don't, they teach the subject IN SPANISH. Its bullshit especially if you don't know any Spanish. Also when I first started, there was a scandal that apparently the school principal had a warrant and fled to Florida. The year I left, the principal was super abusive to children. Please be careful when it's time to pick schools for your children, always look and hear from parents and previous students themselves.


Goalie_deacon

As someone who went through this very situation, yes. We avoided our public schools for this reason, coupled with having an autistic son, and just before he was to take school, a cop was called to handcuff a 5 year old autistic boy. We noped out of that, and went to a charter school. Oldest son was bullied by 3 boys, physically assaulted multiple times, they did nothing. Autistic son did not get the help they promised. Our daughter was still illiterate by 3rd grade because of their crappy teachers. If that wasn't enough, wouldn't let me talk with teachers about our kids' progress, especially the autistic son, without it being a semester meeting. I'm not stopping there, then twice made false reports about me to CPS. When that building closes, I'll be calm when looking back at these stories. If it ever burns, I'll laugh. Charter schools isn't mostly scams, they are full scams. And their low testing schools should prove that.


Renhoek2099

If your daughter is illiterate by the 3rd grade, you are partly responsible.


Shaqattaq69

Yup. For some reason parents forget their role in educating their kids.


bawbrosss

Right? My son was reading almost full sentences by kindergarten all taught by his mother and I


JBloodthorn

I was fortunate to have a stay at home parent who taught me to read before kindergarten, but not every one has that boost.


spankymacgruder

It's a lot easier to say you pay your taxes and everybody is out to get us than it is to actually improve your child's future. The school administrators are playing politics, agitating the parents and not taking any responsibility. These kids are doomed to fail and everyone that allegedly cares about them has actively participated in thier failure.


BettyDraperIsMyBitch

Seriously. My mom taught us how to read and write, and she worked full time. And our preschool was a huge help as well.


Filipjizzman

yeah I can still remember sitting with my dad and learning to read, I didnt know a word so I looked at him for help and he said well the answer isnt on my forehead sound it out.


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patentaz

I had a co-worker who was dating a single mom with a 13 year old boy who could barely read -- he couldn't read a menu in a restaurant. Kid was hiding it out of shame, the school kept passing him along, and the mother was in denial.


ppw23

That is heartbreaking. I’ve worked as a volunteer helping adults who can't read. The stories they told of the effort required to disguise the reality of this necessary skill for daily living, were often the same, i.e., forgotten eyeglasses. The shame was constant for them. As a parent, you must see where your children require additional assistance and provide it immediately.


Sassh1

My mom taught me how to read and write when I was at the preschool level too. I was reading at a 5th grade level by grade 2. Parents and the environment the kids grow up in matter so much. My mom also had 2 jobs.


ZenTraitor

You gotta take some of those predictive reading standards with a grain of salt. I was a part of the Accelerated Reader program in grades kindergarten through 8th grade at a private catholic school. When I was reading “Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire” I was projected to be reading at a high school level. When I go back and compare some of the books that I read in high school like “Brave New World”, “Frankenstein,” “1984,” “The Odyssey,” or “Things Fall Apart,” they never compared to the books that were advertised at scholastic book fairs or other books that were used as standards to classify a students reading ability.


Coochie_Creme

Seriously, my mom made me read a book for at least 30 minutes after school when I was little.


GirlGangX3

But a charter school is the last place you would send a child with special needs? They aren’t required to offer the help like public schools are. I thought this was common knowledge? I’m not being snarky I’m just asking


my79spirit

Yeah the middle school or autistic son was supposed to go to showed us their “isolation room” for the special needs students. It was a sea foam green, windowless, cinder block room next to the gym. We noped out and the special needs teacher was arrested like 5 months later for having cocaine on her while on campus


LostWoodsInTheField

> a cop was called to handcuff a 5 year old autistic boy I just watched a video a few weeks ago of something similar. The police were talking about how the kid needed beat, that the parent should be in jail, they talked about putting the kid into jail himself. This kid couldn't have been more than 5 or 6 years old. Teachers were complete shit, and every time the kid cried they got more pissed with him. The mother when she finally arrived was treated like shit, told she should be beating her kid when he acts up. Completely messed up.


