T O P
DailyAvinan

UW Emeria being a decent deck in 2022 wasn’t on my bingo card tbh. Awesome deck all the same.


Gods_Shadow_mtg

few decks that can outgrins emeria. makes a lot of sense to bring it to a grindy meta


Newliesaladdos

Hilarious, my two losses were to first and second place! Also I'm @ NewLieSalad on twitter u/Bamzing


GoatPatronus

Nice work. Always like seeing at least one Burn pilot on the list.


Newliesaladdos

Played the mirror r1, must’ve been a sliding doors moment.


00Endbringer00

Liking the magus in the sideboard.


Newliesaladdos

I never ended up bringing it in but I also never got paired against Amulet. Gonna have to test offline how much it actually helps the matchup, but I do have some alternative ideas as well. Just think Path to Exile is a bad card, would prefer sideboard tech that changes the actual dynamic of the game in a significant way.


onlinepotionpackage

What are you siding out for the Magus matches, out of curiosity? Obviously you have 6 spells that go offline when magus comes down. Do you side in the Vortexes as well?


whenfoom

Another Yawg win, another week where the comments act like it didn’t happen.


Res_Novae

Tbh I’m fine with that!


ADarkTwist

The existence of Yawgmoth is acknowledged again!


Sodek_MTG

It's not Yawg win, it was Xerk.


Trader_Joe_Mantegna

I feel like magic players forget about the pilot and just focus on decklists. The cards just sit there without the pilot, though


CloudStern

When I see these results I consider all or most of the players excellent pilots so I can only focus on decklists aswell.


Reply_or_Not

Well obviously all of us are also capable of winning with whatever finished 1st ... right? /s


DiukWolpe

Huh, maybe UU RR was the best deck all along...


CantTrips

One of its hardest matchups was 4c. Now that its gone, it kinda just eats the rest of the format.


DailyAvinan

I think we’re just seeing a field where people have chosen to beat 4c which means Murktide gets to thrive. Once people gear to beat Murktide then 4c will thrive They’re like the two bookends of the format.


CantTrips

Its funny how Murktide can actually dominate a format like this challenge and most people stay quiet about it but we see 4c place the most decks in a challenge and people come out of the woodwork. Not that some of the complaining isn't justified but it is something I think is humorous.


hfzelman

It’s cause midrange and control players are extremely vocal when it comes to 4C because the matchup is atrocious. -- Boomer Jund player


CantTrips

Murktide's saving grace: it *feels* winnable for both players in so many matchups


hfzelman

That’s why I liked Jund for the longest time


DailyAvinan

I think it’s just understood that URx fair decks are extremely popular regardless of how good/well positioned they are


HalfMoone

Exactly, people *like* playing UR, so it sees a lot more play than it should based on power level alone.


PathomaniacPlatypus

Murktide is cool, 4c is miserable


ipakers

I keep seeing people say this; how is it miserable? Or should I say, how is it more miserable then any other grindy midrange/control deck? I play against the deck plenty, and to me, it’s just another modern deck.


PathomaniacPlatypus

If you don't mind playing against it, more power to ya! I don't hate every match against it, but I'd be much happier if I never had to face it again. Largely opinion, obviously, but the glut of free removal, all their non-removal spells drawing cards, and omnath being obnoxious to play against all lead to feel bads. Every fetch sayjng "Gain 4 life, generate WURG" feels like you and the 4c player are playing totally different games. That's not to mention that the matches go to time really, really frequently. Shuffling an 80 card deck every turn + slow wincons = miserable paper experience. Other midrange decks like Jund don't have tons of card draw + yorion to bail them out if they flood. Also, the omnath shell is extremely flexible, so it can tune itself to shore up weaknesses against any given meta. There's also 3-4 meta decks that run the shell, so it's pretty dang common to run into compared with other archetypes. Oh, and most of the deck's bad matchups are linear combos or extremely grindy deckw which have rough matchups against other meta decks, especially UR Murktide. Unless you enjoy that style of deck, your 4c matchup is going to be an uphill battle.


