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roseicecream

i like declutter videos and HLP, but it confused me a little at the end when she'd finished decluttering, had a collection of things she loves, and still wanted to get rid of even more. it felt like part of some sort of strange consumption game, where you have to cycle through things and get rid of them just for the sake of getting rid of them, so you can move back to the acquisition phase, even if you liked the things you got rid of


[deleted]

I felt that too! Her declutter was already pretty brutal, so that second phase was weird to me. I get checking for functional dupes (a concept she introduced to me btw) but she didn't even do that.


OdeeSS

I've caught myself in this cycle. You 100% called it. 😭


karester

But they weren't her *precious*! \*insert Gollum meme here\*


keewee89

Even though she said this was coming, I'm still in awe at how it's arrived. I didn't hate her "problem with declutter videos" video but I'll be damned if some kind of sizeable haul, I mean "self sponsored" purchase, follows this purge. The fact that she said she's now testing more makeup than she used to... Prepare yourselves for an influx of stuff justified by her trying to convince us she didn't really pay for it because it was bought with her channel's budget, and she doesn't really own it because it doesn't fall into the post declutter products which "bring her joy". It's not as if there isn't a wealth of other content she could make which wouldn't fuel her consumerism. I thought the monthly declutters and "purgatory collection" during her year of fewer things was as ridiculous as it could get. Wrong! *Edit: does anyone feel there's less transparency around how much makeup she owns now? I didn't expect her to have this many products to declutter. Maybe because I don't watch all her reviews but still. She used to pride herself on having a moderate collection*


ShesWhereWolf

>does anyone feel there's less transparency around how much makeup she owns now? I think it's partly an attempt to mislead. Hannah distinguishes personal and business (channel) purchases as if the latter isn't meant to be counted in the former. She makes that distinction (not saying other reviewers don't) a lot. But in her case, if she continues using said product personally and never gives it away after reviewing it, it's personal. The product is still *hers*. If it doesn't leave her person, she still owns all of that makeup, regardless of intended use.


divadream

I did see somewhere someone saying that during her no-buy July, she spent at least 1k on sweaters, 500 on a Chloe bag, basically designer shopping it up on IG but never discussing it on her YouTube


Fjerner

This reminds me of a friend of mine who comes from a wealthy family. Her new year‘s promise for 2022 was that she would go on a no-buy for the whole year with these rules: 1. She would only be allowed to buy essentials 2 she would have three get-out-of-jail cards to make non-essential purchases. 3. She is allowed to buy stocks. At some point, she was showing me a makeup and Ikea furniture haul and I asked how she bought it all because she had already used all of her get-out-of-jail-cards. She said that her boyfriend paid for it all so it didn’t count because she had not used her money for it 🤷🏼‍♀️


Halves_and_pieces

I have a friend who used to go on a no-buy during January and February every year. But then basically made it up for during the month of March. She’d hit Diamond Status at Ulta by the beginning of April. I never understood why she even did the no buy if she basically made up for it by going overboard as soon as she could.


two_lemons

Maybe it was just to make sure to be able to pay for holiday expenses? Like, she went a bit into debt those days and then once she was free of those expenses, she could buy all the makeup she wanted?


Halves_and_pieces

That’s a reasonable thought, but not why she did it. Her and her mom did it together just basically to do it.


two_lemons

Ok that's weird.


Minerva_Moon

While she didn't personally buy that month, her channel sure did. Her partner bought all the stuff. So basically she got a Christmas in July instead of a no-buy month.


keewee89

The channel budget thing is so funny especially now social media is her only source of income. Even if it wasn't, we could all use the same mental gymnastics to justify frivolous purchases. The money I earn from my job can be segmented into essential bills, non essential bills then disposable income. I don't see how her channel budget is much different to the rest of our disposable incomes.


[deleted]

her "self sponsored" reviews are weird! She says she has a budget for it but it's not every month that she posts those reviews. Even the ones during no buy July, she showed the haul but I don't really think she reviewed everything that Joe purchased for her. There was that face products face-off but that was it. And if I'm not mistaken, the haul video had at least three video ideas. also I don't really buy makeup anymore so I don't really know how much everything retails for. All that to say, I don't know/don't remember seeing what her budget actually is. What I do know is that youtubers with a similar taste in makeup with a budget of $100 or so don't seem to buy as many products as she does.


Minerva_Moon

Her budget has to be higher than that because of the Isamaya collection. Iirc, she bought the whole thing. So basically she has her YouTube channel to buy makeup. Good for her, but that's not why I enjoyed watching her and it seems like I'm not alone.


[deleted]

she (SORRY, "tHe ChAnNeL") is buying makeup "to review" but doesn't review or post about everything she bought for self-sponsored reviews. I watch everything, but her creative videos have always been my favorite ones! Too bad she's been making less and less of those.


keewee89

Same, the ones where she swatches what she has and her GWRMs are what I like best.


ShesWhereWolf

Agreed. I think Hannah's content is best when it's like a mix of her commentary and a creative prompt/activity (that's not just a review). I really enjoy her wet looking eyeshadow video! It was so unique.


keewee89

I don't think she's ever disclosed how much the budget was, just that she had one. Even during her year of fewer things when she was more transparent about the monetary value of things, she still didn't go into detail about it. I personally wouldn't judge her if it was something like $500 because like she herself said, it goes back into her work and generates income. Even if it didn't make her money, she can seemingly afford it. She hasn't totally lost me yet but if she wants to position herself as an influencer who reviews things so we the viewer don't have to, then she could at least be more explicit about taking requests for self sponsored reviews. It seems to be a mixture of products she buys based on comments and products she buys that she wants to try but without the guilt.


[deleted]

omg I don't really keep up with any youtubers on IG. I remember the sweater thing because she listed it as an exception on her no buy july intro video, but had no idea about the bag


Invidiana

So she’s a “tester” now…how very Morgan Turner of her.