Goalie_deacon

Yeah, that’s what binary thinking produces, do what they want, or get beaten. Understand an autistic kid, they don’t think binary like that.


HibiCheese

If your kids can’t read by third grade, you should not be blaming the school or the teacher.


Llyxia

I'm a school psychologist, and this year I evaluated 6 3rd graders who could not read. Low income familes, and at least one of the parents was illiterate herself. It's sad.


auzrealop

Is this in the US?


Llyxia

Yes, Arizona


FirstPlebian

The conservatives dream of privatizing all schools, in MI in 2000 Betsy Devos and company sponsored a ballot initiative to give each parent a voucher to send their kids to whatever school they wanted, it went down in flames, like 70 percent against. But they are still working the long game against public schools, and public everything really, even police they want to privatize.


FreydisTit

Florida really ramped up the dismantling of the public school system around 1998-2000. They tried to reintroduce busing, using kids as political cannon fodder knowing the public would be against it. They came up with the FCAT test which would determine school funding and grade schools based on test performance. Failing schools would receive LESS funding, and if they failed multiple years in a row, the school would be taken over by the state and staff could be replaced. Many teachers who replaced the staff were incentivized to do so by student loan forgiveness programs that stipulated loans would he forgiven if they worked for 10 years in failing or nearly failing schools. Now the failing schools had teachers that were not from their community, did not look like them, and still had to teach to the test. Many of these teachers got their MA in elementary education knowing they could get loans forgiven, and more experienced teachers were passed over for those with more advanced degrees. Oh, then DeVos ratfucked that whole thing and fucked the loan forgiveness program. They also started the voucher program, but needed to find a way to get more kids into religious private schools. Since many of these religious private schools could not accept vouchers because they did not meet teaching standards and could discriminate, Florida developed the tax credit scholarship which pretty much launders tax dollars through a non-profit into scholarships for private schools. Charter schools hit the scene and could take the voucher money without much oversight regarding quality, and many charter schools are owned by the same companies and make a ton of money (my city has charter school companies in their investment portfolio they disclose to the public). Now Florida has gone next-level with their dismantling of public education by writing legislation that allows parents to pull their kids out of classes that mention AIDS, reproduction, factual history, or anything else they could find offensive. No critical thought allowed. But DeSantis gave teachers pay raises so he can bring that up as proof he is on the side of teachers. His executive orders during Covid were outrageous and counterproductive.


HubbyHasBlueBalls

I’ve worked in Florida’s “top” schools. It was appalling. We had 20-30 students who were completely illiterate. Teachers in every classroom had to teach the same exact lesson, the same exact way, at the exact same time. The principal should be able to walk from one room to the next without missing anything about the lesson. This way if one teacher had several special needs kids in her class and another teacher had several gifted children in her class, the state wouldn’t come in and blame the teacher with special needs students if her class performed worse on the standardized test, because everything taught was scripted and identical. It was overall, appalling.


Kee6

What’s a charter school?


yokeldotblog

A compromise between the public and private option where funding vouchers are handed out to fund them.


azalago

The problem is that while they consider themselves to be "public" schools, they do not have the same level of accountability as a public school. There are a lot of them here in Texas that did not follow COVID guidelines when they re-opened, my neighbor's kid attended one where they hid COVID cases from parents.