OgoshObosh

This is exactly it imo. People play a bunch of decks that are pretty mid overall but beat 4 color and then just get rolled over by Murktide


airplane001

Haven’t seen Emeria in a hot minute


FoVBroken

Xerk is disgusting. Genuinely one of the greatest Yawg players out there! Crazy impressive.


Tarmogoofy

>Legend_cay is the other Amulet Titan player in the T8, and that list looks a lot closer to the kanister build (which was inspired by gurig). Even has the signature 61/14 split! 61/14 is truly mind boggling. How does someone simultaneously convince themselves that an extra slot in the main isn't that big of a deal in their deck with 2 card names in the title, but then decide that it's important enough to be on 60 in games 2 and 3 that they're willing to cut a SB slot?


FrozenPhoenix71

The logic behind it for Amulet specifically is to have both Bojuka Bog and Radiant Fountain available as tutor targets in Game 1(as the other lands can't really be cut to make room for both in a 60 card build), but then be able to cut the more irrelevant one for the postboard games(so cut Bog against Burn, Fountain against Control, etc.). Not saying I agree, thats just my understanding of the logic.


Tarmogoofy

Why people would do that before just cutting, say, the 4th Cavern is beyond me.


Ziiaaaac

Because you need the 4th Cavern too. You lose very little in % points for having an extra land in your main deck game 1. But having that extra utility land can be the difference between winning or losing the game against certain decks. Then post board you take out the utility land you don’t need and then sideboard properly.


Tarmogoofy

I say that to mean one of the utility lands is the worst and should be cut before going galaxy brain with 61/14. If someone has the read that Fountain, Bog, and 4 Cavern are all needed in the main, the answer is play both and cut some other flex land. If it's truly a disaster to cut either Fountain, Bog, 4th Cavern, 2nd T West, 2nd Valakut, 10th bounceland, a basic, whatever then shave the 4th STE. And if there's simply no possible way to get to 60 cards in your toolbox deck because slots are at such a premium, then you probably value having the 15th SB slot anyway if you find being on 61 in game 1 is worth it (i.e. play 61/15 instead of 61/14).


DrArsone

Don't you have to submit 61 cards for all games in a match if the starting config was 61? You can't just cut down to 60/15 for games two and three.


Tarmogoofy

It changed several years ago, but you can cut down to 60/15 if you, for example, start at 61/14.


DrArsone

Oh dip I was unaware. Thanks!


taumxd

I think you can now, but I have a hard time finding the rules for sideboarding in the Comprehensive Rules. IIRC the rules now are that your deck can never have less than 60, and your sideboard more than 15. This allows you to sideboard up more cards too, e.g 64/11, if for some reason you wanted to do that. From what I remember, part of the reason behind the rules change was to not punish players who mistakenly sideboarded into 61 cards. Previously they would get a game loss if deck checked, even though it doesn’t generally provide any advantage.


DrArsone

Hmm ok I must have misunderstood. I thought you always had to have the same or greater number of cards as your starting deck, but obviously I'm not entirely up to date.


-deja-vu-

This isn't healthy, right?


PotatoFam

Nope but good luck convincing Murktide players that.


ragingopinions

Modern is really Legacy 2.0 with an overrepresented UR deck.


TheRecovery

None of this is healthy. We’ve been doing this back and forth see-sawing of the same MH2 decks for like a full year now. Longer than Uro was legal and much longer than Uro was dominant. This is legitimately boring, though nicely balanced between the MH2 decks.


Aunvilgod

IF this happened every week, no.


Phyrexian-Drip

It does happen, twice every week; it’s not an “IF”. More often than not Murktide is the most represented deck with at least ~20% meta share per challenge.


