T O P

It’s almost as if the Church of Satan read the Bible

It’s almost as if the Church of Satan read the Bible

brmoss1019

Pro Tip: If you’re a registered member of the (edit) Satanic Temple, you can fight it if denied your choice to have an abortion, as you can claim a religious exemption. “By my body, my blood. By my will, it is done.”


Confident_Bridge9811

that's actually the satanic temple i think, they are who are actually suing


brmoss1019

You’re 100% correct. I flip flopped them, my bad!


Confident_Bridge9811

it is a church of Satan posts, so not really surprising :)


ExIsTeNtIaL_ShIt

If I was forced to chose a religion the Church of Satan would be the one... Or the spaghetti with meatballs one. Hard to choose


overbossc

Ah yes, the church of the flying spaghetti monster. pastafarianism is the way, get your colander ready


Confident_Bridge9811

go with satanic temple


Condor-Avenue

Go with the Santanic Temple instead. the Church of Satan is not great. CoS thinks preferring blue cheese dressing over thousand island makes a dude gay, among other things.


caffmaster

You serious about that? TIL I'm gay. Blue cheese is the best dressing. Best fry dip too


AdiosAdipose

That’s ridiculous, people should never be persecuted based on their sexuality. Meanwhile mold eaters should definitely not be allowed to marry.


RacoonHannah

Both dressings are shit. Catalina is the wae.


duderex88

Heretic


TheDechen

There's also a Church of Cannabis in Denver, Colorado...


DavidRandom

And if you'd like to donate to their legal funds [Here's the link](https://thesatanictemple.com/pages/rrr-fundraiser)


one_who_asks

Sounds to me like they read the constitution, and understood it.


ReubenZWeiner

Ironically.... https://www.kut.org/politics/2021-02-19/the-satanic-temple-sues-texas-over-abortion-regulations-it-argues-infringe-on-members-religious-beliefs


one_who_asks

Nothing Ironic. They read the constitution, and used the power of their religious freedoms to make it unconstitutional to their religion. As a newer religion they have the flexibility to make rituals on the fly, and fight laws they see as unjust. Older religions can't do this as easily since all their rituals are mostly set in stone.


needlenozened

Except that the Church of Satan and The Satanic Temple are not the same thing, so this is two different organizations.


one_who_asks

They are both really similar though with their approach to legislative challenges, so you can see how I got them confused.


Litotes

It’s worth noting for clarification that this is a different group, The Satanic Temple, than the one in OP’s post.


jomiran

To clarify The Satanic Temple (of which I'm a member) DOES NOT BELIEVE IN THE SUPERNATURAL. The Church of Satan actually worships the devil.


iamcorvin

> The Church of Satan actually worships the devil. You're wrong there. The Church of Satan has always been an atheist organization, unlike the temple who started with belief in an actual devil. Sources: https://www.churchofsatan.com/faq-fundamental-beliefs/ https://web.archive.org/web/20130904012107/http://www.thesatanictemple.com/


jomiran

> The Church of Satan has always been an atheist organization Cool beans. I stand corrected. >...the temple who started with belief in an actual devil... Not really. The mission was to be declared an official religious institution so that they could fight for the separation of church and state. It took a little groping around before the technicalities were ironed out. The Satanic Temple has never worshiped a supernatural deity. Instead, they worship what Satan represents. >To embrace the name “Satan” is to avow skepticism in the face of all things, even — especially — that which is held sacred. To stand forth as a “Satanist” is to rend from the persecutory, affrighted mob a convenient out-group label, demanding that individuals be judged for their concrete actions, not their fealty to arbitrary social norms and illusory categorizations.


RHack

While they do believe in magic in some form or another, I'm pretty sure the Church of Satan doesn't worship Satan as a literal figure either.


acer5886

I've said this before, I'll repeat it here. The constitution doesn't ban an individual from using anything as their reason for any legislation. It bans specific legislation from occurring, but it does not in any way shape or form ban any individual from It's a dangerous precedent to say you can't use x belief because it comes from your belief system. Whether that's Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism, Atheism, Philosophy, and so on. Doing so actually violates the first clause of the first amendment, that we should all have the freedom of speech.


Civil_Defense

Except the two are mutually exclusive. You can't have a separation of church and state at the same time as making laws based off of religious doctrine, because not everyone has the same religion and the entire point of having a separation of church and state is to ensure that *all* citizens are served by the government.


SlayLidel

That’s not what the Church of Satan is saying though. A laws existence should not be because it is part of a religion, but because it is good. Arguing for or against a law by wether or not a religious text is okay with it is not the conversation people should be having, but rather wether or not it is good and constitutional.


Minister_for_Magic

>The constitution doesn't ban an individual from using anything as their reason for any legislation. It bans specific legislation from occurring, but it does not in any way shape or form ban any individual from If you are using religious "law" to justify institutional laws, you are **de facto** enforcing religious laws upon others and restricting their freedom of religion. ​ >It's a dangerous precedent to say you can't use x belief because it comes from your belief system. I'd argue the exact opposite. Using an unassailable belief in an unprovable (or imaginary, depending on how charitable you feel) deity as basis for a law in a democracy is fundamentally no different from a theocracy. A democracy in a diverse country **cannot stand** if laws are passed on the basis of religious law. There can be no debate, no compromise, on such issues and they are only a path toward fundamentalism and radicalization. Any disagreement on such religion-inspired laws is seen as a personal attack on the religion of those who support the laws even as they restrict the freedoms of others.


luxdesigns

I'm reposting my reply because their automod bot is re-...stupid. (I used the word 'fuckt*rd'. gah.) Freedom of speech is one thing. Separation of church and state is another. I feel like you are incredibly confused here. The government isn't allowed to elevate any one religion or religious belief to the forefront, above all others. You had better get this straight: If a court is weighing the constitutionality of a law, and it finds that the legislative body which passed that law used a religious text or belief to argue for that law, that court is going to lean a lot more towards finding that law unconstitutional than it might otherwise. You are ignoring that our representatives in government are part of the government. They do not, as representatives of the government, have free speech rights. The 1st amendment dictates to the government, not to the citizenry, what must NOT be done. So if some idiot Republican legislator wants to argue from the floor of their legislative chamber that their deity is why something should be made law then that [censored] is 100% being un-American as fuck. TSC's argument here, by the way, is that its members believe they should be able to have an abortion as a part of their religion. And Texas sure as shit shouldn't fuck with their religious liberty.


hickgorilla

You mean it’s almost like the Church of Satan read the constitution.


