By - ScottElly
Wow, how is it the media can talk forhours a day about transfers and not for a second talk with this depth of knowledge....
Because they care about sensation, not about facts
It really amazes me that there isn’t a football channel for in depth analysis instead of former footballers chatting shite.
There's TAW (LFC focused), Tifo (many subjects, lots of resources from Athletic, amazing art department, good & easy to understand surface level analysis - xG kinda thing, a bit of positional analysis but not much deeper than that), the Athletic (quality highly dependent on the writers - paid content), Swiss Ramble (amazing for finances).
There used to be Zonal Marking.net but he's so good he got hired by an actual football club.
In Bed With Maradona (football culture) is also gone/mostly gone.
There's Football Made Simple but honestly I think it's just average. The production quality also has a lot of room for improvement.
The stuff on TV are mostly for entertainment purposes. Jamie & Gary are alright when talking about the tactical side, but they talk about so many things nowadays that the actual football side gets neglected. They like to dabble in speculations and drawing tangents rather than factual on the pitch analysis. Probably gets too boring for the general public if they talk only about tactics.
All that's available nowadays are probably good for most followers of the sport, but not good enough for those that want to dig deeper. You'd have to make the analysis yourself from publicly available information, unfortunately.
But hey, maybe you can fill that gap in the market?
I meant more on general television, as in after the games the same way you have now but more in depth and less “emotional”. As you’ve mentioned there are lots of independent places but it’s strange nonetheless that no major television broadcaster has thought to do an in depth analytics show.
One of my favourite punditry moments was when Emma Hayes would go in further depth than we’ve heard co-commentators do.
Knowledge doesnt sell, and selling is the aim
you lot only bring up wages when it suits your agenda lol
goals scored for each club: 0
already exhausted by the comparisons and the season has not even begun
I'm already really tired of this argument by both sides about the finances of these transfers. Yes, the Haaland deal all in all is a bit more expensive than the Núñez deal, but Haaland is a far more proven player than Núñez. Let's face it, City got a great deal on this transfer, and (again, speaking before either have kicked a ball for the club) it would appear to be better value. It annoys me when I see our fans desperately trying to cling on to the fact that Núñez all in all is cheaper. I just don't really care.
But, other side, also annoys me when I see City fans using this transfer to try and make out that we spend as much as they do. Like yeah let's ignore the fact that you've spent over a billion in the last however many years, just because of this one transfer.
Essentially, every bit about this is annoying me.
Personally the way I see it is that it's more to shut those city fans up about us spending way more on Nunez than they did on Haaland. Since all they seemed to look at was just the transfer fees paid by the clubs.
Eh, they know where their success comes from. They know that our spending isn't really comparable. They just want to try and justify their success and show everyone that they do deserve it, but no-one is buying it
You're right, absolutely noone with two brain cells to rub together is buying it. Hence the almost completely across the board antipathy towards City buying another title.
>a bit more expensive
\*Quite a lot more
I think it's more about the media, claiming Haaland cost £51m when they know he cost way more.
This is the type of comment I have been searching for. We don't even know what Klopp's plan for Nunez is. Comparison is nonsense.
I’ll shit a brick if he isn’t a striker though all the same
Because Diaz and Jota when playing on the wing both has oriention of cutting inside then I imagine Nunez will drift wide a lot and they will swap positions very often.
We need to stop comparing Nunez to Haaland right now. Most of us would take Haaland over Nunez. Haaland is the proven better player right now and is one of the best forwards in the world. Nunez has had only one really good season in a weaker league. Obviously I hope Nunez turns out the better player but comparing the two is too soon right now.
Absolutely. To be fair to swiss ramble though, major outlets ARE comparing the fees for the exact reason that Haaland is obviously better. So ai think they are just addressing that.
Weak league is hard to say this.. the last 3 best signing in the league have come from there. Bruno.. Ruban and our Diaz.
The league is definitely weaker, but Portugal is the gateway to some of the best talent producing nations in the world. And we all know how Bundesliga inflates striker numbers.
