Russia called. They want their tank back.
By - LandersOnTop
Russia called. They want their tank back.
Are these pro government, or anti government?
So are these the good guys or the bad guys?
They are generally pretty good in the context of the overall conflict since Somaliland is more stable than Somalia, but in this context they come off somewhat poorly since the local clan arguably has as much right to choose to be part of Somalia.
Depends on which government you're talking abt, long story short. 1960 Somaliland got independence from Britain, 5 days later Somalia got their independence from Italy, Somaliland offered to join together, Somalia agreed and then genocided Somaliland major clans (minor ones as well). Somaliland fought the regime and got their independence second time in 18 May 1991, Somaliland got the majority of the weapons of the previous government and started their own. They've been living in peace in the past 30+ years, but in 2022 an oil estimated abt 110 billion barrels have been found in SL, so Somalia is trying to create violence in Somaliland to regain the region and the oil too, they have been assassinating civilians in Eastern Somaliland which the majority clan is related to Daarood (the clan that runs Somalia too) so these guys are Somaliland army trying to bring back peace in the region. You're free to do your own research too, but ask everyone for source southern somalis are deceivers
Last time these videos got posted here it sent me down a rabbit hole to read up on this conflict.
Tl;dr for anyone who needs context. The irony of a breakaway state (Somaliland) trying to subdue a breakaway state (SSC)
Firstly SSC doesn't exist. These regions can never be split either following Somaliland or Somalia constitution. So in reality it's a minority 7% of the population trying to claim 50% of the land. No wonder why their name Dhulbahante means "land grabber".
It's really a pity that Somalian irredentists use these people for their own goals. The general leading the army there is from the same town because he knows the alternative is anarchy or Majerteenia (Puntland).
They were fed fake history during the fascist dictatorship due to being a part of Barre's inner circle, the MOD alliance. Barre elevated his own clan and his inner circle because [this](https://twitter.com/thebhlub/status/1523033215459463168?t=IYY7DggwYG5xnNdNMkbTWw&s=19)
used to be their history. Even today they have to resort to [stealing](https://twitter.com/true0ptimist/status/1486119369482534913?t=5I_hN_zol_l3mQ6A7lukmw&s=19) and photoshop the history of noble Somalilanders and claim it as their own.
They were thaught they were freedom fighters fighting against colonialization. In fact they were active participants in British Somaliland, and their peers Warsangali signed the treaty in their place. The Dervish movement evolved into a terrorist movement that drove them to near extinction hadn't it been for the Isaaq, while those fleeing into neighboring Somalia Italiana were massacred by Majerteenia. A statue of the Mad Mullah is erected in Mogadishu. Another [example](https://twitter.com/ManlikeAK47/status/1641122868334411791?t=aSZnYCb9T7x05M0ceszT0w&s=19) of revisionist history: Ogaden concubine for Italians celebrated in Mogadishu.
Isaaq participated in the Dervish as well but do not celebrate what they know is a dark chapter in history.
Now the result evident with Lemkin institute [warning of a renewed genocide.](https://twitter.com/LemkinInstitute/status/1641063960085516290?t=wzCTxaq-_YtdmSItWVGQVQ&s=19) against the Isaaq in Somaliland due to irredentist movements like this.
No offense, but biased and historic propaganda from tribal societies is not really relevant to the morality of this conflict. I have read so much about "he said she said" and "this guy or that guy's grandpa was colonial collaborator" while trying to find objective information. Both sides are trying to humiliate each other by bringing up the colonization and domination by the British empire in your history. Whether SSC is legitimate or not will be proven by the result of this war. Just like Somaliland is technically an illegitimate and recognized state, but ultimate has a defacto existence by the gun.
What is undisputable is that this conflict started when Somaliland forces forces killed unarmed protestors and the 'real' power brokers of Somali society showed their face (tribal leaders and elders). Then Somaliland doubled down on trying to forcefully reinstate its territorial integrity, but the local Lasanod civilians took up arms and this war broke out. The army subsequently got forced out of the city and to my knowledge the Somalia flag now flies there. The Somaliland army is the unquestionably the aggressor here and not really at risk of another genocide. You can't shoot innocent people with live rounds and expect them to take it laying down.