FaustTheBird

That's not accurate. Vouchers can be used for private schools. A Charter Schools is a Public School, owned by the state Department of Education (DOE), but operated by a Charter Management Organization (CMO). A CMO applies to the DOE for a charter to educate a certain number of children within a certain grade range. If the DOE grants the charter, the CMO is entitled to open a school and families are entitled to attend that school according to the terms of the charter, set by the DOE. For every child that attends a charter school, the state pays the SCHOOL, not the CMO, and the school pays the CMO a management fee that is capped by the charter school law of that state. Charter Schools are Public Schools. Families do not receive vouchers. Charter Schools receive funding from tax dollars just like District Schools do (i.e. by headcount). Charter Schools are managed by a CMO in lieu of being managed by a District that is in turn managed by the DOE. Charters for managing a school are granted by the DOE according to rules set forth in state law and those same charters are revoked by the DOE according to rules set forth in state law.


Kee6

Interesting thank you. I think this might be an American thing? As I don’t think we have them in Canada as far as I know.


Tainted_wings4444

Nah, only in Alberta tho.


IrishHounds

There’s that weird secondary school North of Red deer (Lacome area I think) it might be something close to a charter school


graps

A way to transfer public tax money to private companies


ReflexImprov

A good chunk of charter schools are scams, unfortunately. Explains why Devos was so into them, considering the Amway connections.


Viocansia

I just spent two years teaching at a charter in a city with 6 years of regular public school experience before that. I will never work for a charter ever again. They are so disingenuous and downright harmful for already marginalized communities by trying to force education into a business model. It doesn’t fit. It will never fit. The network head is so consumed with data because if they can’t con the board into thinking that their backwards, micromanaging systems are working, the charter can no longer exist. It isn’t good for kids. Money would be much better spent bolstering the suffering public schools that already exist. Want to guess what the network head drives, and where she lives? She is massively gritting off of a school that isn’t doing right by the kids it serves.


ThegreatestPj

Eli5 I’m from England and I’m not sure what a charter school is I’m afraid


beIIe-and-sebastian

See: Academies/Free schools in England.


JACKASS20

I knew that just by reading the title


InconspicuousBastard

Unfortunately, these parents are more outraged that someone had the balls to tell them the truth to their face, and in response they start talking about there being no peace without justice. Socio-Economic disparity being played out right before our eyes. Edit: Personally, I feel that the whole no child left behind ideology has contributed greatly to the current predicament. No child left behind became an avenue where children were automatically pushed forward most of the time. I remember there was a guy who used to write the SAT tests for decades. He showed how the same mathematical problem had been dumbed down in subsequent generations. The questions were too hard, and too many minorities were failing to score high scores, so the powers that be decided the solution was to lower the bar, over and over again until an adequate number passed. That ideology does nothing but a disservice to our children, especially once they hit college and/or the work force, where they were competing against people who didn't have those training wheels throughout their education.


Normth

> to tell them the truth to their face He may have had some kind of point but you don't see a problem with putting it that way? Or do you really think those kids can't read a newspaper?


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PurdSurv

> Honestly he was responding to a bad faith question in the first place. Exactly. I knew it wasn't going to go well as soon as I heard, "And if you have a response, bottle it." That immediately made it obvious the gentleman speaking at the start was more interested in grandstanding than actually having productive discourse. Few people in this video came off in a good light.


DangerousSweet8

The school is an embarrassment to the state. https://www.schooldigger.com/go/PA/schools/0085407394/school.aspx?t=tbTestScores#aDetail


dankprogrammer

sad there are still 100 schools in the state ranked lower than that too


IsitWHILEiPEE

It's ranked 1,450 out of 1,544 - your math is a bit off Edit: glad you got that corrected


frustratedbuffalo

Probably went to a charter school.


AggresiveDuckSlayer

Now that's a low blow


HiemJew

Order. Order! Ladies and gentlemen ORDER!


bobr05

With racist undertones!


SignificantChapter

*racial overtones You probably went to a charter school


bobr05

If I could read that I’d probably be very offended.


tpinkfloyd

Can they be called a school with scores like that?


Solid_Waste

Internment camp more accurate.