Actual-Scarcity

Yeah this title was written by someone throwing around buzz words. The bible definitely doesn't have a section condoning secular government. The US constitution definitely does. Edit: oof, looks like OP has been defending justice Kavanagh against his sexual assault allegations


TheHalfbadger

> bible definitely doesn't have a section condoning secular government Matthew 22:21


Actual-Scarcity

This is a stretch. If you read the wikipedia entry for the verse, very few consider this to be condoning secular government; rather, it seems to be separating the *church* from government yoke, which is a separate issue theologically.


TheHalfbadger

It's not a stretch. It's a valid (if not necessarily popular) interpretation of the passage. Both oxen fastened to a yoke can pull against the other.


Actual-Scarcity

The passage is in line with the first and second commandments: it tells Christians how they should treat the state (i.e. you should not worship the state), *not* how people in power are to administer a state. That's why I think it's a stretch.


luxdesigns

It's a total stretch when you read the rest of the New Testament. Christ, the King, in favor of a secular government? Are you mad? Take it out of context and you can do what you want with it. What's being said, quite clearly, is to stop bothering Jesus with that shit because he isn't there to talk tax policy.


[deleted]

Well ya see.. that's where you fucked up. You are actually reading more of the bible to get the context instead of picking and choosing to fit your narrative.


Actual-Scarcity

This is the right take imo


HostOrganism

The Roman government wasn't secular. There were no secular governments at the time. How could the bible condone something that didn't exist when it was written?


Banethoth

OP is a teenager. Prob trying to be edgy Edit: but what the post above says is true. The US is NOT a theocracy, no matter how much idiot christians want it to be


Actual-Scarcity

Agreed


DrMobius0

Also doesn't matter if you read the bible anyway because as the tweet points out, whatever the bible says has no relevance to policy decisions.


Dcajunpimp

The Bible tells me that pork is unclean and shouldn't be eaten or even touched, and that Jesus first miracle was to turn water into wine. Yet there's towns and counties where Christians will fight to ban the sale of alcohol but ignore all the pork products being sold.


JimDixon

I know a guy who turned grape juice into wine. That's a much better trick because he can keep repeating it over and over!


black_anarchy

I am going to need a source on this bro... you know for science... ​ (damn it, I just got a reminder that we are talking about religion and miracles here...)


SageHunter

Making your own wine is actually fairly easy, though make sure you dedicate a space for it away from were you spend most time as it can be a bit of a smelly process


bozeke

Jesus also turned blood into wine, though. Dude was, like, seriously into wine.


PaleontologistFar975

when i was being raised catholic you are taught that the wine and wafer you eat at communion are literally (yes literally) transfigured into the flesh and blood of christ... always seemed like a smack in the face to they guy bleeding out on the public roman torture device displayed at he front of the church...


deflation_

One quick taste of the bread made me a non believer. My family isn't religious but my school was. When they tried to sell me on the idea my 6 year old brain thought "ew". Then I tried the bread and was like "wtf this ain't no flesh, you crazy"


LMeire

He had really bad dandruff.


mcg42ray

The Bible also says that all those rules in Leviticus are for the Levites.


jeansplice

Also has an almost ikea like guide on how to sell your daughter to slavery


bannana

> slavery the bible is a pretty specific manual throughout on how to buy, sell, and treat slaves


black_anarchy

It is mind blowing that this is on the Bible, Leviticus 25:44-46: >44 “‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly. And most Jewish/Chirstian act like it doesn't concern them. There is another passage that goes like this: >And if a man sells his daughter to be a female slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do. If she does not please her master, who has betrothed her to himself, then he shall let her be redeemed. (yes... yes... they are worse atrocities in the Bible, e.g: genocides... [Hoseas 13:16](https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/Hosea/13/16), but this one always strikes me the most)


Cryogenic_Monster

Religion is a prison for the seekers of wisdom.


hoopopotamus

Personally I’m going to drink a bunch of wine and get really fuckin wise


[deleted]

> drink a bunch of wine and get really fuckin wise Of course you do. In vino veritas.


ItalianDudee

May be peace upon you, religion if interpreted too strictly in general is a disease


echisholm

A closed mind is an impregnable fortress against heresy.


BigBoodles

Blessed is the mind too small for doubt.


BigHarryMC

There’s a 40k reference in there somewhere


Maktaka

"An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and ungaurded" is a line from Dawn of War's Librarian. Mind you, this is a universe where a lone guardsman, under whispered guidance from demons of Chaos, opens up a portal that unleashes a demonic invasion and the complete annihilation of an entire solar system. Entire regiments of guardsmen will be executed to the last man after *winning* a battle against chaos demons to ensure any trace of demonic influence is purged.


Tyrannosaurus___Rekt

Bullshit. Show me a christian and I'll show you a man who never sought shit, but rather crumbled to the first, and easiest social pressure to resist. These are NOT wisdom seekers. Those people walk right by that shit.


Conky2Thousand

It has value if you can separate literal fact from your spirituality. The final state of Christianity, as the Bible put it if you actually read carefully, was basically putting all those old laws on the back burner, saying “who am I to judge, just love each other, do your best and don’t be a jerk,” but people seem to have missed the memo for the last 2000 years or so.