CactusMoose

Honestly, I prefer Morgan to HLP's mental gymnastics. I think Morgan made a video once where she said that a certain % of what is made always goes back to buying more makeup. There is no distinction of what is for her "channel" and what is for "her." HLP is just a pure beauty YouTube now, I don't think there is an ounce of conscientious consumer left.


[deleted]

>does anyone feel there's less transparency around how much makeup she owns now? I didn't expect her to have this many products to declutter. Maybe because I don't watch all her reviews but still. I have been watching every video she's posted for at least one year and recognized most of the cheek products shown in this video (as in, recognized as products I've seen her using before). There were a few ones I didn't remember or really didn't see. And the elf one I think I saw in an older video.


keewee89

Ahh fair enough


dandylyon1

I don't understand declutters. I don't do them. Make-up is fine for YEARS. it doesn't make sense just to get rid of things, what if your preferences change?


CactusMoose

I think HLP declutters because it is the only way she can keep this pretence of being not like other beautubers. It allows her to continue to consume and still be able to semi-legitimately say that she is about not having so much.


ShesWhereWolf

I think people decluttering is just to clean and organize in general. Especially when you have an over abundance of products and/or want to make sure things aren't expired (like with clothes, you'll go through everything to make sure it's in good condition and still fits). I get what you're saying about the potential of preferences changing. But in those moments, that's when you keep like "just in case/maybe" items. And if someone tosses an item they may like eventually they just have to re buy it 🤷‍♀️


hygsi

In the case of gurus, they have so much already and they know they're gonna bring more in so they need space, also, it probably feels good to get rid of it, like when you're clearing up your desk or reorganize your room. It's also something that brings in views for them so it's a win on many levels


thelilpessimist

same.. i have blushes that are over 5 years old 😶


MoonlitSong

The reason I recently went back to watch beauty YouTube content was to see looks recreated with older released beauty items I got recently on sale. Including HLP videos on Pat McGrath motherships (Moonlit Seduction & Midnight Sun). I had stopped watching all beauty YouTube but the more I watch now, I just want to stop. Watching new releases does encourage more spending for me and when they say " What are you getting from this collection?" In the end. I have everything I need plus more now and I will not watch anymore unless they are older videos with ideas on looks...or videos titled worst rated makeup so I know I am not missing out!! 😂 Its interesting to see the shift in HLP videos. She sort of contributed to everyone's hyped Lisa Eldrige products love mania.


ipetzombies

I'm basically only interested in content that inspires me to love what I've got, and it's becoming a lot rarer. I really hope that part of the channel doesn't die. I know folks like reviews but I've got my collection to the perfect size for me and I'm not looking to add anything.


MoonlitSong

Yup, me too. Not all of us want the buy, declutter and buy again cycle. I refuse to declutter perfectly good makeup. I also sanitize some lipsticks with alcohol and put them away to avoid bacteria growth and I recently pulled them out and all the lipsticks still wear beautiful. Now HLP will buy more new makeup to replace the stuff she just decluttered. I get its her channel budget but I can't relate. 🤷‍♀️


ipetzombies

I'm holding out hope because her content regarding her old stuff is the best I've ever seen! It really scratches the "dig my fingers into shiny goo" itch for me! It's taken me such a long time to get my collection to a place I'm comfortable with. A few years ago I had an overpurchasing period and recently I had to throw away a few beautiful almost untouched high end products and I do not wanna feel that wasteful again! I've got it whittled to fit into a double sided travel makeup bag other than a few larger palettes, and I'm so pleased with that size!


CPUequalslotsofheat

Do you recommend Pat M's palettes? I'm thinking of purchasing one.


MoonlitSong

Caution: I ordered during her black Friday sale and my items arrived after two weeks but they messed up my order bad. I ordered the duo of two motherships but they put the wrong ones and left out other items 🤨! That is a major issue happening right now with other customers. Order with caution. I am still waiting to hear back from them. Prior to this order my first was Bronze seduction mothership it has great baked Astral shades that flip like duocrome. That was my top one for a while. I also have divine rose 2 and I like it. But my current fave is huetopian. I haven't tried moonlit seduction long enough but they are different to her other baked Astral shades. They sublime mothership is not my fave. Some Astral shades in there like the white ghost one is very dry and hurts my eyes. Overall, if you can get one with your favorite color story for less than $100, its worth trying out one at least. Since the pans are so big, it will last a long time and I have never hit pan on any. Some people do dislike her mattes so she is more known for her shimmers. But now I don't know if I will order from her site anymore because of these missing items issues that has never happened before.


CPUequalslotsofheat

Thank you for the helpful tips, and info. I am sorry to hear they messed up your order. It would be nice if they would send you a nice palette, as an apology gift for your trouble. If anything, I would purchase in store. I like to see things in person. 😊


MoonlitSong

Thanks and I buy from her site for the better deals but now I don't think its worth it. I doubt they will send me an apology gift (they don't respond for days) but Natasha Denona did offer a similar apology gift once when they had a huge issue on their black Friday sale a few years back. I still had to pay shipping for it..lol.


origamipapier1

I like a mix. I do want to see new products, but I don't want the constant removal of old for new.