Heart_Throb_

Holy shit! How do they get over $16,000 *per student* but still have low test scores and rank 1,400ish in their State? The charter my kiddo is about to attend is 65th in our state yet only gets a little over $7,000 per student.


aerovirus22

The whole city is an example of shitty schools. So glad we bailed when our kids were in K and 2nd grade. Sucks, I have great memories of growing up in Erie, but it just keeps getting worse and worse in every possible category.


Starbuilder5

There could be a issue with profiteering.


flappyforeskin69420

I wonder how much they spend on whoever provides lunch.


Starbuilder5

Do they spend that money on the lunches? I had to pay for my lunches.


prallundfeucht

someone gets rich here. there are kickbacks. obviously


TheBarkingGallery

Holy shit. Do they even teach math at this school at all?


MapedMod

In Europe we do not have stats like that for schools in many countries. Could anyone explain to me what I am looking at? Is it really that bad? Because if it is at 17k per student than this school should really be closed..


kinslayeruy

Just look at the charts, the school (in blue) vs the state (in green) averages, per grade. They are horrific. And there's like 13/14 students per teacher, so it's not a problem of oversaturation, and they get 16k per student, they should be able to give them a great education. But they don't Edit: typo


MapedMod

I was looking at the charts and it seemed unbelievable to me so I wanted to ask. This school is not even a school if it does have stats like that and I am not really sure if kids there are actually able to read that damned newspaper.. It is not a racial matter. It is a HUGE fuckup of that school and no attorney or public screaming is going to convince me otherwise. It is also a huge fuckup of the parents if they are unable to see that there is literally no progress.


Dininiful

Teachers are definitely underpaid in general, but how much do they get paid in charter schools? You'd think that with 16k per student they could attract some top pedagogical minds.


kinslayeruy

Probably more underpaid than in other schools, since the main point of charter schools is making the owners rich with gov money


TheAJGman

Wonder what state *sees PA in the url* Ah, not surprised. They were trying to allow people to cash out the tax money they were paying towards Harrisburg School District because no one with any amount of money sends their kids to those schools. I don't really blame them, but the districts problem is with corruption and funding.


xpinballwizard

Tying school funding to test scores is so absolutely fucking stupid that I don't even know where to begin. How do I spell this out? Kids who are socioeconomically disadvantaged always score lower on standardized tests than their peers. It's not because they are dumber. It's not a repudiation of their teachers or the education staff who serve them. It's because they have other shit to deal with. Their communities are disadvantaged and that manifests itself in a myriad of ways (hunger, ADD, trauma, etc). Standardized test scores are not an accurate representation of the intelligence of students and these communities. Standardized tests themselves are inherently biased. All this is doing is widening the gap between the haves and have nots. Standardized tests are merely being used as a chit counter for society's ignorant ill-informed middle-management "leaders" to discriminate against marginalized communities because they lack the intelligence or imagination to understand the actual complexity of a real life situation involving real people. If it's not due to a lack of understanding or empathy, then they're just straight up willfully ignorant pieces of shit full-stop, because these policies are being used to *punish* the disadvantaged, implying they are not deserving of opportunities for being disadvantaged to begin with.


Supermanwithatan01

When they were asking for an apology, I low key was waiting for: “I’ll put it in the newspaper so they can read it”


jdshowtime12

Oh, shit! This made me laugh my ass off. The people in the audience would’ve burned that place down had he said that.


ZeMoose

Getting the kid to read the newspaper to him was a nice touch.


ConfidentPapaya665

Wish they would be this pissed that the kids can't read...SMFH


GirlsLoveMyNeckbeard

Okay so let's see if he can read it *video cuts off* 😂


Pixel3818

Top 10 anime cliffhangers


Sin-A-Bun

Charter schools are an absolute scam by the right. People think they want to get rid of government spending, they don’t, they want more of it but they just don’t want any of it going to poor people.


ghostalker4742

They want their kids to go to school without poor kids. They also don't want to pay for that.... since they pay taxes. So the "compromise" is they take tax dollars and give them to private charter schools as vouchers.


