By - Kassandra_Coley
A mixture of olden day napoleonic tactics and newer, modern rifles I believe?
Yeah. Spot on with the added combo of Us counting every soldier, Union and Confederate in those numbers. They Blood baths that were Shiloh and Antietam are... kinda nuts to read about. On top of both sides having prison camps. Also good to note. The Civil war was the beginning of the US Army's Signal Corp. It's where their symbols of the flag and torch comes from.
Also disease. IIRC like 1 or 2 thirds of the dead were from illness
Hasn't that been the case for most wars in history?
I think WWI was the first, at least in Western military history, where that wasn't the case.
Yay for progress!!!
WW2. WW1 had the Spanish flu
Were there enough fatalities from that during the war to count?
WW1 and the Spanish flu co-existed for nine months, so probably not to the same scale as disease in the American civil war. But the Spanish flu did kill 50 million people, compared to WW1's 20 million. So I'm sure there were some.
I say WW2 because the time between WW1 and 2 had advancements in medicine.
I'll allow that that may be the case.
Lol thanks professor, appreciate the endorsement.
A lot of people died in WW2 from ~~Malaria~~ diseases.
Edit: A lot of cases of Malaria, not so many deaths
I'm assuming the African front?
Africa and the Pacific. 19-28 million civilians and military personnel died to disease in WW2. Also, from what I see, in WW2 there were only 90 deaths to Malaria in the US Navy, so that's my bad. However, there were over 300,000 cases of it. Diarrhea and Dysentery we're the number one killers of soldiers in WWII with a confirmed number of 57,000
That makes sense. We had pretty good malaria medicine in the 40s, but there are a hell of a lot of other diseases that can kill you in the islands we did not have good treatments for.
I've always wondered, specifically with the US if they have good statistics on where people are from in the country versus how badly they were affected by diseases during the war. Because I could see people from the deep south maybe doing better with the tropical diseases as they may have contracted some of those as youths, whereas people from the desert and the more temperate climates would have almost no exposure to them.
More on pacific I’d imagine.
To be fair at the end they started using WW1 tactics such as trench works.
Plus new, rifled artillery. The new cannons were absolutely devastating, especially canister and grape shot. It’s hard to really imagine the carnage of a day like Fredericksburg or Cold Harbor being carried out with muzzleloading weapons, but us Americans are a wild bunch
Plus two belligerents close to each other with larger populations.
It wasn’t exactly east to ship soldiers to the US in both wars.
what is the napoleonic tactics?
Advancing in line, shoulder to shoulder at walking pace into lines of men armed with rifles that were highly accurate at long range.
why did they fight in lines?
The same reason they did at the start of WWI. Old school, classically trained generals didn't realise that the tactics they were taught in military academies were incompatible with advancing military technologies. They still thought in terms of large set piece battles of regiment against regiment with muzzle loading muskets and rifles, where weight of fire was more important than accuracy of fire.
Also *much* larger armies and populations. For comparison America mustered an army of like 40,000 in the Revolutionary War, while just the Union had 2.2 million serve in the Civil War.
[OP is a repost bot](https://www.reddit.com/r/HistoryMemes/comments/njhkws/the_civil_war_was_on_a_whole_nother_level/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
That’s what happens when the weapon tech changes and the military strategy doesn’t change to fit it. Same thing happened in WWI too
New industrial weapons+Old tactics+Rampant Disease=Most American dead in a war
No one wants to kill Americans more than Americans.
Damn Americans! They ruined America!
People really wanted to fight for their rights to own slaves... 😳
Yes that, but it's also easy to get young men stirred up in national pride. (I'm only making this excuse because I had family in the confederate army and I don't want their racism to be associated w me)
Also a fair point. Thing is both sides were using that argument of national pride, they just had different ideas of what that looked like.
The past is in the past, the sins of the father do not fall upon the child. What they did and their reasonings should never be associated with you.
Propaganda always has been and always will be a powerful thing.
Dude, my great grandfather was a proud, card carrying member of the Nazi party, who was more than happy to be there. They don't reflect on us.
Bro like everyone’s grandparents are probably racist. They don’t reflect on you whatsoever
It’s not unless you make it. There’s no such thing as “clean” confederates, you could not exist in the confederacy without supporting slavery, knowing about the slaving runs in the north, knowing about the executions of black POWs, knowing about the prison camps, etc. Continuing to fight for the confederacy shows that they were fine with all of this going on. Nationalistic fervor is never an excuse for atrocity.
Or they were conscripted, or the fact that being a soldier was one of the only ways to make enough money at the time to feed one's family due to the Confederate economy being hot garbage.
That being said, you can absolutely argue that them fighting supported the institution of slavery, and it's an absolute fact that the political reason for succession was slavery
You could be conscripted, but if people who were literally enslaved could make their way up north, so could you. To be clear, I am not saying that they *liked* everything the confederacy was doing, but it was all things they were willing to support if it meant maintaining the confederacy and it’s ideology.
