T O P

Venezuela

Venezuela

Emmgel

One thing about capitalism - no one needs to build walls to stop people from leaving


inocuosity

..."chronic fuel shortage" in an OPEC country... If socialists ran the Sahara we'd run out of sand.


PenIsMightier69

He killed the goose that laid the golden eggs to quickly get a few more eggs. Now they are realizing that nationalizing most of their economy was probably not the best idea. Socialism destroyed their economic engine. They'll have to start again from scratch after they someday get rid of socialism.


daybreakin

Then John Oliver rationalizes it as "mismanagement" not socialism that caused the downfall and that's the argument all the other internet socialists parrot. That video has tens of millions of views. Like yeah that's the whole point, capitalism works because it efficiently manages an economy whereas socialism doesn't. They're so naive. Then ironically they'll make fun of the invisible hand adage. So what does that mean? They'll never learn their lesson and we're going to see this repeat again and again.


Forward-Transition-5

There’s always the next person in line to say “well they didn’t do it right, I will”. So it’s a never ending cycle.


daybreakin

yeah they dont see how trusting to concentrate most of the economy in one point of failure is systematically going to fail.


JGrizz0011

It can never be done right because it is managed economy. (I know everyone here knows this.) Whereas capitalism is not managed at all, there are just rules to play by and the thousands of decisions that people make every minute decide how things go and who gets rich. A managed economy can never keep up with that.


Forward-Transition-5

Obviously we’re on the same page with this issue. I just had a thought though and I’m curious of someone else’s take on this. I support capitalism overall but with capitalism we need systems of governing in place to keep the biggest players from taking over everything. Do you think that at some point it’s also doomed to fail simply because the evolution is a non stop attempt to find a new way to get around the system and eventually it overruns said system? Could it be that capitalism leads to a similar end only it takes longer? I’m not sure if anyone has looked into this or if we’ve had enough information from capitalist based societies to see how they turn out in the end. It may be harder to study since capitalist societies have gone about business in varying ways while socialist or communist systems tend to be very similar in the basics. Just a thought I’m wondering about.


JGrizz0011

I've actually been wondering the same lately. What is in end result of this constant pursuit of growth? And businesses by their nature will do what is best for them and not society at large. Left unconstrained, as we are doing, there is probably a point where capitalism, as it is currently constructed, is no longer the best system. Automation will also be a factor in exposing weaknesses. I'm coming to believe we in the US will need to transition to a more Nordic style capitalism with higher taxes and more social safety nets.


Dogethedogger

That doesn’t make much sense since raising taxes doesn’t actually provide that much extra income since the top 10% of Americans already pay 60% of the federal taxes. Do United States with its population could not support the social net programs that Nordic countries do like universal healthcare or education with 350 million people that is literally not even financially feasible unless you’re going to degrade the quality to a point that it’s worse for everyone. United States does not have an economic issue it has a social issue deciding on how to use the best economic model they have. Capitalism will not overrun but politicized capitalism will, The people in the government decide how the capitalism games played and depending on who change the rules for why and how long will decide whether anything over steps now or in the future


Professional_Ninja7

Whats really funny about the mismanagement argument is that a good system needs minimal management. If your economy crumbles because a few people made bad decisions then that is still proving our point. In reality though it's the same problem but with guaranteed mismanagement.


LearningEle

I believe it's quite an interesting discussion, when we look at the results of socialism and capitalism in their late stages. There are plenty of examples to point to in regards to failed socialist states, and to some degree Oliver's analysis that the failures were largely due to mismanagement has merit. At this point it seems inevitable that when one single group controls every aspect in an economy that it will fail due to the intrinsic nature that power corrupts, leading us to believe that systemic socialism is a flawed system, even though it has also proved useful for pushing society forward when used with localized focus. As for capitalism, we're just now reaching the end game. Individuals are starting to outstrip the systems built to contain them. Even worse, corporations have flourished to the point that is unfeasible to reign in their power. Look at a list of the top billionaires by year, and look how rapidly the people at the top are accumulating wealth. While Bezos was the world's first centi-billionaire, he's added over 100 billion dollars to his fortune since 2016(45.2 to 177 billion in 2021). Since we are in a global market, I don't think there is any way for us to stop the world's money from coalescing around these individuals, and I think it's very possible we could see the first trillionaire in our lifetimes. Of course the vast majority of that wealth is not liquid money, so Bezos probably can't go out and buy tanks and jets and conquer small countries, but even as he is now he can wield profound impact over our financial institutions and even government. As he is now, he would be the 73rd richest country in the world, but he would jump up to the mid 30's were he to hit a trillion(in terms of total wealth). For reference the United States, sitting firmly in the number 1 position, only has about 126.5 trillion dollars in total wealth. Is that not a little bit scary? In a world where conventional warfare between the countries that actually matter on the global stage is impossible, the super rich that we have cultivated in our capitalist utopia could very well become global kingmakers. I'm not an economist or anything, so this is all just speculation from looking at numbers, and sure inflation is real, but the rate that the mega wealthy are increasing their share of the pie is undeniable. Can we even break up Amazon at this point?