No-Patient

I don't know about other states, but Florida charter schools are 100% open to all students. Its a waiting list and ANY parent can put their kid on it and they will get picked in line, 100% of the time. The exclusions are for students who have a sibling already in the school, who get priority. Charter schools in Florida are pretty good, although they can vary based on administration, much like any other school. They're placed pretty conveniently in my area for most students but the ones here don't provide bus service, which can end up excluding some students. However, there are waivers parents can get to include bus service, but getting that might present some barriers for the very poor. My youngest went to a charter school and it was way better than even the better middle school in our area, because she was much more comfortable in a smaller school. Charter schools do take away from other public school funding, but its still a completely free public school for any florida child. The key factor is that it more-often includes non-poor students because those parents just statistically won't pursue signing up their kids. I'm open to hearing reasons why they're so bad, though, that I've missed touching on.


GapingGrannies

They just have no oversight and suck resources from the public school system. We should focus on fixing that up and not funding these private schools with a profit incentive, which are not necessarily any better over better funding for existing public schools. They are the wolf in sheep's clothing, the Betsey Devos supported method of bullshit. That being said they can be good or better than what currently exists, however the system is what's broken.


ashley_spashley

Here’s an article about [why they suck](https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/education/fl-ne-charter-schools-report-20180918-story.html)


Ivabighairy1

Was the attorney right? Or wrong?


SmellGestapo

It appears he was correct. [https://www.goerie.com/news/20190808/inappropriate-remark-costs-lawyer-erie-schools-role](https://www.goerie.com/news/20190808/inappropriate-remark-costs-lawyer-erie-schools-role) This charter school is called Erie Rise. Their students have only 4.5% proficiency in math, compared to 18.3% proficient in the district overall.


dolerbom

Even 20 percent is a pathetic bar. Get rid of charter schools and stop funding schools with estate taxes smh.


DatEngineeringKid

This is super pedantic, but property taxes. Estate refers to what is left behind by a dead person to settle debts and bequeath as part of a will. Reason I bring it up is estate taxes is a separate body of tax from property taxes.


seyerly16

I think you mean property taxes?


StagnantSweater21

Damn did I misunderstand their convo, or did he say they can’t read


SmellGestapo

The first man speaking in the video is the CEO of the charter school. The man up on the dais is an attorney representing the school district, which has decided to close the school for poor performance. The CEO is basically fighting for his job (he needs to keep his schools open, because his job is running charter schools). He's arguing that it's not his fault that the students tested poorly, but the *district's* fault because their decision to close the school caused the students so much stress that they tested poorly. But this school has had test scores well below the district average for multiple years. The attorney for the district used a rhetorical comment to take apart the CEO's logic. The idea that these students were well-prepared all year long and just fell apart due to stress from a newspaper article is ridiculous. The attorney's comment is clearly not meant to be taken literally, but is meant to suggest that the CEO has failed in his job to run a school that educates kids.


rowdyechobravo

Wow. A lot of really helpful context in this comment. The attorney really blew it by making “dumb students” the butt of his joke and not the teachers failing to educate them.


GeigerCounting

Considering it's the job of the faculty to make sure those kids can read and also the parents in my opinion, the students are not being called dumb. It's the ultimate insult to the people running those schools and the parents for them not being able to read the newspaper.


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Beez-N-geeZ

You put this best and all the idiots beating the "race card" drum in this post are being ignorant of the consequences. This school has wasted every resource given to it. Tuition is 17k a year. Average class size is 16 students (26 public school national average) and they can't even get 5% of the school proficient in math? What the fuck are they doing with all that time and money?!?!?!?!


ThrowawayMePlsTy

Oh so this was all intentionally misleading, what a pos ceo. Shocking. Granted the attorneys response was awful. This is really all just.. awful lol.


