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Petition: If old people don’t want it, then let young people get the vaccine now

Petition: If old people don’t want it, then let young people get the vaccine now

Traditore1

here's a list of times change.org petitions achieved something:


redsquirrel11

They are pretty good at clogging up your emails though


Now_Wait-4-Last_Year

A change.org petition did help get a cinema release for Cabin in the Woods in Australia.


Danvan90

Cabin in the woods wasn't going to get a cinema release? WTF, that movie was great.


Appropriate_Mine

Here's the first list I found https://www.businessnewsdaily.com/3637-business-changes-year.html


Echospite

Suggestions for better ideas?


Traditore1

petition the actual government rather than a backwater website that they have no legal obligation to do anything with?


Cartwheel_Captain

Yeah, maybe create an e-petition with Parliament of Australia https://www.aph.gov.au/e-petitions/create


Frankie_T9000

Thats a pretty comprehensive list.


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Danvan90

Such a dumb comment. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonviolent_resistance


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pureideology69

Lol thank you for the comment, I had to double take what the comment you were replying to said because of its stupidity lmfao


Wildweasel666

We are supply constrained currently. It’s expected to improve in the coming weeks.


dd_throw_1234

It's not going to improve that much in the coming weeks, though of course every week there will be some number of additional doses. We're not expected to have enough Pfizer for everyone who wants it until at least October according to the current delivery schedule. Anyway, I think the petition is to let young people take AstraZeneca, for which we are not really supply constrained (the government seems to be holding back millions of doses for second doses, which is completely unnecessary).


yum122

Can't you just sign a waiver if you're under 50 for AstraZeneca and get it?


dd_throw_1234

I think the issue is that many under 50s are not currently officially considered eligible for the vaccine at all according to the rollout schedule, so many vaccine centres or GP will not offer it to them. As to whether an under 50 can consent to receive AZ if they are eligible for a vaccine, I believe that the national policy is yes, but there are mixed reports and it seems to depend on the GP or vaccination hub in practice.


werdnum

There certainly doesn't seem to be a well lit path to doing that. I'm sure it happens but you'd have to find a cooperative GP willing to look the other way and bend the eligibility rules.


DrStalker

I'm 41 in group 1b. I got the Astrazenica jab. I asked at a clinic near work if I could sign a waiver or some such and was told all I had to do was sign up normally and I'd have to confirm with a doctor on the day. So on the day of the jab I told the doctor I was aware of and accepted all risks associated with Astra Zenica, he confirmed I had no history of clots/blood thinners and said "I'm legally obligated to tell you that you qualify for the Pfizer vaccine" and that was it. So no waiver, just a brief chat with a doctor before I got the jab.


Wildweasel666

source? "Expected supply of the Pfizer vaccine (based on comments from Greg Hunt here and here) is 300k doses per week until July, then 600k per week until October, and then 2.32M per week until the end of the year for a total of 40M doses in 2021." https://chrisbillington.net/aus\_vaccinations.html#longproject https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/jun/03/critical-lack-of-covid-vaccine-supply-in-melbourne-forcing-gps-to-turn-people-away


dd_throw_1234

For Pfizer, according to those projections we're expecting about 7-8 million more doses before October, which will not be enough for everyone who wants it (I believe Greg Hunt said that it will ramp up to 600k per week over July, not that it will be 600k/week from the beginning of July). For AZ, according to [covid19data.com.au](https://covid19data.com.au), (which I believe is Chris' source), we already have nearly 8 million AZ doses. On the other hand, we've only administered around 4M. So there is a 4M dose surplus somewhere (possibly being inexplicably withheld by the federal government for second doses).


Wildweasel666

we can obviously debate the nuances of how much should be held in reserve (there definitely should be a solid reserve as we cannot afford for 2nd doses to be missed) but none of what you're saying changes my initial points that a) we're supply constrained and b) supply is increasing


plazmafire

Second doses...? Not many people that have had the first does of AZ have had the second yet (general public, not counting front line workers). The 12 week wait is still 2 or 3 weeks away for my dad. I mean it does make some sense to hold doses for the second round. What if supply stops tomorrow, and then we come to the point where all the people start needing that second dose? Sure, it's a remote possibility, but I would bet the government is playing to that tune somewhat.


jo_yve456

I'm 48 healthcare worker having my 2nd Astrazenica dose tomorrow...


chrisjbillington

There is no lack of demand for Pfizer. What you're asking is for AZ to be encouraged for under 50s. That would conflict with the recommendations from ATAGI. Is there a reason to think their recommendations are wrong? I don't think so - they've done the risk/benefit calculations and this is where we're at. If the beef is with ATAGI then there needs to be better arguments than misleading silliness like this: > At current pace of 506,000 doses a week, we won't hit the 40 million doses needed for full vaccination Australia’s adult population until: early OCTOBER 2022


dd_throw_1234

It's not clear whether the petition is asking for AZ to be encouraged for under 50s or merely offered/allowed. If it's the second, then it may not be against ATAGI advice, which is that AZ can be offered to under 50s if Comirnaty is unavailable, the benefit of vaccination is likely to outweigh the risk, and there is informed consent. The first and the third conditions can easily be met currently for many young people, and the second is a bit harder to evaluate as I'm not aware of published criteria by ATAGI for how the risk/benefit should be calculated or by whom.