daybreakin

The wealth accumulated by billionaires is trivial and a distraction in the grand scheme of things. If you were split up bezos wealth amongst the world population it would barely add to each person's wealth. Also that's the wealth he accumulated over many years and that distribution among the people would only happen once. Secondly, that's stock wealth, not literal cash so if you were to sell it the stock price would plummet. Thirdly you're making the fallacy that whilst billionaires get rich, that doesn't necessarily mean the lower class cant get rich as well,albeit at a slower rate. The Average standard of living for the average person has been generally increasing especially for developing countries like India who made strides to free their economy. Finally, insane taxes on the rich, corporations and breaking up of companies could have the potential of decreased economic output because of dead weight loss and reduced incentive to grow.


Heliolord

I think there's more of an issue that these particular individuals, through their wealth, gain a massive amount of power over various systems of govt to the point that they begin to mimic the problems of power concentration found in socialist governments. They become authoritarian, try to micromanage things through exerting their wealth and influence. They buy government officials to increase their power and, in turn, increase the govts power.


GOANJUDADDY76

Equality in Poverty no more Extreme, except for the Leaders they must have a little more so they can Lead.


ShinePDX

It is the equity the leftists are pushing for.


Honda_Driver_2015

socialist - they want everything you have...except your job.


milton_freeman

I was expecting thus to be more like how the Chinese Communist Party simple redefined Extreme Poverty to ‘reduce’ their on-paper poverty. Even worse — it’s up!


MikelDP

Hugo definitely smelled sulfur but it was coming from his own hands.


lelopes

Lula diz the same for Brazil. They rearranged the numbers so it would only be considered poor who was actually starving to death, not just starving, it needed to be starving to death. And there... Be gone poverty.


[deleted]

The Left sure does like to change definitions as they go.....


foot_slogger

But the system in Venezuela is working exactly as designed, and exactly as the socialists in USA want it to work here. Sure, they SAY that socialism will help poor people, but there is ample evidence that no socialist ever actually does anything helpful to poor people. Instead, the elite who manage things on behalf of poor people now get to justify the extreme wealth disparities on the grounds that they are helping, enjoy the satisfaction of being more important, better, more entitled than the proles, and traffic is great thanks to elites being the only one with a gasoline ration. If you envision yourself as the one handing out stuff in socialism, what's not to like? Socialists are people with a narcissistic disorder who would rather everyone be poor if it means they can be just a little richer than everyone else, rather than everyone be equally rich.


AcostaJA

I got a dream, it was Hugo Chávez come back and materialized in my bathroom, specifically as an piece of shit in my WC, then before blocking my nose due the smell, I just pushed the flush button and get rid of this disgrace.


kajarago

I don't know what the hell I just read, but I approve.


InspectionEvery5923

Communists, killing 6 out of every 1 person they actually intended to murder since 1918.


Jibrish

In before "vuvuzela" memes from the left.


TheBackTrackPodcast

This is your own post bro


Jibrish

> In before


icemichael-

authoritarians and statistics, name a better duo


[deleted]

[удалено]


SamInPajamas

How Biden acts around little girls?


ReyDraco82

Hehe, I don't know. The flag doesn't have that "this old creep is making my skin crawl" look on its face as they do in Biden's pics.


IndiaCompany-

I’ve got a picture of my grandfather hugging the US flag after he got home from the pacific theater in WW2. He hated commies and the Japanese till he died.


Lucal_gamer

Y como viene la mano argentina es el siguiente