I just thought that it is ironic that a breakaway state is complaining about a breakaway state. The pandora's box is open in Somalia
somaliland was not forced out of the city, they agreed to withdraw to goocajade military base on the edge of lascaanood to calm down protesting when it started and that’s where there’ve been at since. If you wanna call that forcing out of the city go ahead. If they could force us out they would’ve done so at goocajade which they’ve been trying for weeks with no avail. This would’ve been different if we never withdrew. Majority of police in lascaanood are people who live there so mainly dhulbahante clan so this false narrative that the majority clan (isaaq) is out to kill them is nothing but untrue. Also they act like life under Somalia police is any better. Somalia police have been killing people way longer then we have and they’ve killed way more people before we had this president it was basically under heard of somaliland police killing civilians and even now the only time civilians in somaliland get shot at is at protests where they start throwing rocks at police and they fire live bullets, (which I don’t agree with) it does not happen on a day to day occasion like Somalia, literally 2-3 days ago during Ramadan a Somalia police officer shot at a shop keeper for refusing to sell him cigarettes in Ramadan which there are vids of, that would never happen in somaliland. There was a two week period Somalia police killed 20 civilians. On multiple occasions just this year police in Somalia killed taxi drivers for not paying 1$ bribe. Also there INTELLIGENCE AGENCY literally attacked a MAYOR of a city and killed his guards a couple weeks ago and said whoops it was an ‘accident’. Somaliland police 100% need more riot control training and riot gear to deal with protesters that’s what sparked this all but there’s not much you can do when your underfunded and you give guns to people chewing khat getting high, 70% of our budget doesn’t come from donors like Somalia.
Hold on... how are you saying Somalia's police is worse when the Somali government is battling it out with Al Shabaab in southern part of the country. Maybe things changed, but Somalia's government does not even control the capital city, how would their police forces be in Lasanod? The other poster is also saying that they were previously policed by their own tribesmen.
Furthermore, agreeing to withdraw your forces for greater peace (after killing protesters) and then shelling the city you just left and then losing military bases in the periphery of the same city doesn't really add up.
Yeah, obviously I don't understand shat is being said in videos and I can't see the difference in the tribes by how they look, but I have seen propaganda go both ways. Somaliland is more numerous (90%+ of the population if the other user is to be believed). They are also currently fighting in the breakaway city/region's territory that belongs to the Lasanod tribesmen. I strongly doubt Somalilanders are at risk of genocide despite the rhetoric. Can't argue genocide in a war of aggression. I have also seen the rhetoric go both ways. Somaliland's government is calling everyone fighting for autonomy a terrorist and claiming Somalia, Ethiopia, China... and even my government (as if we aren't busy ourselves) is involved in the conspiracy against Somaliland. Not gonna lie, but it's hard to believe the Somalilander side of the story. Just reads to me like a tribal spat that threatens Somaliland's territorial integrity because gun diplomacy failed.
Also the tribal leaders have made it clear that they will try to take all other somaliland city’s if they succeed in lascaanood. Theres a vid of the main tribe leader literally saying he will kill our WOMEN AND CHILDREN, so please tell me how it’s not risk of another genocide.
Dude, Somaliland is fighting in the breakaway state's area. Somaliland is more powerful.
You want to take their land, they want to take your land. Unbelievable. So much death and destruction for what? You guys are clearly not ready to lead yourselves. The British should not have left or at least they should have let Ethiopia annex it. You guys make Ethiopia look prosperous and safe and that really says something.
Dude. You are forcefully trying to keep them in your British Somaliland when you yourself are angry about Somalia doing the same to you. That's some classic childish mentality and excuses.
British Somaliland was objectively better run by the BRITISH. What have you guys built since the British left? More people died, poverty has gotten worse, quality of life has dropped, literacy has gone down, industries have been erased and you are advocating for violence while you are probably inside rich country as refugee in Sweden or Canada. Instead of spending money on basic infrastructure you think it's a better idea to go kill another ethnicity to feel good. No electricity, no plumbing, no good fresh water access, but enough money to go to war. Extremely unimpressive and you know it. Hopeless situation, really.
I'm not going to pretend that I'm an expert on your history, but I suspect you aren't either because it's super easy to debunk your propaganda. I do enjoy it because it forces me to learn more about regions of the world people generally wouldn't know about.
The replies on the Twitter link you sent me counter just how dumb the statements if genocide risk is. How can you be at threat of a genocide if you are killing them and they are begging you to stop? That's like saying Ukraine wants to genocide us, or Israelis are being genocided by Palestinians. How idiotic and false is that?
Also just learnt that Somaliland committed its own genocide against an ethnic minority in their own borders before going into a Civil War and that there is high tensions due to the PM refusing to hold elections.
Human nature is so fascinating. Everyone wants to look down on someone, no matter how low they are. At the end of the day, results speak for themselves. You have the lowest HDI, one of the lowest GDP per capita, some of the worst literacy and unemployment rates. I know I am being a bit harsh, but unlike Taiwan you don't export anything of value and contribute very little to the world whether material or knowledge. It's just a line on the map shifting. Quite a pathetic country on your own. Better to evolve your mindset and join the upcoming East African Federation for global relevance and be better tomorrow instead of primitively squabbling about a barren piece of desert.
Its a pity that Somaliland nationalists have decided that only Somaliland should have autonomy.
As they have no T-62 in their inventory. Seems to be T-54 which looks very similar.
thanks for the info