RudegarWithFunnyHat

Shellfish are banned too and whales are fish, but of the sins sex stuff seem to be frowned upon a lot more then the others sins which Christians seems to largely ignore.


bunker_man

I mean, calling whales fish isn't inaccurate by premodern standards. Because fish wasn't a specific biological category but a hazy term for "water thing that swims." Its modern day where the terms were narrowed into specific biological categories.


powderizedbookworm

I mean, “fish” is such a massive clade that it’s barely any more specific now.


xDared

Surprisingly, their rules say you can eat fish but not whales. > Leviticus 11 >'There are some that only chew the cud or only have a split hoof, but you must not eat them. The camel, though it chews the cud, does not have a split hoof; it is ceremonially unclean for you. 5 The coney, [1] though it chews the cud, does not have a split hoof; it is unclean for you. 6 The rabbit, though it chews the cud, does not have a split hoof; it is unclean for you. 7 And the pig, though it has a split hoof completely divided, does not chew the cud; it is unclean for you. 8 You must not eat their meat or touch their carcasses; they are unclean for you. 9 **"`Of all the creatures living in the water of the seas and the streams, you may eat any that have fins and scales.** 10 But all creatures in the seas or streams that do not have fins and scales--whether among all the swarming things or among all the other living creatures in the water--you are to detest. 11 And since you are to detest them, you must not eat their meat and you must detest their carcasses. 12 Anything living in the water that does not have fins and scales is to be detestable to you.


matchosan

damn you science


bannana

> Shellfish are banned not a bad idea back then considering every now and again someone would just keel over dead after eating it and sometimes everybody would get dead because it was the wrong time of year to eat that one kind


dustinechos

All holy books can be used to justify whatever you already wanted to believe. During the lead up to the civil war there was a bible verse that both sides used to argue in favor of and against slavery. Holy books are just horoscopes at this point. Measure of a person isn't which holy book they read, it's what they are doing with their life. Shit, I just realized my holy book is "Last and First Men" (hell ya, good job me, wait I just said that doesn't matter) and what I'm doing with my life is way too much reddit. Womp womp!


FirstStranger

If you want, I can provide the Biblical verses that condone pork eating and condemn alcohol, for informational purposes. But I understand what you’re saying. Modern Christians are full of hypocrisy and not for the good reasons. It hurts to see Christians act so un-Christlike


NoProblemsHere

Now I'm curious. What are the good reasons to be a hypocrite?


Squirrel_Whisperer

You get to feel superior


FirstStranger

The good reasons would be in efforts to turn their lives around. I’ve met gang members and extremists attending churches, people who swore to causes that violently contradict the Bible, thus making them hypocrites. But they’re trying to change their past, find a sort of redemption for their past lives. Modern Christian hypocrites just use the Bible as justification to do whatever they want. Nothing can’t not be forgiven by God, so do whatever you want and repent later. That type of thinking makes me sick.


jim653

> I’ve met gang members and extremists attending churches, people who swore to causes that violently contradict the Bible They'd be hypocrites only if they attended church while still holding to their former causes. Changing your mind about something doesn't make you a hypocrite (unless you simultaneously claim you don't believe in changing your mind).


FirstStranger

It’s not an instantaneous process, you know. There’s been times they’re forced to go, or just bored, or skeptic. Attending church doesn’t automatically make a person Christian


ArgentiEtAuri

Lip service to fit into society while doing the right thing. Let's say, someone pretending to not oppose slavery, while actively freeing slaves.


WangnanJahad

I mean, we've already provided the verses that describe, in detail, how to perform an abortion. It's not about religion. It's about control.


N3UR0_

wait what, I need to see this shit


cajuncrustacean

Numbers 5:11-31 The TL;DR version is that if a husband believes his wife might have cheated on him he's supposed to take her to the local priest. The priest gives her a "bitter potion" that aborts a pregnancy. So essentially it condones abortion as a test for adultery. That's not even getting into the verses where yhwh commands his followers to rip the unborn from their mother's wombs. Or the multiple genocides that included pregnant women. Incidentally, it isn't any better for the ones who *are* born because "Blessed shall he be who takes your little ones and dashes them against the rock" just to start.


operez1990

A Right Wing Christians’ bible is full of redactions of anything that doesn’t suit their interests.


CommanderOnDeck

I’ve got this one. Apparently in the old days wine was the cleanest thing to drink


tinnitatoatu

Is this the 80's actor Kirk Cameron?


dogecoin_to_pluto

Oh! Thqt was in the gospel reading last week. Basically the pharaciees were bitching that Jesus ans his apostles weren't getting ritualistucally clean before eating. Jesus turned his head and said, "da fuck you saying? Nothing we put in ourselves will make us unclean, its your bitch ass actions and thoughts and words that make you sin"


x3meech

To be fair in the New Testament it says you wont be judged on what you eat or drink or where or when you choose to worship. I also gotta say that as a Christian, those type of Christians are not acting the way they should be. They're too closed minded and quite frankly a bit brain washed by inaccurate interpretation of the bible. And I also gotta say that I couldn't agree more with the satanic temple. Our government is supposed to be separate from the church. It's literally the reason people started coming here.


caleb_g22

Fun fact: there is a mushroom that when grounded into fine powder has the ability to give wine-like properties to water. Common theory is that Jesus utilized this mushroom to pull off said miracle.


AlmostGeorgeIV

The Bible also says that if a woman is raped she should be stoned to death. If the rapist impregnates the woman the Bible is condoning abortion. Oh and can't forget that the rapist has to pay her father 40 silver. Gotta make sure he learns his lesson!


hambakmeritru

As a follower of Christ who has become disgusted by Christiandom, it is weird and a little frightening how much I constantly agree with the Church of Satan's Twitter feed.