SmellGestapo

I don't know if it was intentional but OP's title for this post definitely was misleading. Makes it sound like the black people speaking from the table in this video are the parents, and the attorney from the school is mocking their kids.


tihkalo

I also came into the post believing that the attorney was default in the wrong by the post’s title, that school fucking blows and deserves ridicule, OP should’ve titled it in a way that provided context. Their kids *can’t* read, not in the way that the district should expect them to, their test results are horrifically bad, how can any parent in good conscience send their kid there?


gnoble22

Both. His comment was right that the reading level was severely below average for the state, but the execution of his comment was horrifically wrong.


CoolDolphin29

This comment section is ridiculous. If the majority of the student body is failing then that means school is teaching the students poorly. How anyone can come to any other conclusion is beyond me


Graucus

I see a lot of people jumping to defend kids that don't care enough to educate them. Over 75% of these kids didn't meet the standard for reading and the people responsible are using this insult (aimed at the school but at the expense of the children) to avoid the real problem: their students are failing because they've failed their students. The kids keep paying the price here no matter what and they deserve better.


auzrealop

Which is why shutting down that sham of a school is the right move.


dratspider

Yes and part of the school attorney’s job is to make schools better. How is insulting the students you are failing helping fix the issue.


mommyjacking

If the issue is “keeping money in the pockets of school proprietors,” I can see how he might test the insult strategy.


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Beez-N-geeZ

Seriously!! Thank you!! The insult goes toward the educators. They have class sizes of 16 kids!! That's waaay better than the average nationally. These teachers are not creating effective lesson plans and they are not spending their time productively. The results clearly show that. What's the craziest part is that they seem ignorant to the fact there is a problem at all! That's even worse! Buncha softies with their priorities so unfocused on the children...


Randal-Graves

> How is insulting the students you are failing helping fix the issue. First off how is it insulting to say that students who can't read, can't read. It's an objective statement of fact. Second, maybe if people spent a little more being outraged about the fact that kids can't read and a little less time being outraged by the guy telling you they can't read, we wouldn't have this problem in the first place. Just sayin'.


TurtleBroIsTaken

If it kept going and the kid couldn't read I would have died of laughter that these guys were saying they could.


Oneiroi_zZ

I know, like the video cut out at the best part. The judge should have read the room but man that would be WILD if the kid actually couldn't read it after all that


NareFare

Lol I didn't even consider that


Beez-N-geeZ

Why would the judge "read the room" lol hes not there to appease them or get them to like him or entertain them. What a stupid fucking phrase and goes to the root of this whole problem. That the people in front of the board can't handle the truth, that they are failing in their lesson plans, and they are failing their students. They seem ignorant (intentionally) that there even is an issue. 5% of 7th graders reading at a 7th grade level. Sad. Better education sitting with a truck driver reading billboards all day lol


SpookyTerrence

I’ve seen like a dozen comments refer to him as the judge. It’s the school attorney, he represents the district school board on legal matters.


CarlosFer2201

I'm sure it's not the case, why would the kid volunteer?, but was thinking the same, it would have been hilarious


BrewTheDeck

> why would the kid volunteer? Are we sure he did? Might have been a delusional parent pushing him to do so.


Imprizyn

I was bewildered by how many people could barely read out loud in class by middle school. There were always a couple people who just stumbled over every word. I get it if you haven't seen a word before. That's fair. If you're a young person who hasn't had a lot of experience, some words are strange. I don't judge a 7th grader who reads "vehemently" as "va-hem-ent-lee." I'm just disappointed at how often people would stutter over basic long words. Like, seriously? You're having trouble pronouncing "appointment?"


JonDoeJoe

I would say that some portion of those who would stumble over words were just nervous. When I was in elementary and middle school, I could read out loud just fine but if I was to read in front of the entire class while everyone stared at me, my nerves would mess me up.