EllenM28

Well yeah... the first video was in preparation for this where she was basically trying to argue that the problem with declutters is our (the viewers) mindset, we shouldn't go into it comparing our collection to someone who reviews beauty and that it's perfectly normal for them to get rid of so much stuff etc ... even though I like Hannah I thought this was poorly thought out and just a way to justify her wasteful habits.


keewee89

I think my main problem was her reluctance to accept that there is a blurred line between where she used to be, where we the viewers are and where fully fledged beauty gurus are. She acknowledged that beauty content led to her own over consumption - even as a smaller youtuber - but somehow expects us as viewers to be stronger minded than her and resist being influenced by her adding to said content which led her to buying too much, thus absolving her of any responsibility. I'm not saying she's to blame, if anything she's helped more people re-evaluate their spending but I don't like how she's suddenly drawn a line between us and her to justify what I expect will be an increase in the amount of makeup she acquires. Her chef analogy also didn't make much sense because there's nothing stopping anyone with an okay amount of disposable income (or access to credit) from buying more makeup than they need. It seems she just wants to indulge but not lose her status as a conscious youtuber, so she's putting the onus on us to act responsibly. Again, we're not babies so it's not up to HLP to make us act right but she also can't ignore how her content might go against what she thinks she stands for. It's like one day we were all in this together then suddenly she was just like: I'm in a different league, you're on your own now.


Away_She_Went

I like HLP too but when she put out that first video I just KNEW declutter videos were on the way. She needs to pull away from the buy less/consume less front of her channel because I don't think her channel reflects those values the same way as when she first started. Her branding of herself isn't working anymore :/ though I still like the chatter of her videos in the background while Im working


Savings_Signature_64

I mean, she literally said they were.


Opening-Ad-8861

sounds like I should go watch the video!


origamipapier1

I can guarantee, that I have more than her. I have a full Ikea dresser with makeup. I have about 100 at the very least of palettes, and that's with some of my eyeshadows in booklets similar to her. I seldom cleanup or declutter unless it's this: 1. Oil or Water-based products that are over a year and are smelling or looking odd. 2. Repeat but for eye products. These are the most dangerous. 3. Broken eyeshadows/blushes, powders that I have similar items to. ​ I don't see a need to constantly delete about 89% of your products, and leave only the expensive ones. Because that's what I have started to notice in her most frequent videos. And for the record, I have Pat Mcgrath, Natasha Denona, Viseart (their first expensive ones), Gucci, and Tom Ford. I have some thousands in makeup. And yet, it's hard for me to toss some products. Especially if I "loved them" she got rid of the majority of her Natasha Denona products, in favor of the "new shiny one". Issue with that is she'll keep doing these crazy declutters to continue to push that she's different. Not really, most do the same as her. Just not in front of the camera and with higher volumes of makeup and less erratic decluttering.


_michaelafay

I do like declutters. I won't lie. I have a lot of makeup and I do like to get rid of older things or sell/pass on something I've tried once and know it won't work for me. I find it really satisfying when people get rid of odds and ends so they're left with a collection they adore. However, I don't like the kind of declutters where they get rid of things, look at the remaining pile and then have to get rid of more. It seems a little counterproductive when they are actively saying they love everything that is left but then have to do a round 2 so their numbers are smaller. Like, why? Keep what you love and use it.


origamipapier1

Because she doesn't love makeup. What I've come to realize is that she loves the IDEA of playing with makeup. She doesn't love it personally, and her "my heart/head" are all her brain trying to justify her moves. When in reality it's just that she's completely unattached to it. How do I know this? My mother is the same way. She'll buy something worth 100 bucks and then throw it away because it fits wrong after just 2-3 uses. I used to be quite different. I became slightly like her when I gained 20 pounds and was never able to get back to the lower weight. But, it's much more justifiable with clothes than with makeup unless it grows stale.


QueerGlamateur

Ooof. I'm about halfway through it now. I like declutters but I like them for the thoughts on every product - I often find that hearing why someone likes something/uses or doesn't use something in relation to their full collection is helpful and interesting, sometimes more so than a review because it's about the object in use over time. But I think why they can rub folks the wrong way is that the waste is inevitable and large, and as someone who has given away makeup to friends if I realized it wasn't for me - no one has that many folks who will take and use the products they won't (and I think its fine to do, but the people in our lives who aren't makeup fanatics aren't the types who need/want many products to begin with.) My biggest issue with this and the last video is the blame on the viewer for not "understanding" the difference between an influencer and a private consumer. (1) most influencers are private consumers and not professional artists or formulators or brand owners, (2) influencers make money from new content because it encourages purchasing habits - otherwise why would brads pay for sponsored content and affiliate links if the content encouraged less spending, and (3) it uses this notion of "professionalism" as a justification for changed habits. As a viewer that largely likes HLP, I think the other challenge is that when your channel/brand is based around habits as a private consumer and your branding is around artful minimalism/thoughtful consumption/etc, shifting into talking about it as a straight-up job creates a disconnect. And I think HLP is, at best, trying to find ways to stop that disconnect - but I don't think it works because it just doesn't make sense. As a viewer, I'm not hating on her, I just don't know how I feel about her content and direction anymore. It's not unabashedly okay with consumption as an individual ideal, and it's not dedicated to reinventing influencer behaviors in favor of minimalist consumption. It's trying to be both maximalist and minimalist, curated and broad, making more money and encouraging less spending, and while contradictions are normal, it asks the viewer to see one thing and think another. Tl;Dr this isn't hate to HLP, she's not the only influencer doing this, but I think the channel is just an interesting case study as a beauty fan of what happens when these kinds of channels go from hobby or intellectual project to a full-time career.


pestercat

I don't watch her, but it sounds like she's the one with the issue, not her viewers. Her job now is to advertise products so that people buy more. She can try to spin this to herself any way she pleases, but it won't change the reality. She really can't say "buy these products" (even if she's not actively using the words "buy these products", it's not like she's getting PR because the brand just likes her channel) and "don't consume like I do" at the same time, that's inherently contradictory. She's not a chef, a chef isn't buying ingredients to shill them on Youtube. So it just sounds like she hasn't accepted the reality of her new job yet and is trying to put that on viewers.


pancaaaaaaakes

The mental gymnastics for all the justifications and rationalizations felt exhausting to me and that’s why I ultimately unsubscribed.


AtheistVeganWitch

You have articulated exactly what I have been thinking. So much rationalizing. She would be truer to her original purpose and her content would mean more to me if she had kept youtube as a hobby and had another job so that we could see still see how she interacts with beauty and spending issues.