SupremestLeader

Most Satanist groups tend to not be actual Satan-worshipers. They're usually Atheists that use Satanism as a way to get get attention to their cause (generally, they believe in the seperation of church and state, environmentalism, secularism, etc.) and as a way to piss-off Christian fundamentalists. Even 'actual' Satanists tend to be pretty cool people, based on my experience. They're generally quite tolerant.


hambakmeritru

I've only met one self-labeled satanist, who was going through this massive teen angst thing... In his mid 20s... He just wanted to hate everything and rebel against everything and insisted that black metal was the only valid form of metal music and when I asked him if his parents were ultra-consetvative Evengelical christians by any chance, he stopped talking to me. I might have hit a nerve. But I used to work with a bunch of blackmetal heads that were always trying to see how much they could do or say before it offended me. I don't know if they were really satanists, but they liked to use satanic language and music to try to push my buttons. They were actually a lot of fun. I liked those guys. And they actually stood up for me when it really mattered.


beeinabearcostume

I’m a self labeled Satanist, but I do not believe in Satan as an actual devil dude sitting on a chair. It’s more of the concept of questioning authority, rebelling against oppression, and not doing scary horrible things in blind faith. EDIT: As far as organizations go, I align with The Satanic Temple, not as much the Church of Satan. TST are doing some pretty awesome things, especially now with Texas and reproductive rights.


hambakmeritru

You know what's interesting: that image of Satan is nowhere in the Bible. The name "Satan" just means "accuser" and is used at various points in the Bible to refer to various people/characters including both Peter and Jesus at different points. The image of Satan that usually gets shown in christianesk images is actually a weird hybrid of Hades and a cobbled together idea of a vague antagonist from various New Testament references. Question, though, as a self-labeled satanist, what is your relation/thoughts on demon worshippers? I've actually known one or two of those. They never referred to themselves as satanists, so I don't know if they should be grouped together. One of them was a guy that was like a brother to me, but in that phase of his life, he was downright scary. Carved a pentagram in his arm with a knife. Did dark, self-mutilating shit. Now I think he considers himself a pagan or druid or something. I don't know. He has gone through a lot of interesting spiritual changes. Seems much healthier now. Just lives off the grid with his common law wife and likes to grow mushrooms in the woods.


beeinabearcostume

I try not to pass judgement on those people. I do often find that route in a good amount of people’s lives to be somewhat short lived. Whether it is because rituals tend to not be so pleasant, or if it is because they originally hope that a demon would strike a bargain with them and grant them their wishes more readily than other religious deities, only to discover that their prayers and hopes in the end remain unanswered, unfulfilled, or not what they had meant in the first place. But, if I’m being perfectly honest, I don’t think I’ll ever understand Ted Cruz supporters.


hambakmeritru

>But, if I’m being perfectly honest, I don’t think I’ll ever understand Ted Cruz supporters. 🤣🤣


solasgood

Satan is actually the "Adversary", not "accuser".


hambakmeritru

Adversary! That's the other word I was looking for! I kept wanting to say nemesis, but that is too negative of a term. From my understanding, it means both. But I'd have to go get my brother's Strong's Concordence to know for sure and right now his house in on lockdown because they're all sick with some awful flu that isn't COVID, thank goodness.


TheEasySqueezy

Satan and hell is something that’s always confused me about Christianity, and I’m fascinated that Satan actually doesn’t even appear in the bible, before I read your comment I just thought he was the main antagonist of the bible so to speak. I’ve never really read the bible I went to a fairly zealous religious school, they weren’t ridiculously zealous but they used to make you write passages of the bible 50 times as a punishment and one time I had to do that after saying “I’m an atheist” which is all kinds of messed up, so as a result I’ve tried to avoid all kinds of religion really but anyway, what’s always confused me about Christianity is that Satan is used as a threat to people who don’t follow the teachings of the bible or do something that is against god, and we’re told that if you do these things you’ll go to hell and Satan will torture you for eternity but if Satan punishes people for being “bad” doesn’t that mean he’s helping God in a way? Punishing those who don’t follow Christianity? I know a small amount about the grounds of Christianity and I know that Satan was an angel who rebelled against god I think? And was then cast from heaven into hell, so you’d think he’d be a bit more welcoming of those who go against god, so is this just what Christians have adopted as a way to get kids to behave or does the fact Satan tortures sinners have a deeper meaning? Sorry if this sounds trivial but the way you’ve worded your last comments really resonated with me and I do actually enjoy discussing religion with people who are chill about it!


hambakmeritru

>I’m fascinated that Satan actually doesn’t even appear in the bible Well he does... Sort of... But not the way that most people think of him. And mostly in different, weird ways that are probably (and at times, definitely) not the same person/character. The most famous time that "satan" shows up (small s) is in Job. But Job is a strange book, and probably the most ancient written book of the Bible and the satan in there doesn't line up with... Anything. Most Christians that insist on taking the Bible as literal, historical truth are just baffled by the satan in Job and those who don't take the Bible literally will probably tell you that Job was written as a myth that tries to explain why bad things happen to good people. Just read the first like 2 paragraphs of the book of Job and you'll instantly see what I mean. Every single sentence makes you say, "wtf??" While you try to figure out who/what satan is. And then just for the hell of it, jump over to the middle of Daniel where the messenger angle, Gabriel, gets attacked by Satan while trying to deliver a message and ends up fighting him for so long that Arch Angel, Michael, has to come bale him out. Those two characters are definitely not the same and are definitely not what we think of when we picture Pitch Fork Satan. >but if Satan punishes people for being “bad” doesn’t that mean he’s helping God in a way? Punishing those who don’t follow Christianity? This is very much where the idea of Satan (big S) got twisted up with Hades. It is in no way Biblical. At all. >I know that Satan was an angel who rebelled against god I think? That idea comes from Isaiah, I think, but to get to that conclusion, you have to make some interesting jumps in logic, because that passage is actually talking about a human king and describing him as a fallen angel in a very poetic sort of way. Some modern Christians somewhere got it in their heads that that was referring to Satan, but that interpretation was definitely not how anyone in Isaiah's time, Jesus's time, or the early church would have understood that text. Satan didn't exist in those religious traditions. >so is this just what Christians have adopted as a way to get kids to behave or does the fact Satan tortures sinners have a deeper meaning? I haven't looked into the full history of the development of Satan's character in the church history, but like I said, this idea of him is not Biblical at all and the language used in the Bible for Satan is really confusing. For instance, most people think that his other name is Lucifer. But Lucifer means "morning star" and is used to refer to that fallen king in Isaiah (I think it's Isaiah) and also Jesus in the book of Revelation. Hahaha... I'm sure that can't cause any problems in understanding!