I don't think you can say the league is weaker they actually adapt to the league better than anyone looking at the whole of the wolves team. Jose Sa another who learnt most of his trade in his home nation.
The German league is just overinflation of players. They not many players who have come in recent years who have real value.
It is a weaker league but it's the next best league after the big leagues. Personally rank it above ligue 1 ex PSG tbh.
League is weaker for sure, but Portugese teams have consistently done better in Champions league over the years unlike Bundesliga (not Bayern) and Ligue 1 teams.
I would agree... Not sure Bayern Munich have that much real competition in their league. I would think much harder to be a player in the Primeira Liga.There are a few more teams that can challenge each other, opening it up, tougher competition. Not just one real money team winning every year.
Sure, but I think this shows that a move for Haaland will never make financial sense us and therefore, it was never on the cards. There are also mentions of a release clause that will activate in 2 years time around 150 mil Euros that Haaland wanted which is another non-starter.
Yes. This is ridiculous. I live in Portugal so see much more of the league here. Nunez is very strong with a very high ceiling. But to compare him to Haaland is absolutely bizarre. Not on the same level at all.
i agree 100% with this
Tbf Haaland has had 2 seasons in a weaker league. Neither are as strong as the PL. Both have similar points to prove, but it it useless comparing the two before either has kicked a ball.
And champions league record?
I think that’s what makes it more contentious? Darwin for example had a better CL run last season, where Haaland never even played against a top side (Besiktas, Sporting, Ajax), but then he scored more in Germany I believe, which is a harder league than the Portuguese.
You would be surprised in the difference of quality between the Bundesliga and the Primeira league outside of Bayern Munich. There isn’t much between them and I don’t buy your argument that most would take Haaland over Núñez.
You wouldn't take him over Darwin?
No. Cost, early indication of potential injury problems, and Núñez’s ability to play on the wing makes him a better option for the way we play than Haaland.
After seeing Darwin in red, no way in hell. We don't do inflated initial salary and release clause. Haaland should be seen in that context, Darwin is a perfect fit for Liverpool.
Then why did Frankfurt beat West Ham in the Europa league?
I would had thought 7th in prem would had beaten 11th in bundesliga if the difference in quality was that big.
What has that got to do with anything? You haven’t even read my comment properly.
Ah sorry, just expected that you spelt premier leavue wrong.
But still... german clubs beat portugese more often
And taking Bayern out of the equation “there isn’t much between them”.
Not really. Bayern are the top club in germany but Porto/Benfica in comparison struggle to beat 4th-6th best
I’m happy with Nunez, however the money in football these days is ridiculous. I’m on just over U.K. average annual salary and both of them probably earn that in a day or so.
Entertainment and sports are just crazy inflated industries atm. Combined the 2 and you get outrageous numbers like this, especially when we're fresh off of a global pandemic killing millions. Would be interesting to see when the bubble pops, if it pops in my lifetime.
Lucky bastard. Anyway, money has now flocked to PR and marketing, so if your field comes in contact with those - you're golden. Or else, median salaried job it is.
This is just flat out wrong, a simple Google search of highest paid uk careers would have shown you this.
Although it's kind of nice that we're paying considerably less (and moreso considering Darwins 6 year contract to Haalands 5), it doesn't really matter if the performances aren't good. I think Darwin will be excellent for us, but he hasn't played a game yet - 200m for 30 goals is a better deal than 140m for 4 goals. Counting chickens and all that
Also consider Nunez will likely get a new deal in 1-2 years if he performs, Haarland is already closer to the ceiling. We also don’t know what dodge deals Haarland has with business opportunities for family members etc… will never know the full picture from either side, but I think it’s fairly clear Haarland is by far the more expensive player.
Well that’s just the thing. On paper Haaland sounds like a no brainer, but what if for some reason he doesn’t deliver here. City can risk those insane wages, we really can’t.