Feistyf3line

Fully agree. I’m not a follower of hers but have watched a handful of videos. She always came across to me as minimalist minded and then i saw a video where she was setting up her vanity or something of the like and i was surprised by how much she has. If you watch kackie she calls her collection encyclopedia of knowledge because she truly just wants to test and know all formulas She doesn’t declutter often so unsure of what she actually keeps in the end whether for personal use or comparison sake. For HLP i think the disconnect for me is mentioning her channels budget. I did not watch the declutter problem video but came across it in my feed. To me this channel makeup and her personal collection are one in the same whether or not you are justifying it in your mind separately or not you’re still a consumer. If you are reviewing makeup id imagine it’s very hard to stay minimalist.


Frigid-Beezy

And with Kackie when she uses a product over and over and over again, I feel like it’s something she genuinely likes. Like the Tula sunscreen which has become my every day sunscreen. Or the Fleurtatious blush which has also become a staple in my makeup bag. Or with Amanda Z and the Vitamin Enriched Face Base. Products where they have sung the praises of for years - when you know they are using lots of products, it makes me feel better when they are comparing other things to those products. I know how that performs so when they say that something is more or less (fill in adjective…emollient, blendable, sheer, pigmented, easy to work with, agreeable with other formulas) I have a good sense of what to expect from that new product. Kackie’s mega swatchathon of products are some of my favorite of her content because it shows the nuances and helps me be much more conscious about my spending. I can pick the best of all of those for me based on what I want in terms of undertones and coverage and ease of use. Honestly I’m hoping Kackie does a lip gloss roundup because I would love to hear her compare a ton of different formulas. And a highlighter one would be awesome too. I absolutely love the milk bionic one she recommended.


two_lemons

>and as someone who has given away makeup to friends if I realized it wasn't for me - no one has that many folks who will take and use the products they won't I've wondered if the right step would be to donate them to a makeup school. Like, some products can be sanitized so they can practice and they'd have the opportunity to demonstrate and experiment in ways that could possibly destroy the products. Like how to repress eyeshadow and how it affects the performance, to purposely contaminate something for the students to dimension how bad it can get, how to mix and match different formulas ... That sort of thing.


athenafletcher

No one chooses to become a beauty guru/influencer/youtuber to help viewers spend and consume less—their entire job description is to push products on people, period. They are glorified salespeople. They’re in it for the money, fame, and PR lists so they can get stuff for free to convince *us* to buy. Youtubers like Hannah Louise Poston who use chef metaphors are lying to themselves about their purpose because it helps them sleep better at night and feel self-righteous, as if they are making meaningful contributions to the world.


divadream

Morgan Turner has said verbatim that she is helping 10s of thousands of people per day by purchasing makeup.


athenafletcher

A modern day Mother Teresa.


divadream

How small their world must become


two_lemons

She should start secretly baptising people and denying them analgesics to truly live up to Mother Teresa.


jersey_girl660

I don’t really watch her YouTube videos but I can say on TikTok her videos are extremely subpar and don’t help at all lol. But 10s of thousands per day 😅😅😅😅


Feistyf3line

She is another Michelle in the making. I’m not sure that I’ve ever watched her videos and thought oh that was helpful. I just think she uses that motto as an excuse to buy what she wants. Which at the end of the day is fine but also don’t say you’re keeping it for REF when I’ve never seen you come back to that product. 🤷🏻‍♀️


none_so_bile

...she what?? lmao, what video? I'm just very curious


divadream

She’s said similar sentiments to this many times this past year but the one she said this verbatim in was a few months ago, probably in either a declutter or collection tour


divadream

I still enjoy HLP’s usual content but the mental and verbal gymnastics she does to come across more NLOG and sophisticated and self-righteous is such a rollercoaster of whiplash sometimes EDIT: 3 false statements made in the first section of the video: 1. **"Each year, I become someone who appreciates, simplicity; someone who wants fewer, nicer things -- you know, even few and even nicer things"** Your makeup collection is 5x the size it was a few years ago. 2. **"I work in the beauty industry now."** You work in the social media industry as a YouTube content creator / influencer discussing/using makeup (and other "beautiful things"). 3. **"I did not spend my own money on this -- the channel spent money on this"** Since you are the sole owner of your business LLC, the money in this account is still *your own money* (regardless of any tax benefits that help *you*).


rightascensi0n

Her taste for luxury and cycles of consuming/decluttering give me anxiety like Michelle Wang does


divadream

Hannah caters to herself. Michele caters to brands.


veryveryquietly

They're not even close to the same magnitude.


VioletteKaur

I don't get it. She studied English, she should know how to stick together convincing logical sentences, but alas. The same with her chef analogy, that's the best she could come up with? Since she moved I hardly watched her (has nothing to do with the move, just happened). Idk, does she have an active social circle, does she go out of the house? Does she live in a bigger city or more rural? Girl belongs into a big city, where she can share with different types of folks and sees things.


midnightsiren182

Yeah I think it’s the mental leaps and weasel wording that is a big issue. She has to accept she’s not as conscious consumerism as she initially was going for with her channel.


amibingdtaned

"weasel wording" -- well said! I agree 100% Stop making me feel like you are trying to sell me snake oil. Just be honest about your anti-conservation lifestyle, own it. People respect honesty.


midnightsiren182

Also I actually work in the beauty industry and no you don’t need to buy this much product while making mental gymnastics for it. -_- Her shop her stash/rediscover old faves videos were always neat, dupe the vibes, etc are also ways to use what she has. Or if she’s going to buy clothes, what in her existing makeup stash would be inspired by the outfit. I do think a big part of it for her and other channels is because they don’t really focus on tutorials they lynchpin a lot of their content around newness so it’s going to be an oroubourus of spend.


mausii

This is the same issue I have with Kackie. They are so obsessive over their “uniqueness” it’s honestly so self centered and gross.


divadream

I honestly believe they are their own biggest fans. There's always this "aren't YOU excited to see what's been going on with ME? you must be dying to know what MY thoughts are!"