TheEasySqueezy

Wow thank you so so much for typing that out in such detail, this is genuinely fascinating, it’s the sort of thing my granddad would have been interested in because he always tried to, for lack of a better word “debunk” religion while maintaining a healthy agnostic view point, probably figured if he played both sides he’d always come out on top. He spent a lot of time (and money) trying to understand all the origins of religion, and he got quite involved in it, even went as far as to write a book about it I’m not sure what it entails because I’ve never read it, and I don’t think he managed to finish it before he passed away, this actually makes me want to visit his office actually and try and make sense of his book


Trulex900

The image of Satan from the book of revelation (or Lucifer later since they are hmm the same entity in different periods) is the one who got cursed for eternity for asking questions and rebelling against a pretty tyrannical example of authority. The omniscient, omnibenevolent, omnipotent God (triple contradiction) intentionally created beings with the capacity for critical thought, like Satan, but actually using that capacity in the bible results in eternal damnation. Its one of many biblical damned if you do, damned if you dont situations. Imo its pure sadism. The outcome is obvious from the start, especially to a supposedly omniscient perfect being. The point of such situations in the Bible is to teach unquestioning obedience to authority to the reader and instill fear of what is essentially a divine tyrant. Love/loyalty testing and damned if you do,damned if you dont are abusive tactics tbw. Everything about the Biblical Satan from the old testament screams progressive dude high on critical thinking and authority skepticism, whose intelligence and lack of blind obedience rubbed the divine narcissist the wrong way. The image of satan and lucifer (in luciferianism) as questioning authority, being the voice of reason and liberation did not come from nowhere. Lucifer comes from the latin _lux_ = light and _ferre_ = to bring , meaning _bringer of light_ Anyways, sorry if this was harsh an analysis but this is my POV, ive studied the psychology of abrahamic religion and saw omnipresent parallels between abuse in abusive relationships (TheraminTrees helped elucidate it better), and the biblical God character, so I thought id share my POV. Its my view that the abusive and insecure, violent qualities of the men whose mind's creation was the Abrahamic God mirror themselves in the God character.


rhodysailor

I was going to come here and comment on this. Along the way culture had really changed the Bible and our cultural ideas around religion had shifted. IT wasn't until recently that we came up with the concept of heaven and hell and a devil etc.


omegapenta

Ah a rage against the machine fan.


FinancialTea4

It's worth noting that the character Satan is a Christian concept so really the o my people who are truly Satanic are heretical Christians. Now, I understand that there are other beliefs that are centered around ideas of Satan that aren't rooted in the biblical Satan but that's not generally what we're talking about in the US. When most westerners mention the name Satan they are talking about the Bible.


hambakmeritru

>people who are truly Satanic are heretical Christians So true. And this is how I feel about the American Evengelical church right now. They're more anti-Christ than the anti-Christ of Revelation.


N3UR0_

"Love thy neighbor unless they are gay, black, want an abortion, are a democrat"


Freakazoid152

They were not Satanists, those people are chill and want everyone's lives to be better


ItsFrenzius

I’ve seen a lot of the good deeds the Satanist groups do. Fundraisers for those in need, fixing up stuff the government decided to neglect. Kinda wholesome


skjellyfetti

[This is always educational](https://i.imgur.com/oozHuFp.png)


GonzoVeritas

> Even 'actual' Satanists tend to be pretty cool people, based on my experience. They're generally quite tolerant. Their [Seven Fundamental Tenets](https://i.imgur.com/YFaryRu.jpg) are very rational. And, as you said, quite tolerant indeed.


bunker_man

That's from tst. They are only a few years old and aren't really what "satanism" exists to convey.


lorcanhyena

Im sure the church of satan follows lahavey(???) satanism which focuses on the individual and making yourself as a perfect person by following in satans/lucifers ideals. They actively have rules which state children are innocent and should never be harmed as well as forbidding abuse of any kind against animals.


SupremestLeader

When I said 'actual Satanism' I more meant; 'classic Satanism'. The kind you see in movies with a pit of fire in a cave and what not. But what I said isn't necessarily incorrect. It's just incorrect in regards to the Church of Satan.


lorcanhyena

Oh my mistake dude


ResonanceSD

LaVey


Dmon24

I wrote a 10 page essay for one of my criminology classes on satanism and they are definitely very misunderstood, but in some way done on purpose because that's how they roll.


ItsFrenzius

As someone who recently gave up on the Christian religion, you’re not alone bud


hambakmeritru

Have up on it because the people are terrible? Or have up on it because you no longer believe in Jesus? Just curious. If it's because of the people, I am very, very, terribly sorry.


artemasad

Not OP but I gave up mine because my church friend reminded me that if both of my parents don't convert to Christian, then they're both going to hell. That was the defining moment when I realized how dumb the whole thing is.


hambakmeritru

Yeah. I get that. There are actually a lot of Christians that don't believe in Hell at all. The Bible is actually pretty vague and confusing in that topic, and many Christians, believe that if God is really good, then he wouldn't eternally punish people just for not knowing him. Edit: bad typo that turned my meaning inside out


ItsFrenzius

Both really. I know there are good Christians out there like my family, but the amount of Christians who are also good people were too few and too far between. As for no longer believing in Jesus I simply started to believe more in factual evidence rather than just taking things word of mouth and simply believing it happened without much evidence. Not to mention that from what I saw, it was basically making people to worship a god out a fear of damnation in the afterlife if you don’t.