Lee let his soldiers enslave thousands of free Americans after Gettysburg, he was a monster
Had an interesting conversation with my aunt about my great grandmother who died in 1980. She told my aunt not to marry a catholic or a yankee. And if she couldn’t marry a Methodist then an Episcopalian or a Presbyterian would be okay but she damned well better not marry a Baptist. I was like, you know, between the no papists, the no yankees, and the confederate money in her bedroom drawer I’m starting to get a profile. This woman raised my great aunt who is currently 99 and is a sweet lady until you get on the topic of race. I pointed this out as well and my aunt said, “her mom was born in 1894 and her mother and aunt sat on their porch and heard the cannons at fort fisher and hid their horses from Yankees.” No one has said anything about it but someone owned slaves and we’ve found that we are related to a black family through my great great grandpa. It’s 2022 and people act like all this happened so long ago but it didn’t. Those people felt some kind of way about racial supremacy, even the ins that didn’t own other people. It definitely was about specifically that. I don’t hide from it or pretend that my family was there for any other reason. I also had 13 great great uncles fight for the confederacy and I know how their still living grand kids think and act and it isn’t pleasant. Stuff gets passed down. I just try to do better.
It was an absolute shock to me when I found out our family were slave owners. And I only found out because my 23 and me results came back with some African, so I started digging. I know I shouldn't feel ashamed of my ancestors, because I had nothing to do with them, but when you're raised to be proud of your heritage, things can get pretty confusing.
There is now a small rift in the family between the older generations who wanted it to be forgotten and the younger generation who have been lied to about our family history. I probably should have just kept my mouth shut.
Edit: sorry for the run on sentences. This has all happened pretty recently and it's been a crazy few weeks in the family. We haven't properly worked it out yet.
Or they got conscripted. A not-insignificant portion of the Confederate Army was conscripted, and had no wish to actually fight in the war
Valid point. Lots of young men fighting in wars that old men cry out for.
The confederates kept the issue of slavery out of their propaganda because it was very hard to morally convince a majority population of poor non slaveowning whites that they need to die for the rich guys slaves, it focused more on being allowed to be “free” from Washington’s Tyranny, we’re on the Union side, freeing the slaves was the primary objective because at that point everyone knew just how bad the treatment of them was down in the south and especially after the emancipation proclamation there wasn’t any asking whether or not it was just to repair the Union
1.6 million people died because some racist rich people wanted to own other humans 💀
Also over the question of whether or not a state was free to leave after joining the union, and the answer to that question is no.
What industrializing your war does to a mf
Only around 200k died of war. The rest died *with* the Civil War.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but this was due to a combination of 2nd gen warfare using 3rd gen weaponry, unhygienic hospital practices and prison camps, and things like Sherman's Georgia campaign, yes?
Yeah since the south had no right to secede the number includes CSA dead. We need to separate it as Union soldiers and Traitors when using it also captured get counted as casualties which kind of skews it considering an entire army surrendered
No. Both sides are Americans. If you count the traitors as non-American then you are saying they were their own country and not a rebellion.
They are Americans they are just criminals but since we already seperate soldiers killed in combat verses the criminal ones the traitors can also be seperated from the main count
It would 365000 dead for the union and 290000 for the confederacy
If you could by captures that happened at the end of the war and injuries the South has more casualties
Arguably the first the large scale industrial war. Or, one could argue, just one side was industrial. An industrial country means a magnitude larger population pool from which to draw soldiers, more weapons and more powerful weapons. By 1865, the Union had the largest and most powerful army the world had ever seen. Industrial warfare.
Industrial capacity meets warfare
Trench warfare is a bitch.
IMO the weird one was revolutionary war
The Great Locomotive Chase, best thing ever.
The battle of Shiloh had more casualties than the total number of deaths in all previous American wars combined
We just had this meme like a month ago.
About 2% of the population was killed in combat during the Civil War, about 1% of the population was killed in the Revolutionary War. The extent of the Revolutionary War’s impact on the population is often understated. It was a widespread war.
Battle of Gettysburg go brr
40k fans realizing just how many humans died when the AI turned during the AOT:
Not wanna take away any credit of that conflict and how sad it was that all those lives have been lost, but in the grand scheme of humanity, there have been many conflicts with way more casulties that deserve the "what the fuck" way more.
Well when the deaths on both sides count towards the total..
Just wait till the second one coming soon
A modern day civil war would be difficult to start. Back in the day, everyone around you thought basically the same thing. You had your town or city, and that was it. Now people with polar opposite views live next to each other. Any state wishing to succeed on similar grounds to the old confederate states would encounter far more internal obstacles as less of their population would be willing to back them. Any revolutionary movement would have to rely on terrorism and support from other countries, say Russia for instance. While the rebellion might last a while, it would take serious government incompetence and/or massive support from the population to deal any real damage. The most they could hope for is increased airport security, a removal of freedoms for the American people, and decreased trust in the government.
Do you genuinely believe there is going to be a second civil war? C'mon men
You have to understand, they REALLY wanted to keep their slaves.