Chard-Weary

I will cotend that she also works in the beauty industry. I think it's important to remember that they are hired as part marketing strategies for products. Her experiences as a victim of beauty marketing probably informs her about how integral influencers are to selling consumer goods. They're independent contractors in cosmetics advertising.


divadream

I appreciate the logic behind that as it was the same counter in my head as well, but unless she's a product consultant working with brands behind the scenes or collaborates with a brand to release a product, she would be considered much more in the realm of journalism. Even an employee at Sephora really isn't considered working in the beauty industry - they are in retail/sales for the beauty industry. She works by interacting with the beauty industry and relies on it for her content, but Hannah herself is not *in* the beauty industry. (just my thought process but you easily could be correct!)


origamipapier1

Going to differ on this one, would you call someone that goes cruising to review cruises as someone that works in the cruise industry? I worked there, and we never called them such even if we gave them a free cabin, like we did to high-rollers in the casinos. Beauty industry specifies that you are on payroll with the beauty industry.


Chard-Weary

Does this person get free cruises and money from cruise companies to write reviews on them and feature them in reviews? Are several cruise companies at a time vying to be reviewed by this person? Does this person's reviews affect the number of people taking cruises? If so, yes this person works in the cruise industry even though some of the employees don't think it's right. Is Vogue part of the beauty industry? Their employees work for Conde Nast, but can anyone make a genuine argument that they are not part of the beauty industry or that the industry would exist without it? Makeup reviewers are doing the same work as publication beauty writers and editors.


origamipapier1

Yes, and yet cruise lines do not claim them to be cruise industry employees. They do not know the inside information, they are not working with a W-2 from the companies or directly through contracts with them. And this isn't "some" this is how they are defined by the legal and marketing departments. They do not represent the cruise industry, nor are they really working in it. They work for a magazine that in and of itself is the beauty industry. Vogue itself is a beauty magazine. Youtube is not a beauty platform. Now, there are some that DO already work in the industry. Have their own companies, and also have worked within it. That's a different monster. And that's ultimately the mission of about 99% of Youtubers.. to eventually own their own brand.


Chard-Weary

I was very specific in differentiating cruise line employees from people who work in the cruise industry. Conde Nast is a publishing company that owns Vogue and hires and pays its employees..They are not owned by Loreal yet but is paid by Loreal in exchange for coverage. Therefore Vogue works in the beauty industry. No sane argument can be made against that. Youtube reviewers are self-employed and do not work for Youtube. They have business relationships with both Youtube and beauty companies. Working on youtube gives them the title of content creators. But they are also independent contractors who work with makeup companies and therefore they work in the beauty industry


origamipapier1

Conde Nast publishes a magazine that is within the beauty industry or the fashion industry. They sell ad-space much the same way as a tv channel that is independent and has no affiliation toward the beauty industry does as well or the Good Morning America show with makeup or skincare segments. Youtubers work as entrepreneurs but are not truly independent contractors working hours within the industry. If you use your allegory then even normal individuals that have commission and call their friends and families to purchase work within the industry (since they acquire some form of compensation for it). Youtubers work with the beauty industry, but are independent insofar that they do not build a contract to actually make a product with said company. They are a commercial, an ad-space on a youtube channel. Their commissions are similar. For instance: Hannah Louise Poston does not work within the beauty industry she works alongside it as fashion and makeup blogger. However, if let's say Coty were to send her a contract to engage with her in a business agreement to create a tangible product and sell it then she bypasses to the beauty industry. Now she does work with the company and is creating a campaign with them/product and as such she is in it. The issue is that a larger number of BGs do eventually fall into that line. Most quite early on in their career. Examples within the fashion one: Karen Britchick. She was a fashion admirer, now that she's already done an Amazon line, she is in the industry. There is no doubt about it. She shifted to the industry.


Chard-Weary

I don't know why the feature for not getting updates on comments isn't working for me, but I'm really not interested in this.


origamipapier1

Reddit has it's moods with the setup. There are times it emails me, there are times when it doesn't same with notifications. Agreed, we will probably just go into circles with this. Best to drop it here.


Sweet-Ad-7261

As long as WE don’t take it upon ourselves to do so it’s fine. She’s a chef.


Heavenly_Ocean

She has definitely gone over to the consumerism encouraging side of YouTube. It’s interesting to watch her slide into it and use mental gymnastics such as, “Channel budget bought makeup isn’t mine”, to justify how much her collection has increased.


RowanRally

I really liked her year of less stuff series but I’m not clear on what her angle is now… she’s clearly not consuming less (and if anything - more), so what lesson should I take from this? It’s an incoherent mess. She doesn’t strike me as financially solvent either and I doubt her finances are really in order.


amibingdtaned

I agree. I'm going to guess that she has debt, due to her shopping addiction. It's like an alcoholic taking a full-time job as a bar tender. There's a disconnect. She might be setting herself-up to fail?


origamipapier1

Her finances are much more in order to most here. She's earning revenue from youtube and moved to a different state with less costs. She's also married so he does work and bring in his own salary. The issue is not her finances, it's that she has to change the audience to her channel. She started it toward the minimalistic/anti-consumeristic audience. Those do not want to change as she changes toward a new blend of marketing style. The issue is not her consuming more or less, it's the fact that she doesn't attach to any product. If she claims she likes something, and two months later she tosses it. Did she really like it?