KESPAA

AZ is already offered to under 50s. I got it after the ATAGI advice for under 50s to get pfizer


Epicliberalman69

I like how the date for the current pace argument always gets closer, I remember it being 2023-2024.


chrisjbillington

"at the current pace the current pace is increasing, the current pace will be the whole population per day by 2025!"


thewavefixation

There are plenty of younger people being vaccinated but I understand you point. They work in jobs that puts them at risk of becoming spreaders or are immediate family of people who do. In reality - until we have a bit more supply there is a lack of doses for everyone. One could make a point that younger people are more efficient spreaders but the health advice is what it is.


Draknurd

ATAGI still don’t recommend AZ for under 50 and vaccine centres are very reluctant to give it to them. AZ is obviously in greater supply, but it’s a case of water water everywhere and not a drop to drink. Keeping the groupings by age makes sense if the aim of our suppression strategy is to protect the health system. Severe disease is [significantly higher](https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/investigations-discovery/hospitalization-death-by-age.html) for over-40s than even over-30s. Either ATAGI needs to change their guidance on AZ, or we get more Pfizer.


thewavefixation

yeah if we had covid running rampant they would definitely change the advice because the risk profile would change. It is a chicken and egg problem. The policy is in place and that drives the ridiculous risk profile.


plazmafire

> It is a chicken and egg problem. I never understood this reference/question. The egg came first. It was laid by something that was almost, but not quite, the same as the chicken that followed. I mean that's how evolution works. It's been understood for quite some time now.


Danvan90

Hahahahahahaha I have that same pedantic argument every time. It's clear. The egg came first, no question about it. It was laid by some oviparous creature that was very nearly but not quite a chicken (a junglefowl to be exact.)


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thewavefixation

we are singing from the same sheet but the nattering nabobs of vaccine negativety won't listen to the music.


TheNumberOneRat

It's far from certain that the Victorian surge is sustainable over a long period. If Australia doses at a faster rate than Pfizer's enter the country, then that's a big issue.


Jeff4768

I’m not even 20 and I’ve got my first shot last Tuesday, got 15 days from today until I’m fully vaccinated


ufhek

How many young people want AZ? I know everyone on Reddit says they want a AZ but I have a feeling it would be very few in the real world.


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ufhek

I know most people on Reddit want it. I was talking about the real world.


Jcit878

not even most people on reddit, but it is a popular view in this sub


reignfx

I think it’s a lot of chest thumping and empty proclamations even on Reddit tbh, when jt comes to the AZ vax.


werdnum

One data point: I'm 30, and like many, if you gave me a choice of AZ today or Pfizer today, I'd take Pfizer. But if you gave me a choice of AZ today or Pfizer in September, I'd take AZ. Even if I don't agree with it, we'd be better off with an AZ-hesitant over 50 getting Pfizer and me getting AZ if they otherwise wouldn't be vaccinated. But that's more of a bonus.


WazWaz

Even if that made absolutely no difference to border closures or lockdowns? I understand the "get vaccinated now and let's all move on" attitude, and it would be great if that was the stated plan, and I too would be on board. But it's not the plan (is there one?), so I totally understand why some people are perfectly happy to wait for whatever vaccine they imagine is best for them. What do you see as your reasons to get vaccinated now rather than later?


werdnum

Yup. I lived in NYC last April. Anything I can get will ease my mind. And yes, in a small way, contribute towards ending lockdowns and border closures.


WazWaz

If everyone had had your NYC experience, there'd be riots at clinics by now with our dawdling supply. Hold tight, you'll be fine.


Ararat00

I'm as keen as the next CVDU reader to get jabbed, but personally I'd still wait for Pfizer as an under 50 y/o considering we're meant to get vastly improved supplies at the back end of the year.


xFallow

I’d get it


ufhek

Is everyone commenting on this missing my (apart from redditors comment)


xFallow

I also exist in the real world if you’d believe it


WazWaz

No, no, **I'm** a real person, everyone **else** is a typical Redditor. /s


newausaccount

For me it would depend on more data about it's strength against variants and whether it prevents be from getting Pfizer at a later date. I'm not worried about blood clots.


sostopher

I sought out AZ and insisted on getting it (before the Victoria outbreak where many vax centres were empty). I'm in my late 20s. There's many of my friends and colleagues in the 20s-30s range that wanted it, but then the outbreak happened and so that changed demand. A few also got it and were not eligible.


ufhek

I suspect you and your friends are in the minority.


sostopher

Huge minority? What?


funkybandit

Ive had Astra and im in the age bracket they dont recommend for. Besides feeling off for a few days it was fine


werdnum

Also, Redditors are real people in the real world. Yes, Reddit in general and this sub in particular is a skewed demographic. But we're not /that/ unusual.


L-Z-1

Young people (16+) can get the vaccine (Pfizer or AZ, whatever you like) here on the Gold Coast at select locations just be walking in (you can register if you like though). This is official QLD govt policy. The Gold Coast University Hospital, for instance, is open 7:30am to 9pm for vaccinations for anyone of any age group. All you need is your driver's license and medicare card So if you want it, at least in QLD, it's not really very hard to get at all.