TheMountaingmg

how is it racist to say their scores are so low it looks like they cant read.


randdude220

He was just manipulately trying to save his job. Good life tip is never hear what a person says without first thinking why they said it.


TheMountaingmg

regardless that doesn't make it racist


FSBDefector

Fucking lol


Rough_Enthusiasm_351

The big question is; can the students actually read? Not a couple but as an average. Depending on how low the test scores are, he may be accurate. Facts often hurt feelings


pikeymikey22

From a non American but how does that snarky comment have 'racial overtones'? Am I missing something.


villadilla26

I’m just going to start writing “as a non American” whenever I want to ask a controversial question.


ivnwng

“As a non American, why can’t I say N—-“


StonedLikeOnix

Woahhh, that’s a real hard “-“ you’re using there


Preparation_Asleep

"As a non American, how come ya'll wear your dirty ass shoes in the house? That some disgusting shit".


IntrepidSjw

Better than “not to be racist” and then proceeding to say some racist shit anyways.


tpinkfloyd

https://www.schooldigger.com/go/PA/schools/0085407394/school.aspx?t=tbTestScores#aDetail He was literally implying they couldn't read because their English scores across the board are shit.


sneakyveriniki

I’m a white American and spent a while trying to figure out how that was racist until I realized it just wasn’t.


tpinkfloyd

Clearly because you are white and haven't apologized for your whiteness. Not seeing the racism here shows just how racist you truly are. /s


Ill_mumble_that

Yes and that has nothing to do with race. Except that he's white and so they assume racism.. because reasons. But assuming racism because he is white is in itself, racist.


Mr-FranklinBojangles

They called racism to distract from the fact that their school is a scam. "You can't close our shitty school, that's racist!"


remsleepnow

They’re calling him racist so they don’t have to deal with the fact that they aren’t teaching their students.


Kink_Butter

Any action taken by a white person that can be perceived as having a negative impact on a nonwhite person is considered racist, because white people are evil and can never have motivation beyond filthy racist thoughts.


relativitygold

How do test scores have racial overtones?


Graucus

Easily. Imagine your in charge of a school primarily attended by black children. Now imagine you've failed to educate them. Now imagine someone says your kids can't read (as is evidenced by their scores.) You could admit you failed them, or you could make the situation blow up by claiming offense to the percieved racial nature of the comment in hopes of agitating the crowd of parents you've been swindling, maintaining an "us vs them" mentality. I just feel sorry for these kids and hope they get the education everyone should be entitled to in the richest nation on the planet. These "educators" were wasting these kids potential in favor of profits.


ZyxStx

This is the sad truth, while the dude that said they can't read was out of line, the reality is that the school has been failing their students for a while already and should do better and strive to improve instead of just barely doing enough to not close it and dent the problem. Sadly I doubt they care. That being said it's not necessarily easy to do, not that that's an excuse.


looksee-me

Ok, so I get that the specific comment “can’t read newspaper” or whatever, was snarky and crass.. but out of line.. ..I don’t think so. It was a truth that had been evidenced and the parents need to see the school for what it is. He probably should have just laid out the fact that it was a trend over a number of years, which would have negated the CEO’s argument about the news impacting the students test conditions/scores.


Additional_Irony

Tell you what, that lawyer can't read - read the fucking room that is.


cgmcnama

Yeah, but he isn't wrong. If all the kids are failing and they blame stress from the failing school closing...there are bigger issues.


mkat5

I think the end all be all is that the school has utterly failed the students and the parents recognize that.


intensely_human

If the parents recognized that, they’d be more upset with the guy running the school and wouldn’t let him manipulate their emotions with fiery anti-“racist” rants. According to the reaction in the room, these parents are lockstep behind the guy who’s ruining their kids’ opportunity.