RowanRally

No, her finances are exactly the issue. She touts that her consumerism is sustainable and responsible, and that I should buy into her philosophy. All I see though is a broke chick who lived in her friend’s living room because her dual income household couldn’t afford to live alone in LA. But somehow could afford all her luxury shit? It’s a really bad look and I simply don’t trust her, which is the essence of the problem. She’s making it very hard to trust her message so she’s unwatchable to me now. I don’t believe she’s solvent at all. Also, she moved to the DC area. I’m from there and that’s barely a lower COL.


origamipapier1

Going to give you a bit of perspective from someone that's already mid-thirties. California is one of the most expensive states, SECOND to New York if it hasn't already beat it. Los Angeles is one of the most expensive cities and counties in the country. In order for her to afford a house with her husband in LA they need to be earning at least upwards of 300k a year and the mortgage is extensively high. What degree does she have? What exact profession can she achieve with said degree? Hmm. She studied English Composition and poetry if I recall. You know, a friend of mine studied that too and the only job she could have was in a museum which doesn't pay a fraction of 100k to afford an apartment in Los Angeles. She had to move. Her average salary would have been maybe 50-60k if she went for into that field. And not everyone should go into careers that they hate just to live in LA in a nice apartment. DC is lower, and it has other components that make it lower as well. She may also live close to DC within that vicinity but in a state around it which is cheaper. What exactly do you want her to do? In all honesty, you want her to cancel her channel get what to you is a real job? Right? Because that's the only way she could afford an apartment with her husband and I mean a job as a Marketing Analyst or some "California elite" career. The 12k she spends on the channel, if she spends 1k a month would not have been ENOUGH to move into an apartment there in Los Angeles unless her husband makes quite a nice amount himself. Put it this way, I earn 110k a year, I'd have issues living in Los Angeles myself. I'd have to downgrade my life to essentially a studio there and I live in another metropolitan area in the US and I work in a STEM field. Fiscal responsibility is realizing that some cities are unattainable unless you are a Director and above. She did that with Covid. She moved in with a friend, and saved so she could MOVE. The bad look is that the cost of living in the US metropolitan areas is sky high and only the elite and/or the wealthy that earn 300k a year of salary can manage to live there. I have multiple friends, and the only ones that have been able to stay in California are those that work for Google or Apple as Tier 3 engineers. I wonder why they can stay... check those salaries out and maybe you'll get a perspective. Get down from your privilege for a second and analyze the cost of living and the average US salary in the US. Specifically LA. Do you say that bit to someone that travels to Europe every year? Even though an experience is what you take to the grave.... OF course you probably do, because to you what is important is having that big wonderful American white-picket fence ideology of a house, versus experiences. Each person views their life and their goals different. And you need to learn that as well. Furthermore, YOUTUBE is her business. She's investing, to acquire revenue and it has worked. She is over 50k followers now and she'll yield the return to her investment if she hasn't already.


RowanRally

I’m going to ignore your petty and condescending tone, and pretend like you didn’t at all miss the point: telling everyone that your finances are in order, that your acquisition of stuff doesn’t stand in the way of your priorities (you know, like a place to live that isn’t your friend’s dining room), and that you’re an example of intelligent money based decision making probably doesn’t make sense when you don’t even have a place to call your own. I’m not talking about owning, that’s hard enough anywhere these days. But if you’re going to call your luxury hobby responsible and ask me to believe in your message, you should at least give the impression that it’s true. She doesn’t. I think she’s completely out of touch with her own spending. I don’t care what she does with her channel but whatever it is it needs to have a more believable angle than the one she’s got. And as far as her earning, I don’t know what she actually makes and honestly, it doesn’t matter. She has an image problem. Also, you need to stop huffing that California smog and wake up to the fact that LA’s COL isn’t such an exclusive problem. Have you seen the rent and food prices in and around DC? $110K in that area is tight living if you want to live in a reasonable neighborhood. And again, she has an image problem. The reality isn’t all that relevant when your look is completely off.


origamipapier1

LA is is still more expensive than DC and other areas. Sorry but I work in an industry that has individuals that live in all states. We talk and I have LA and Seattle friends. Seattle is slightly different because they can offset their expenses with walking or using public transport. LA not as much (similar to southern cities like Miami where you are FORCED to get a car and have to spend 2k at least in yearly insurance). The issue is that you are judging her based on your own perspective of what you expect someone should do with their life. You want her to not live with friends, she lost her primary income and she lived in an expensive and quite expensive area. She decided what was best was to continue working on her job aka the youtube one. So my question is this: if this were a man that had a computer company which he was starting now and seeing an uptick in clients, just as his primary job fails. would you claim he's overspending in buying needs for that business? No, because that's a different job and you'd view that as an actual profession to your eyes. In youtube, you don't live off of making declutter videos and spending less videos. You don't. She wouldn't grow within the community, and she'd continue to harbor just maybe 30k followers. What she buys she is buying for the channel to review and to garner more followers of said products or that are curious about them. Which means that as she grows, the recoups all of her net losses. And she is doing so as she's growing. Pot calls kettle black with the condescending comment. When you stop with the mass exodus of people from LA toward other states which is a realistic situation, then tell me I've stopped smelling the smog. The causes to the LA situation are numeours and it's another topic and I'll disagree with GOP in vast amount of issues cause they live in their own bubble, but IT IS happening.


RowanRally

You’re spinning in circles. She decided that her space on YT is to educate on conscious consumerism. It worked for a while and she was quite enjoyable to watch, but then she succumbed to the BG trap of spending more and pushing more PR. Sure, her original angle has only so much content that she can make around it, and it may very well be unsustainable as a channel in the long run. But then her angle needs to change. She was buying luxurious clothes and makeup as she was couch surfing. Regardless of the COL, that’s some irresponsible bullshit. How does that make sense to you in the context of her original message to prioritize financial health?? If she wants to be seen in a more favorable light on this sub then she needs to refocus and rebrand - her consumerism ain’t conscious anymore. THAT is why her channel is so hard to watch - I, and others apparently, feel like she’s fleecing us. She’s not a chef, she’s a hobbyist. If her actions line up with her words we may not be here bashing her anymore. Also, you can stop with the cringy “if she were a man” bit because it’s not having the effect you think it’s having. No one is judging her because she’s a woman. She’s just being called out on her lies. I really don’t get why it’s so hard for you to accept that trust in her died when she stopped consuming consciously…. And kept on pushing conscious consumerism at the same time. You’re doing the same mental gymnastics she is.


divadream

Is this the debut of the new repeated phrase "My Precious"? It's said over 25 times so far and I'm 15 minutes.