Snoo-10033

I’ll get downvotes for this but that’s what I’m doing Got the link for Homebush hub even though I’m under 40 and will turn up to get my jab. Fuck those that don’t want it.


doubleunplussed

AZ I hope


Snoo-10033

Well I am under 40 so can get Pfizer.


doubleunplussed

> Fuck those that don’t want it. Then this is a shitty attitude. There is incredibly high demand for Pfizer, you're jumping ahead of those who certainly do want it. Edit: unless you typod can/cant


ufhek

People don't not want Pfizer though. There tons of demand for it. It's AZ that people don't want. You're not using a wasted vaccine.


MaxKowalski

I'm eligible, I want it, but I am incapable of making the trip to Homebush which is 300km away. I imagine I am listed statistically as someone who doesn't want it.


gotnomiddlename

The figures on the petition are way off- we are vaccinating twice as fast as that, and rising; and we are close to 6 million doses so far, not 3. I assume it’s a couple of months old but should be updated.


Formal_Slide6445

We destroyed our way of life so that 80 year olds could live a couple more years. If they don't get the vaccine that's on them.


werdnum

This is a tired and incorrect meme. Even if you accept that COVID is mostly risky to the elderly, what scared the bejesus out of people was not just the deaths, but the overwhelming of the healthcare system. This is a virus that brought some of the best-resourced medical systems in the world to their knees.


yandere_chan317

Exactly! We sacrificed our school, career, social lives, happiness for them, and now we are being delayed of our vaccines because they wouldn’t take it when it’s their turn. Watch them open up the country the moment all the important people (aka not us) get vaccinated and this time we will be told our health isn’t as important as the economy.


privatly

Is it appropriate to try and guide medical policy with a petition?


emorynat20

I'm 31, not in a priority group and got my booking link already. All I did was sign up [here](https://www.vaccinebookings.health.qld.gov.au/registerforvaccination/?fbclid=IwAR0DtyPYcUoakdBlf2SFrHLty6xT-bzVdk2nST0vUu4G8MdW0Go_0Mi4udU) (for QLD). Might be able to do the same thing in other states?


abc_letsgo

Tried to get it at the start of the year, they told me to come back at the end of the year like wtf?


elopinggekkos

Totally agree. I and about 40 (colleagues and friends) all over 50 have had AZ except for two that are annoying, one AV and one hesitant. They had their chance, open to it to everybody.


BlakeDragon

I agree, let whoever wants AstraZeneca have it. It will be interesting to see how many side affects come from under 40s. I reckon side effects be same regardless of age. I'm waiting for Pfizer.


pygmy

>I'm waiting for Pfizer The odds of anything going wrong are absolutely minute, and treating the *extremely* rare cases is understood well. I don't get it.


BlakeDragon

It's an individual thought & concern that no vaccination should ever have a side affect of death. Many may not be concerned but I am. Big Time.


bokbik

We should of got sinovac for people not wanting a fist choice vaccine


bokbik

It's like we all forgot about lockdowns and all the crazy shit happening. Yeah I would waste a solid weekend if it meant I could get a jab. Small price to pay so we can get out of this. Oh but not az. Mom forbid me to get it.


Venomous3005

The whole damn reason for the lockdowns has been to protect old people and now they are keeping us stuck in restrictions. Honestly screw them


ufhek

They just don't want to take AZ. There may be some who are totally anti Vax, but I bet most aren't.


yandere_chan317

Exactly! We sacrificed our school, career, social lives, happiness for them, and now we are being delayed of our vaccines because they wouldn’t take it when it’s their turn. Watch them open up the country the moment all the important people (aka not us) get vaccinated and this time we will be told our health isn’t as important as the economy.


AuLex456

Australia literally has more AstraZeneca deaths for her demographic than covid-19 deaths for the entire pandemic todate.


PhysicalCountry

What are you talking about. There’s been 2 deaths from AZ and 910 deaths from Covid in Australia. In any event, those 2 women were 48 and 52, not “young people”.


AuLex456

for the entire pandemic in Australia there are zero covid19 deaths for females aged 18-49. Sarah Moran appears to be a 36 yr old female, so is within that demographic. https://www.health.gov.au/resources/collections/coronavirus-covid-19-at-a-glance-infographic-collection


PhysicalCountry

So 1 woman from the 18-49 demographic has died from AZ, compared to 0 from that demographic from Covid. Do you genuinely think that’s statistically relevant enough to make your point? What about the 3 men in that demographic that died from Covid, compared to none from AZ? Or do you not care about that because it doesn’t fit your fear mongering agenda.


allongur

Oh the cherry-picking needed to make AZ seem like a death sentence... I'm in my 30s and would go get AZ if I could.


werdnum

That's true. The risk either way is miniscule, far less risky than, say, going on a road trip. So why not let under 50s make their own decisions?


Iemnobody

I think that's the main point. It's fine to advise against it based on current risk but ultimately it should be the individuals decision after weighing it up themselves.


saidsatan

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