_duncan_idaho_

Just like the previous commenter, I too gave that life up relatively recently. Mostly because the people, but also I just stopped giving a shit if there is a god or not. It doesn't matter if Jesus was some savior or not. I straight up don't care about that anymore.


[deleted]

They don't actually believe in satan. The whole point of the name is sort of to say, "if you are going to have religion in politics, you have to have the church of Satan too".


lorcanhyena

I find its because some take the words waaaayy to literally and dont make sense of the fact that the context is from 2000 years ago. Its fine for a base for society but we grow and change over time. Today is significantly different from 100 years ago so how is it that people often dont consider that when comparing modern day with a book thats pretty much ancient.


hambakmeritru

I completely agree with you and would add a lot of other layers of what's going wrong with the church. It's becoming increasingly clear, especially in the last 2 years, that Evengelical Christiandom is not about following Christ, but about maintaining power systems and it's sick. It's actually extremely anti-Christ, since Jesus was, himself, a homeless rebel that was killed for speaking out against both religious and political power systems.


lorcanhyena

I have a feeling if jesus himself did exist in modern time and he couldnt use his godlike abilities the very people who worship him would hate and demean him. If youd treat those who you worship as higher than the others like him then youve lost all sense of religion you have. If people where about following god and jesus and acted like him the world would be such a better place. Even with gays and outlaws he saw them just as worthy as anyone else. And those that follow that i heavily respect but anyone who hides behind a bible as they use it as a weapon is pathetic and shouldnt be considered religious.


hambakmeritru

Amen. >I have a feeling if jesus himself did exist in modern time and he couldnt use his godlike abilities the very people who worship him would hate and demean him. It makes even more sense when you realize that Jesus's enemies back in his day were the religious leaders of his own religion. They were the ones that hated him because he called them out ok their shit. And they were the ones that paid to have him killed. And that was while he was performing miracles. The people he hung out with and befriended were the "detestables." He hung out with whores, tax collector's, outcasts, crippled, sick, etc.


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KaizokuShojo

It's amazing, these people will bleat about being patriots but have little to no knowledge of the Constitution or US history. They'll raise a big fuss about caring for kids but they'll be surrounded by pedos and won't help fund children's needs. They'll say their conservative but will be anti-environmentalist, okay with gigantic tax cuts, pork barrel budgets, and gut spending, all in ways that don't conserve anything or match up to historical spending habits. They'll claim doctors as heroes and then take "alternative"/animal medicine. They'll deride others for not speaking English but then their own skills with the language are totally lacking. They'll rage about immigrants but couldn't themselves pass a citizenship test. They'll flounce about as "Christians" but will live and preach the utter opposite of what Christ taught. I've just come to the point, personally, where I'll do my duty and love them as best I can... But I won't be surprised when they have a knife ready to stab someone in the back.


Pucker_Factor_10

*They'll rage about immigrants but be Cuban born. (I'm looking at you, Rafael Cruz.)


-xstatic-

They’re bullshitting frauds faking their way through their pointless life


greevous00

It's worth mentioning that in many cases the folks you're referring to are effectively abuse victims. They were indoctrinated into a faith as a child, without the ability to make an adult value judgement about it, and thus they defend it despite the fact that there are many situations where the cognitive dissonance must be intense. As children many of them were taught that it is *very* wrong to question these places where there are conflicting ideas in their faith, and so they get agitated when someone does this. Their *identity* is tied up in this worldview, and to point out obvious conflicts in it is doing nothing short of attacking their identity (or so they believe). That's the nature of the abuse really. Even if children were raised in these faiths without the ability to make an adult value judgement about them, if they were simply allowed to question things, and ponder about what right and wrong might look like when there are conflicting ideals and goals (what more moderate manifestations of Christianity do and encourage), it really wouldn't be abuse per se, but the fact that as children they're often taught that it's essentially blasphemous to have doubt or to recognize a conflict in Scripture, changes the essential nature of the faith itself. It becomes less of a worldview / direction, and more of a straight jacket... and they're usually not even aware that they've put it on themselves.


Piper_Dear

I've been a Christian my entire life, but these past 18 months have changed my viewpoint on organized religion. Mainly because those who scream about their religion the loudest directly go against who Jesus was and what he taught. It's hypocrisy.


glitterlok

Which of “Christ’s teachings” do you follow, and do you think the Jesus character in the Bible is the source of those ideas?


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mcg42ray

People who know the Bible also know that these pseudo-christian sects neither care nor know what Jesus actually taught.


hambakmeritru

>pseudo-christian sects Cults. I think we need to start calling them cults.


_SteveD_

American Christians will be the ones who crucify the returning Christ.


-jp-

I distinguish between the philosophical and metaphysical parts of Christianity. Christ's teachings are quite wise in terms of just being a decent human being. Anyone who follows those is a Christian in my book, regardless of whether they believe He's the literal son of God. It's the guys who use His divinity to justify whatever abhorrent behavior that they engage in who I find distasteful. Those guys outright aren't Christians. They don't believe in His word. Had Jesus never lived they'd just use some other excuse to be horrid people instead.


Relative_Count6087

I'm a Catholic and I know some Lucifereans, they're doing good works and don't hate anybody and at the end of the day that's all I care about. Meanwhile half of my fellow Catholics actively work against the poor and downtrodden and hate bloody everybody. I like Catholicism, it's a beautiful and complex religion, but holy shit, I do not like associating myself with these people. I've always got half a mind to leave, but then I'll read a book on liberation theology or something and I think "Okay, I'll hang in there." *sighs*


hambakmeritru

>but then I'll read a book on liberation theology What books have you read? I have The Cross and the Lynching Tree on my to- read list. I also want to read the Civil War as a Theological Crisis.