Heavenly_Ocean

Did anybody get a count of how many times she said it? It feels very Gollum of her at this point.


AtheistVeganWitch

It's ok for her though because \*it's her job\* /s. She talks about working in the beauty industry so much and all the negatives... I think she would stick to her mission better if she went out and got a part-time job.


Invidiana

A part-time job? But she’s way too *refined* and *elite* for that! /s


origamipapier1

Youtube doesn't make you elite though. Let's go back on the topic rather than look for anything to counter her.


Invidiana

It’s called sarcasm.


keewee89

She's just such a victim to the big bad beauty guru world. She has no choice but to contribute to what makes the job bad.


origamipapier1

She doesn't need a part time job. If she's acquiring revenue from youtube. Youtube is a job.


AtheistVeganWitch

Noted, but I still think if she worked a different relatable job to us normal folk then her content would also be more relatable. I for one appreciated her content much more when she didn't rely on youtube for revenue and it was a hobby.


origamipapier1

That's not true. Working a normal job doesn't mean your own likes and tastes are normal. This is a perspective that folks have and it's actually a social push to get people to follow along to what is defined as a normal view. The relatable is her taste. Some people do not have the same tastes. That's okay, world isn't meant to be the same.


AtheistVeganWitch

If that is why you are viewing her content, sure. I started viewing her content for information on controlling your spending and curating your wants and desires.


origamipapier1

I view her content because I like some of what she has and she does have some things that are not from the main makeup companies. Do I relate to her professionally? No. I don't relate to the majority of youtube women, because most are not professionals that work in STEM related fields. The majority are married, don't work or if they do they come from different (Marketing) background, and they always have kids around my age. By 35, they already have at least 1 child. That's something I od not relate to, and probably never will. Since I don't want to bring a child up in a world this complicated by morons that want to regress us back to a Franco/Mussollini era. So their actual rl and what they do is something that I do not watch the content for. I watch beauty content, for the beauty aspect. Basically the aesthetic, and so do a large number. In her case, I watched it because she had a funky mix of both introducing new items but in a way curating them enough that she wasn't saying everything rocked. Nor does she jump around makeup all the time. In addition, she does her makeup rather realistically in some aspects, and has a signature look. She's not a makeup artist, and I don't watch her for that. I watch Lisa or others if I want that level of professionalism and variety in makeup. I watch her at times, not all the time though. Her videos are sometimes too long for my personal liking, her indirect flowery language is something that I can't listen to all the time. Sometimes I want a direct, eloquent review. This is probably why I sometimes prefer those beauty youtubers that have had Marketing and/or journalist background. However, make no mistake I may relate in some aspects but not all. And I don't want my youtubers to be cookie cutter images of what I am. If not, I just stick to myself. I mean for relating, I usually watch male and female videos about project management, product management, and how to improve your skillset. That's what truly relates to me on a day in and day out video. Everything else apart from my documentaries and political commentary videos is fluff. I don't need to have videos with only women that work in my field or that work. I don't want to live in a bubble with youtube videos, I don't want tribalism in youtube. I want to explore different people within youtube. If I like them, I follow and continue to watch. Watching youtubers that only relate to us, is a form a tribalism. It creates a bubble. While not as big of a deal in beauty, if this is how one is with the information they read and watch, this means you are curating only to what you "relate to" and closing yourself up from different perspectives. I watch youtubers that are culturally from France, from India, from Spain. In their own language with subtitles. Do I relate with them for being from said countries? Maybe, maybe Spain a bit since I don't need subtitles unless they go to fast, but we aren't the same background. My family is a mut, and has both African and both Indigenous ancestry. I still watch. If I go for relating, I'd have to go for a youtube that's hispanic, pale and transparent, unmarried at her 30s, STEM background or at least Process Designer, with no kids. First, not going to find it. Second, I'm not looking at youtube for myself. Youtubers are not my friends. So I don't do the rl screening for friends for youtubers. There is a difference.


Invidiana

Hypocrisy rides again.


two_lemons

Qui s'excuse s'accuse and all that.


Opening-Ad-8861

I don't know HLP but I'm def starting to get really fed up of 'decluttering', or I guess, cluttering. I watched another YTer I reg watch today who was decluttering make up from her workspace (has make up at home too) and the amount she got rid of was ridiculous. She was careful to say that she's not decluttering all of it cos its no good etc but basically because she can't get through it all. Obv some was expired/empty. But that seems crazy to me! I know all the BG's say well this is my job when doing declutters, but there are so many of them and everyone reviews the same things. Plus people have decided to do this, if that makes sense. I know part of the argument is it helps people not buy crap but I personally wouldn't be buying a fraction of that amount (I'm not saying it's all about me, really!). I also watched another of my fav YT'ers last night 'switch' her products around, I hadn't realised but she has 3 large sets of Alex drawers full of make up! I was honestly taken aback. Neither of these people are MUA's btw. I feel like maybe I'm being a bit unfair? Any thoughts? The it's my job thing winds me up a bit tbh.


gilded_lady

Its fair. Do BG have to test new things? Sure. So they need to buy *every* blush shade to test for review? Heck no, especially when they seem to use one shade to review and generalize it to other shades then just swatch the others. The only one I give that pass to is Temptalia since she actually does.


origamipapier1

They usually don't buy all the shades, but they receive all the shades.