That's the thing though, when it comes to City there is no ceiling. They could pay him 2mm pounds a week and not bat an eye. We can't. I'm ok with us not being able to do that, I'm not ok with City both flagrantly violating FFP and Prem rules as well as paying massive amounts of cash and assets to players and management under the table. Which they can do in perpetuity because unlike most corporations, they are literally a) a brutal dictatorial nation state b) built on oil. So even to an extent that they could be sanctioned by the league, it wouldn't do shit to stop them doing whatever they want in a country they literally own. It's like bulletproof corruption.
Haaland has a face that looks like he'd play for City.
fits right in
This is a good breakdown. I really don’t understand everyone’s insistence than Darwin is a €100m transfer while in the same breath calling Haaland a £52m transfer.
First of all, no one seems to care about exchange rates. Second of all, add-ons range from likely to far-fetched, while Haaland’s commission and agent fees are guarantees. That’s a £96m price tag up front, no uncertainty.
We paid £65m for Darwin up front and the most he could conceivably cost us is £87m. Not that it matters, but the narratives around these respective transfer fees/valuations is absurd and have no basis in reality.
I hate this comparison between the two. We know that Haaland along with Mbappe were the hottest topics regarding transfers this window and for good reason. City clearly have a great deal and Haaland’s overall cost is relevant to his performances over recent years plus potential.
Nunez has the potential to make his fee seem like a bargain if he hits the ground running just like Ali and VVD did before him.
If there was no clause in the Haaland deal then I’m sure it would cost 200m for the fee alone but the fact they got him so cheap then the wages overcompensate.
In this moment Haaland’s overall value should be more in my opinion than £49m shown here.
The idea isn't so much that Liverpool got a better deal or that Nunez is an equal player.
It's more no Liverpool couldn't have got Haaland for cheaper than got Nunez. There's a bit more nuance to this than just trabsfer fee.
Obviously this graphic is slightly out of context and it's from a longer piece by @swissramble on Twitter that's a good read.
Saw this posted on r/soccer. Any talk of wages was met with pushback of “netspend FC” and that Liverpool have been consistently in the top in terms of paying wages so why do we talk about wages for this one deal? I understand to an extent, but this graph wasn’t created by a Liverpool supporter as far as I could tell.
When two exciting young forwards join the top two PL teams at the same time it’s going to bring a lot of comparisons which I feel is unfair. But the media love it and it gets clicks so I totally understand it.
Nunez is very expensive, but seems to have all the right attributes and mentality to make it at Liverpool. I’m very excited to see what he can do now, and how he can progress his game going forward. Probably a lot more expected of Haaland at this stage.
Performance bonuses are really high with haaland some say if City win pl and cl and he scores more than 30+ goals he could walk away with 20mil or something like that not a reliable source every possibility it could be true with haaland entourage.
Give me the option and I choose Haaland all day long. I hope I'm wrong but I think he is going to score 40+ goals this season. Obviously I hope Nunez does too, I just think Haaland is an amazing player.
Is haaland a more traditional centre forward? Maybe suits lfc to have someone who links play better? 🤔
A traditional CF, what is that? Have you seen Haalands goals? Have you seen his movements, how he strikes a ball, his strength? I hope Nunez can contribute more goals and assists than Haaland and I hope we win more trophies than City. I think Haaland is a smashing player but I hope Nunez will be. And you can be sure I'll be 100% behind Nunez.
What is that? Just scores goals, low amount of assists (I do think he's good BTW) but I could see nunez being moulded into another fermino (yes I'm a great fan of him)
Based on their careers so far, Haaland is worth 10x the amount of Nuñez, if not more. Where did this idea come from that Nunez is suddenly at a similar level and would cost a similar amount of money
Players from the Portuguese league have tended to translate to the premier League better than from Germany. 10x is an excessive exaggeration. Remember Nunez got twice the goals of Haaland in the Cl and had a better season domestically. And sure Haaland was injured, but if you wanna mention that, then you'd need to talk about his proneness to injury in the PL being problematic.
“Based on their careers so far”. I don’t see how you can argue that Nunez is anywhere close to Haaland lol.