Relative_Count6087

I liked The Cross and the Lynching Tree, and the rest of Cone's work is also highly recommended, in particular if you're interested in Black theology and philosophy. If you are, the journal Black Theology is also always very interesting if you have access to it (bug your librarian) and want to hear more recent stuff. The Cambridge Companion to Liberation Theology is a very good introduction and it's usually where I point people if they want to know what to read first, unless they have some particular interest like LGBT stuff, although the second edition of the Companion does include some material on gender and sexuality. Liberation theology is basically a Latin American discipline in origin, so if you have Spanish or maybe Portuguese I think you'll be able to read a lot more about it (I don't know either language, but if you do, maybe somebody else has good recommendations).


PaulsRedditUsername

The best quote I ever heard about this was in an episode of *The West Wing*: "The founding fathers knew that if we were to have true religious freedom in this country, then the official, state religion would have to be no religion at all. It wasn't meant to make us comfortable, it was meant to make us free."


CainKilledAbleton

Literal Satanists are more loving than Christians


Mharbles

Not to undermine Satanist but the bar is pretty low.


Tom__Fuckery

if it were any lower you'd need a shovel


SaltoDaKid

Bar not low it spin on the floor, anyone can easily raise above it


Romero1993

There's nothing like hate like christian love


Goatman_Jack

*Order of the Nine Angles has entered the chat*


JonDoeJoe

They aren’t actual satanists. Just like how these right wing evangelicals aren’t actual Christians


ShallotIllustrious

You're welcome, Satan.


michael__gove

Be so funny if the main historic impact of this Texas abortion law was a huge national upsurge of support for Satanism. 😂


Mr_Lumbergh

Wouldn't surprise me in the least. If the last 30 or years has taught my anything, it's that those who claim to "live by the Bible and Constitution" are the least likely to have fully read or understand either.


ramalamafafafa5

“Know your enemy” Rage Against The Machine


TheChairmanBosshi

According to the Bible, [abortion's okay though, as long as it's for adultery](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Numbers%205%3A11-31&version=NIV). Oops. As I've found out, Christians really, *really* don't like having to explain those verses away... and that's the ones that know it's there!


Confident_Bridge9811

just suspecting adultery, the magic potion is suppose to know whose baby it is.... oh gosh Maury show flashes


catsandcheetos

Apparently abortion is okay when it’s used by a man to punish a woman. Can’t have us women choosing it for ourselves, we can’t stay meek and submissive that way…


InkSymptoms

Even as a Christian I find myself agreeing with the church of satan more often than I do other Christians. Funny how they read the Bible more than they do. Even the Bible speaks of those who misrepresent Christ. Shameful


GhostofWadeBoggs69

As I like to say: You can't govern with the Bible anymore than you can get into heaven with the Constitution .


ImGoingToWalMart

This is true. However, the fact remains that the Bible does not support the notion that personhood begins at conception, or is that a fetus is a person.


Jedi_Among_Sith

According to Genesis, the first humans weren’t alive until they took their first breath of air. I wonder why they skipped over that part in church…


cocoapelican

I can tell you they’ve read it a lot more than most Christians. I was paid to read the Bible as a child, and I’m now an atheist (go figure). As a result, I know far more about scripture than the vast majority of Christians I come into contact with. Because, surprise surprise, they haven’t really read it.


IjustMadeThisCuzXqc

Yea, but it has now. I really hope that these superstonk fans use all their newfound money to move anyone who isn't a conservative, or even ones that want out, out of texas. The amount money they're talking about should be more than enough to house these people and everything. It has been a dream of mine to just have a whole state full of conservatives and watch as their leaders just FUCK THEM. It's probably the only reasonable way we can convince them that they're just so wrong. When you run out of opposition to fuck, you have to fuck your own people, if you're a fucker. And they be fuckers.


knightB4

> And they be fuckers. Yes! They do.


becooltheywatching

TIL I might be a satanist.


Tyrannosaurus___Rekt

Literally everyone other than Christians have had to read and understand the bible. The LAST person you go to if you want to know what that malevolently stupid book says is a Christian.


alberthere

Hail Satan.


kinggimped

It doesn't matter in their eyes. In their eyes the US is a Christian fundamentalist nation at heart, and they are free to pick and choose which parts of the bible to enforce and which to ignore. Always reminds me of [that wonderful West Wing scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1-ip47WYWc) that really demonstrates the absolute hypocrisy of the religious right in the US, though doesn't explain how they continue to get away with it.


CrisGa1e

Maybe Trump could share some of his insights about 2 Corinthians. 🤣


Jedi_Among_Sith

#TWO CORINTHIANS


beh0420

Common sense


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[deleted]

How do you get a card?


effinbrak2

Almost as if... Born agains don't read the bible, they get it interpreted to them by their brainwashers. The clear message of the bible is the antithesis of what these so-called Christians often espouse. These so-called Christians have nothing but contempt and hate for the outsiders.


IdahoDuncan

Wow. When the church of satan is the voice of reason in the room.


Zestay-Taco

we start paying attention to one religious book. we gotta start listening to all of them. easier to nix them 100%


frankentriple

As a devout christian, I agree with this wholeheartedly. My rules are not your rules. You do you. I would like to talk to you about my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and how he helped me in my life, but I aint pushing it on anybody.


MGDlikethebeer

I’ll take two of your type of Christianity pleas with a side of fries. This is how it’s done 👍


Slimy_Sleeve

Thank God!