GreatSuprise69

“racial overtones” did he just say that the reason why their students can’t read is because he’s black?


yokeldotblog

Look up the schools test scores, as they are public information. In the 8th grade in this school they had 100% of the students deficient in math and reading comprehension, so the lawyer wasn’t exactly wrong.


000Murbella000

So he called them illiterate according to their scores and they guy understood it as racism? How?


Prestigious-Ad-1113

That charter school guy is 100% a snake in the grass kind of character. The man is speaking on behalf of the school these parents are sending their kids to and he’s arguing that that the school shouldn’t be closed because seeing that it’s closing is gonna hurt their education. No actual arguments for how he’d change things, no accountability for the absolutely disgraceful test scores his students are getting, and immediately plays the race card when confronted with a (admittedly less than classy) retort. Saying that making disparaging comments about students is totally removed from racist undertones would be ignorant but I think it’s obvious that isn’t the case here. From the scores these kids are giving it could be argued these kids would be better off at home then at that school and yet the charter school gentleman is being incredibly slick with painting the school itself as the victim.


SMLAZARUS

Excuses for mediocrity


-churbs

This dude talking about low blows while using a child and race as a weapon. Their scores were already ABYSMAL before the shutdown was announced.


beethy

Here's a follow-up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fadgc2HZOAs


JonDoeJoe

I want to see the video of whether the kid can read or not


slightlyforthwith

Those teachers have no shame making the excuses they’re making.


SchrodingerCattz

It requires at minimum a grade 9 reading proficiency/education to read and understand conservative print media papers like the New York Post or the National Post (Canada). If a test says your kid can't read or write at their proficiency level for their age, they can't read or understand a basic news paper. Do justice for your own kids. Teach them to read.


asdf0909

The comment was definitely inappropriate. But also, not every negative accusation is racist. If you associate that comment with race, and therefore you recognize people of your race are struggling, your solution is to make sure nobody addresses what theyre struggling with?


Tandian

That was harsh. Funny though


AyakaUwU

How does it have racial overtones? wtf lol.


GreatSuprise69

it doesn’t, the guy didn’t know what to say after the roast lol


HeWhoMustNotBDpicted

"Your children can't read." "That's RACIST." Classic.


Ranblitz17

The low blow was using the race card. Smh 🤦🏽‍♂️


Wasting_muh_life

The parents should be mad at the teachers, not the man telling them the truth. I know if my child was significantly behind average, I would hire a tutor, but; if my child and their entire school was significantly behind average, I'd be hiring a solicitor and suing the education board for wasting my child's time and flagrantly setting them up to fail in life. Fuck me; this is an insane reaction from the parents. A child's brain is only able to truly develop for a few years, and those teachers just pissed away crucial time that can NEVER, be recovered.


Stang1776

They also need to look in the mirror


paranormalfigure

Except that if you were an attentive parent you'd have known pretty early on that your kid can't read and should have taken action then. Relying on the school to raise your kid and one day finding out almost nobody at the school can read and now you want to be mad at the school, speaks volumes about you as a parent.


jayrock5150

How was that racist? Low test scores that show the kids can’t read. Simple not racist y’all need help not everything is damn racist


JPM_55

A very low, blow with racial overtones? Wtf does race have to do with it? If test scores are low it wouldn't matter what race the students are! It just shows that the teachers aren't reaching their students in an active, entertaining way for them to retain the information taught and then applied come test time! I once had an English teacher who was in her last years before retirement and she would teach by telling us to open book to chapter 1, read it in silence and write an essay on what you learned. The class was boring, miserable and ultimately most people in the class suffered for it. Teachers complain about low pay nonstop how about create a fun and worthwhile learning experience and maybe the school boards will take notice and try to facilitate your needs based on your students academic success! All I'm saying is maybe it's not always the students but the lousy teachers who are to blame.


TheSomnambulist

Masstagger is doing extra work tagging all the conspiracy and the_donald users in this thread, they don't value truth or tact. Don't let them virtue signal to you.