Based on their careers so far, I'm arguing that the statement "Haaland is in no way worth 10x the value of Nunez, if not more." is simply incorrect. I think they are a lot closer than that, and Nunez might surprise you this season.
If you think Nunez and Haaland have comparable careers up to this point then I can't help you. Haaland was cheap because of his release clause and we got fleeced in the Nunez deal. I could see Haaland breaking the record transfer if he didn't have a release clause and I don't think Nunez is worth half of what we paid for him.
I didn't say that they had comparable careers I was just comparing their last season in my original comment.. But if you think Nunez is worth less than half of what we paid for him then I don't think you have much faith in our recruitment/Klopp, and I don't think you understand the current market for no. 9's very well. Also downvoting for discussion is not cool.
You didn’t get downvoted for discussion, I just didn’t like your “he might surprise you next season”. First of all I was talking about their valuation based on their careers so far and also I didn’t say that he wouldn’t be good for us that’s not the point at all. We’ve had players come in for 30/40/50 million who have been amazing for us, this is what I’m used to with Liverpool’s recruitment.
Comparing a full season to a injury hit season is a bit of a cop out IMO — and even so it’s hard to argue that Nuñez’s season was as good as Haaland’s unless you look only at goals and ignore the amount of games played. I think you know the comparison isn’t favourable so you are looking for ways to add bias. For example you said he scored twice the amount of UCL goals ignoring the fact that his scoring ratio was way less than Haalands 1 goal per game / 3 in 3 in the UCL with 29 goals in 30 apps in all comps.
I think his value should’ve been more like 30-40m. 85m based off of 1 season in Portugal is nuts. I trust Klopp for sure but honestly I don’t trust whoever is handling player contracts. For me replacing such an important player like Mané with an unproven youngster is far too risky and they seem to be ignoring the fact our midfield is very obviously in need of new blood.
Is this the Bundesliga Tax thing? Bundesliga also has some hits in the EPL like Gundogan, Son, KdB, Auba, Matip and Firmino for every Sancho, Werner, Pulisic...
Same as the Portuguese League in which for every Bruno, Diaz Dias and Neves, we have Dalot, Fabio Silva and Telles...
Most if not all of us would love to sign Haaland before he signed for City. This Bundesliga Tax thing would not be a thing in this sub if he signed for us.
Players from the German league has typically taken a season or so to adapt. None of those hit the ground running really, won’t be a shock if Haaland has a relatively quiet year and then smashes it the next.
Auba was great when he came during mid season. I also hope that Haaland will have a quiet season but that is quite impossible. We all know what a monster he is. The only way he will have a quiet season is because of his injury.
He’s one of the only ones who has though, so I don’t think it’s unfair to say it typically takes them a while to adapt. There’s just so many factors in football, nothing is a given. There’s just little use in debating until we see what they look like in their new teams.
For me Haaland still seems like the better option. The difference of 49m over 5 years does seem like much. Haaland is a very marketable player I feel he can easily bring in over 10m a year just on a number of merch items we sell in stores plus Nike sales money.
Additionally he is one of the biggest names in football. He has the ability to bring in a lot of younger fans/ retain fans for us.
Overall Haaland is the better player. He has everything fair play to City but he is going to score 20+ goals for fun. Let's hope Darwin does the same.
But Darwin is prettier.
We are Handsome FC, we could never sign Haaland
Pretty Boy FC you mean?
Nunez gives me ibrahimovic vibes so I’m pretty damn excited. But, haaland is obviously better than him right now. Hopefully he flops at city
Haaland was a steal. We just trying to feel superior on something. Not saying Nuñez wont be a good player, but that is speculative. We know haaland will be.
Yeah I mean the superior player is always going to command higher wages. Off the bat City have got a great deal, and they'll cash in too in a few years when Madrid come knocking to pay the release clause.
Such an odd comparison. One is a no doubt top 5 player in the world and the other is a nice prospect.
Will be interesting to see what the difference in goal return will be also. Have a sneaking suspicion Nunez will outscore Haaland.