Aunvilgod

> at least ~20% meta share no


Phyrexian-Drip

Yes, https://www.quietspeculation.com/2022/08/july-22-metagame-update-izzet-over-yet/ Check the online results with murktide sitting at ~20%. Just this weekend alone across two challenges murktide is sitting at 25%.


Aunvilgod

>I still say it isn't Tier 0 as a result. also yesterday the challenge had 5 murkide which is 15% which is totally okay, especially with a relatively low winrate


Phyrexian-Drip

I never claimed a tier to it so I don’t know what you are implying. Additionally, popular difficult decks tend have a lower average win rate due to the skill ceiling not being met by many players ex: KCI. Yes, the average is still >=25% (16/64)for the weekend and ~20% for the month of July. So I don’t know what point you are trying to make. murktide also makes up 31.3% (5/16) of challenge top 8’s this weekend, so it definitely has a good conversion rate.


AAABattery03

Looks like the metagame is narrowing even further. I know Murktide looks like the easiest culprit, but I still think the big reason this is happening is because Living End, Amulet Titan, Hammer, etc demand a **lot** of interaction if you can’t race them. The only fair decks that can race them are the ones with insanely efficient curves (Murktide being the shining example, and Shadow being the next best) and/or free interaction (4C first, and UWx next). I think the makeup of the Grixis Shadow deck is the best example: after Lurrus got banned, people experimented with Lili, Spyro, etc but ultimately it is still correct to trim down your curve even without Lurrus. I think that’s pretty much the final nail in the coffin for the “Lurrus reduced deck diversity” argument, because deck makeups stayed *identical* for RBx decks after she was banned. Hopefully there are eventually some bans or new cards that address the speed of the metagame. It needs a slight slowdown.


bac5665

No one said Lurrus reduced deck diversity. It reduced *card* diversity, which is much more important. But this meta is still trash. Ban Murktide, all companions, and Omnath, and let's just reset the format.


Inu1337S

i've been playing modern for years, and i can assure you all that you should not listen to people complaining about the format. Most of them really dont understand nothing about Modern or the game at all.


PotatoFam

I’m genuinely annoyed that people are quiet at Murktide being 34% of this Challenge. Especially considering how people were willing to call 4C overpowered and bitch and moan for **weeks** when it was only 25% of a Challenge at its absolute peak. Whatever though. Murktide doesn’t need bannings yet or anything, but I haven’t been this sick and tired of a Modern deck since MH2 release. Modern is just so damn boring with these xerox lists everywhere.


Chode__Hammer

I would rather play against Murktide 100 times than spend a single round watching Omnath make a player gain 12 life and then search and shuffle their 80 card deck six times. 4c always goes to time because it’s boring as fuck and can’t close games. Half the time I lose is because I get bored and scoop.


PotatoFam

Yeah that seems to be the prevailing opinion around these parts. I’m basically the exact opposite. I love grindy UWx decks like Emeria, Jeskai Recruiter, UWx Control, and 4C Midrange. Sometimes my win condition is just Yorion beats + 1 Colonnade lol.


Chode__Hammer

Control is very different than the 4c money pile tho. There’s actual interaction, not just play w6, T3feri, then Omnath and jerking off until your opponent scoops.


ragingopinions

To me Murktide is boring as fuck, so there are two sides to every coin. I generally dislike UR decks, I find them to be quite bland.


AAABattery03

> Murktide doesn’t need bannings yet or anything, but I haven’t been this sick and tired of a Modern deck since MH2 release. Modern is just so damn boring with these xerox lists everywhere. The lack of ban complaints should tell you that you’re in the minority though. Murktide is largely considered to be a beatable, fair deck. The games feel even and skill-testing for both players, and most matchups are close to 50-50. If this kind of representation continues for too long, it’s probably indicative of a problem, but the representation over the past year or so has been pretty healthy for the format.