LivingWithWhales

The bible, especially the old testament, is filled with "Condoned" infanticide, genocide, ABORTION, etc. google the "bitter water trial" where women accused or suspected of infidelity were forced to drink a thing that either would or wouldn't induce an abortion. If an abortion happend it must have been adultery. Here's the rub: if a fetus doesn't matter to god if it's infidelity, who would any fetus? Also if a woman had a miscarriage, the MAN would be compensated for the loss of the child. So apparently the fetus was considered property instead of a person. Also just as a side note, nowhere in the new testament did it say anything against homosexuality until a version of the bible was re-translated in like 1958. The word is a greek word that had no other historical source outside the one letter from Paul to the church at Corinth. It's 1 letter different from a word in the old testament taken to mean "temple prostitution" which in the context of the letter Paul was writing would make much more sense. Also, Greek has like 30 words for homosexuality that are well known and common. Why not use one of them? In other words there is no specific condemnation of homosexuality from Jesus, who is the only source of true biblical guidance for christians, since the old testament is purely Judaism, as Christianity hadn't happened yet. You know what Jesus did say a lot though? Love your neighbor, don't judge people, and keep your religion out of other peoples lives. He told christians to lead by example not by imposing law, to be kind, forgiving, and never judgemental. He also hung out with tax collectors and prostitutes on the regular. EDIT: Don't want a kid? have a vasectomy. Don't want abortions to happen? Fund education and healthcare/family planning.


Tyrannosaurus___Rekt

Yes but it took the new testament to give us hell. All those other things are temporary evils of this world. Hell is an atrocity everlasting, perpetrated by a fascist sky demon that prosecutes thought crimes.


Alex09464367

He also said to listen to your masters (in a time of slavery) as if your master was your lord.


catsandcheetos

The majority of Christians of today act the same as the people who tried and crucified Jesus.


CarlSpencer

Bible's How-To Abortion Advice. Number 5, 11-27 "11 And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 12 "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: 'If any man's wife goes astray and behaves unfaithfully toward him, 13 and a man lies with her carnally, and it is hidden from the eyes of her husband, and it is concealed that she has defiled herself, and there was no witness against her, nor was she caught-- 14 if the spirit of jealousy comes upon him and he becomes jealous of his wife, who has defiled herself; or if the spirit of jealousy comes upon him and he becomes jealous of his wife, although she has not defiled herself-- 15 then the man shall bring his wife to the priest. He shall bring the offering required for her, one-tenth of an ephah of barley meal; he shall pour no oil on it and put no frankincense on it, because it is a grain offering of jealousy, an offering for remembering, for bringing iniquity to remembrance. 16 'And the priest shall bring her near, and set her before the Lord. 17 The priest shall take holy water in an earthen vessel, and take some of the dust that is on the floor of the tabernacle and put it into the water. 18 Then the priest shall stand the woman before the Lord, uncover the woman's head, and put the offering for remembering in her hands, which is the grain offering of jealousy. And the priest shall have in his hand the bitter water that brings a curse. 19 And the priest shall put her under oath, and say to the woman, "If no man has lain with you, and if you have not gone astray to uncleanness while under your husband's authority, be free from this bitter water that brings a curse. 20 But if you have gone astray while under your husband's authority, and if you have defiled yourself and some man other than your husband has lain with you"-- 21 then the priest shall put the woman under the oath of the curse, and he shall say to the woman--"the Lord make you a curse and an oath among your people, when the Lord makes your thigh rot and your belly swell; 22 and may this water that causes the curse go into your stomach, and make your belly swell and your thigh rot." Then the woman shall say, "Amen, so be it." 23 'Then the priest shall write these curses in a book, and he shall scrape them off into the bitter water. 24 And he shall make the woman drink the bitter water that brings a curse, and the water that brings the curse shall enter her to become bitter. 25 Then the priest shall take the grain offering of jealousy from the woman's hand, shall wave the offering before the Lord, and bring it to the altar; 26 and the priest shall take a handful of the offering, as its memorial portion, burn it on the altar, and afterward make the woman drink the water. 27 When he has made her drink the water, then it shall be, if she has defiled herself and behaved unfaithfully toward her husband, that the water that brings a curse will enter her and become bitter, and her belly will swell, her thigh will rot, and the woman will become a curse among her people. "


No-Comedian-4499

Any and all focus on the Bible should be directly correlated to ripping pages out and using them to roll marijuana cigarettes. In a pinch it functions for toilet paper.


luxdesigns

Yeah, I can't condone this. Those papers aren't designed for smoking, and you're going to contaminate your lungs with some nasty shit. Get phillies or actual smoking papers like everyone else.


No-Comedian-4499

True. I'm just being facetious. Definitely use rolling papers first. Smoking ink isn't good. However, there are a page or two in the back without ink. Might as well be blasphemous if you're gonna get blasted.


Rude_Journalist

Wow Satan sounds like a interesting party tho


trash332

Can we change the first amendment to read like that?


N3UR0_

As a Christian I'm disgusted by how unbelievably based the church of Satan's takes are vs. ours.


Hellspawn28

They are more progressive than any Abraham religion.


fixit858

This exactly.


speaks_truth_2_kiwis

Where's corn balls asking OP to explain the joke? What does this COS statement have to do with COS reading the bible? It's "almost as if" they read the constitution.


formeraide

I'm a born-again Christian, and I approve of this message.


Eye_of_Nyarlathotep

It's the constitution. The bible doesn't matter. That's the point.


hindiproverb

Wait till you see what happens in India :/


Woupsea

So we can stop the government from enforcing religious policies that infringe on our own religions, but in southern states where Christians elect officials who pander to their beliefs it becomes institutional by their proxy. How do we stop this?


Wicsonsin_Death_Trip

As a Jewish lady, I agree. (I adhere to the progressive, egalitarian stream of Conservative Judaism, but that’s my thing. Plus, making other people adhere to my beliefs isn’t what I’m about. Also, my main thing is”tikkun olam”, which is “healing the world”. (That’s my long day way of saying not all religious people are nut bags and the Church of Satan is an ok group, for me at least- I can’t speak for others.)