Ooh I love these, the one on the right is Marge Simpson
is it? why's she wearing her necklace on her head?
City paid Haaland’s dad £20m as part of the deal as well
Let's not forget the 50-100mm in Emirates property they'll receive either. And that most definitely will not be on the books.
That's included in the numbers under commission.
Why are people so obsessed with this price thing it's not like you earn any money from the club and if you don't spend any money you won't win anything you can literally predict the premier league table using club's wage bill aside from United but that's because they are just shite
What I’m getting from this is that if we really wanted we could’ve got haaland, only a 50m difference. Just didn’t go for it I guess which is fine, I trust our recruitment.
What others have said, longevity at the club and wages pays a big part, Nunez could spend the rest of his top years at the club, Haaland wanted a clause in his contract so he can join another club easily if they pay.
How does Liverpool get away with paying their players such low wages? Díaz salary is also a joke.
We didn't get him because of the price and how that might compare with other transfers.
We got him because he'll be a great addition to the squad. He'll score goals.
But we haven't seen anything from Nunez.
We still need to see him play a season.
Until then, this sort of post is meaningless bullshit
Doesn't Haaland's contract also have a relatively low release clause for how good he is? He'll bin Man City for Real Madrid in a few years but Nunez will be a lifer here.
worth noting that nunez might be that good that we'll offer him a new deal on improved terms before that one is up. I alos don't see haaland staying his full contract, someone will probably pay the release clause
I couldn’t give a shit about the money - I don’t pay the bills. I want goals!
Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought Haaland has two agent fees(Riola and Father) totaling 60m GBP. It's definitely not 43m as his dad's cut alone is 30m. Also, isn't Nunez's agent fee included in the 87m total?
I saw a comment on r/soccer that said Liverpool have signed Marge Simpson by the looks of this graph lmao
Where's super agent blokes commission for Nunez?
Not that huge of a difference, in fairness.
Can anyone explain the difference between commission and agents fee? Trying to forget the size of the sums involved but that seems like double charging by someone.
Another poster mentioned Haalands father also getting a sum of €30m. Again ignoring the sums involved any thoughts on this? Parent as agent fair enough but perhaps not great really for the client, but parent and agent? As a parent I’d feel v strange getting cash from a recruiter if one of my kids moved job
That extra year is nice to see
Haaland at 375k lmao
£43M in agents fees and “commission” wtf?
Can we please stop with these comparisons? Since when do we account for wages when talking about transfer fees? We may pay less overall but no doubt haaland is the better player.
We should just wait til the next season to see how they pan out.
I obvs don't want us to go throw silly money and wages at players all the time. But comparisons about wages especially really confuse me. The money isn't coming out of our pocket so I genuinely couldn't care less haha.
If Haaland goes and scored 30/40+ goals a season for the next 5 years no one will question anything to do with any fees. End of the day the proofs in the pudding. Nunez even at less cost is a bigger risk as he's had 1 good season in a poor league. Haaland is a year younger and has scored 114 goals in 111 games in his last 3 seasons. He's almost guaranteed to be a success. And if he leads them to more leagues and the CL people won't be talking about Agent fees or commision haha.
outta curiosity where does the Commission go?
Would have seen that as agent's fee??
I'm not sure how's its calculated, maybe that is the money that went to Alfie Haaland and the agents fee is to his actual agent.
Note: His agent was Mino Raiola who passed away, so his agency gets the agent fees.
Also you have Cities ridiculous bonus scheme to add into this. Haaland is likely to pocket at least and extra £10m per season in bonus'.
Both are worth every penny, completely defensible moves from both teams, and you could swap the teams these guys went to, keep the structure of the deal the same, and make the same statement (although I guess haalands wages would have to fall within our structure still).
It’s more of a demonstration of how crazy a level the economics of footy have gotten to than anything else—prospective resale value alone is well worth the outlay for both.
Good luck getting a City fan to quote these numbers
Ah to make 53k/day...
Great comparison. It shows that transfer fee is only a part (sometimes small part) of money spent on the transfer.