PotatoFam

Yeah I’m for sure in the minority with this take. I don’t even think any card in Murktide deserves a ban & that even the #1 strongest card in the deck wouldn’t be my #1 pick for a Modern ban. My winrate against Murktide is absurdly high as well. This take is mostly coming from a place where I find the deck really boring to play against & that the sheer magnitude of Murktide players is waning my interest in the format.


AAABattery03

That’s fair. My personal take is that the speed of decks like Titan, Living End, and Hammer is severely narrowing the variety of slower decks that can exist. Murktide is overrepresented because the majority of Midrange players in the whole game have switched to it, simply because most other such decks just have glaring weaknesses against one or more of the above decks.


PotatoFam

I agree with that take as well. The unfair/combo decks of the format are kind of insane right now. When a deck like Living End just has the nuts, it is literally unbeatable without multiple free pieces of interaction yourself.


Chode__Hammer

Just play something that runs 4 chalice main board.


Master_Shak

Yesss. Come to the prison Tron darkside.


Chode__Hammer

Already have it built in paper my guy


Master_Shak

You love to see it!


Betta_Max

(Meekly raises his hand) I wouldn't mind seeing something out of Murktide get banned.


Living_End

Congrats to Makia on their finish with Living End. They played a list with its flex spots containing 1 borrower and 1 turtle. They also are back to 1 sruin and 1 Otawara from 2 Otawara that has been pretty stock the last month. Surprise casting grief, wraith, and architect must be pretty good still. Again congrats to to Makia, and best of luck in the future with the deck.


Existenz81

It's no surprise that the Young Wolf-deck succeeds vs a field where Ragavan appears in 15 of the 32 top decks. It's interesting to see the polls on Twitter where more and more people believe that Ragavan is more busted than DRS. The format certainly revolves around the question "can you answer a turn 1 monkey?"


DontBanYorion

I don't mind that Murktide is doing so well, so long as people are consistent and willing to acknowledge reality.


PerceusJacksonius

Good weekend for Amulet looks like. Better weekend for UR though... Wonder why no one is playing/succeeding with 4C? Too expensive I suppose? It surpasses alot of people's rental limit, but I've seen it doing pretty well in paper. Seems like there's plenty of UR decks to beat up on for 4C to succeed.


DailyAvinan

I have no idea. The deck is so good in paper, but people don’t like it online. Maybe a mixture of chess clocks and having to deal with people actively making deck choices to specifically not lose to 4c. It took down the [NRG 10k](https://mtgmelee.com/Tournament/View/9606) this weekend though.


Seegulz

It’s taken down like all the nrg events. The deck is just underplayed on mtgo. Period. I own all the fetchlands and a lot of major staples on mtgo and have a 500 dollar rental on cardhoarders and can barely just afford it.


DailyAvinan

I think it’s just really really good at smashing paper all stars like UW Control, Jund, Murktide. Like no matter where I go I always play at least 1 Jund player in a big paper event lol


logiccosmic

4c also just has good game against *any* field, which in paper events where goofy stuff comes out of the woodworks means a whole lot. It's just better Jund. It's the unequivocally the best Midrange deck in the format. In the MTGO meta, that seems to be rewarded less.


Seegulz

Gotta do something with those bad foil cards


crazybaloth

Yes I think this is the actual reason. Paper meta is way more favorable to 4 color than online.


DontBanYorion

>Maybe a mixture of chess clocks and ... I can't speak to the validity of your other theories, but I'm skeptical of the chess clock as a deterrent to playing 4c. The clock is far more punishing in person. If a player is taking 25 minutes to do 4c things on MTGO where searching libraries is instantaneous, they're going to take even longer in paper.


john_dune

Yes. But in paper a round goes to turns, no chess clock loss


Newliesaladdos

I genuinely think it’s the clock. In a paper tournament you can go X-1-1 and top into rounds that are untimed. On modo that UD is a loss and that usually knocks you out of contention.


jose_cuntseco

u/dontbanyorion stays taking Ws on you nerds.