nottheredbaron123

Yes, the thing with the “my job is doing a service and helping people buy less” is that it’s not accurate. I’m sure if they tallied it up, at the end of the day, they encourage more consumption than not. I enjoy watching HLP and some others, but their mental gymnastics make me roll my eyes a lot.


cjampingon

Agreed, and all we have to do is follow the money: If they were truly helping people buy less, companies wouldn't be paying them. 🤷🏼‍♀️


GlitteringHeart2929

Large declutters don’t bother me and large collections don’t bother me - everyone has their own comfort levels and desired levels of consumption. However, a consistent cycle of haul, test, declutter will have me hitting unsubscribe so fast! It’s one thing to give in and buy more than you should, cull the collection to a reasonable size and change your spending habits. It’s completely another to stay in the same cycle year after year. BG have control over PR they will accept so using the excuse that you’re getting a lot more PR or that PR is just so overwhelming is a cop out and a crap excuse. I tried to watch HLP last video about declutters and couldn’t get through it. My husband was in the room with me and was losing his mind too. 😆


origamipapier1

I think we have to view her as someone that is unaware of what she really wants from makeup. She doesn't get attached to it because she doesn't love makeup. She loves playing with it, just like kids do. It's the same as going into a closet and liking to dress up. Since that's what she likes, she's unattached to items. I could care less of her decluttering the PR because while you can control a percentage of it, there are brands that just send regardless without contract. So you always will get a percentage of products. But, she was getting rid of items she has bought and that people gave her. They have a bit more of a sentimental value. She doesn't quite feel it. I'm sure that the next haul she'll probably get rid of the Gucci. If she doesn't it's due to her husband or the fact that in this case, because it is "GUCCI" she'll stick with it.


lunaj1999

I don’t know, is the issue that they are getting rid of products or the fact that they are monetising the get-rid process?


Opening-Ad-8861

I honestly hadn't even thought about the fact they are monetising the get rid process! It was more about the excess and waste, for me anyway


CactusMoose

Also, think of how absolutely mind boggling that is. They are actually getting other people to buy stuff in the process of them getting rid of stuff.


Sweet-Ad-7261

Not being unfair I wouldn’t say. It’s TERRIBLE for the planet.


origamipapier1

It is their job and I accept that they have to declutter. What I did not like about Hannah wasn't that she was decluttering but what she was. There were items she declutted that in previous reviews she really liked or claimed to have loved. She also deleted some items that to her were holy grails. (And left several palettes that have the same color stories in all of them). And rather than learn to be open minded about products, she sticks more to what she knows. And I get it, I do this too at work, but I make a separation between work and life. I wear my crazy colored eyeshadows (with subtle lips) on weekends. Or use them as eyeliners. And as a youtuber, I kind of expect a bit more open-mindedness about products. Because this means that ultimately she's going to go in circles and circles with products and keep going for the same thing. Like me and green eyeshadows lol!


Lili666999

It's always interesting to read this sub's perception of HLP... it seems like she really convinced people she is "on your side, trying to spend less, trying to curate, mindful, picky, bla bla bla...". Let's just look at what her content really is: **products**. Talk about them. Promote them. Sell them to your audience (even if she goes on for 30 min about what a bad decision that purchase would be, she will also always give you numerous reasons why the product is amazing in order to spark your desire, but in a VERY shrewd, subliminal way). What does a good influencer make? 2 things. Trust and likability. HLP is just like any other shiller, but her approach to win her audience's trust is a bit more "sophisticated". Let's analyze.... **Phase one:** become relatable as much as possible, especially with the crowd that has been collecting makeup for the past decade and is literally drowning in it. Those who can't control their spending habits, need to do low/no buys, project pans etc (side note: if you can't curb your spending... stop watching influencers, ALL of them). **Phase two:** Make sure you emphasise your highly sophisticated taste and perception of "beautiful objects". You know what is "worth" the money, space and time. Your reviews are thorough, intelligent, "honest", multifaceted ... you are the best reviewer and you repeatedly have to make sure your audience is convinced in that. Tati was building her trust on "I can't be bought" (which we now hopefully all know was a big fat lie lol)... HLP is far more cunning than that. **Phase three:** Lead your audience to the point, where they feel "empowered", because you shared all your "anti-consumeristic" and product "knowledge" wisdom with them. Brands won't scam them anymore! They won't trick us into buying more stuff we don't need with money we don't have! **Phase four:** Now is the time for the secret sauce - emotions. This is where HLP shines brighter than most other influencers. The subliminal triggers. "Treat yourself", "You deserve only the best", "Your collection is gonna be much smaller, but oh so much better", "Think of all the joy it will bring you"... She is trying to get you to buy more stuff. She is advertising. Links in the description 😉


[deleted]

the big one is that saying: just buy the thing you want instead of searching for a dupe. I'm not even sure she was the one who said that, but I've seen several youtubers talk like this. and while I agree with that sometimes, what usually happens is: you buy what you want and then immediately start wanting something else. my shopping habits are still questionable and I spent a lot of money on drugstore makeup trying to "dupe" higher end products: for sure spent more than $50 in neutrals palettes trying to dupe UD's OG naked 10 years ago lol. but I'm sure I'd be unsatisfied AF with the OG Naked since urban decay's formula is not that great... so yeah, i'd probably still be searching because that's the kind of culture capitalism promotes


HumblePerception3647

You can limit the PR you receive. It is not without your approval . It may be no for a year, or just particular brands. She does not say no, so what do u expect?


montaraymattei

Yeah, in the problem with declutters video she was incredibly clear she had a big declutter series coming up and didn't say declutter videos are all around bad, just to have perspective on why people who make a living at beauty content vs people who don't are going to have different collections for different reasons, and will go about curating them differently.


sunnylajf

This is actually funny 😂


SomeKindoflove27

That’s so her


Fractal_Tomato

She literally did "The problem with declutters" to explain her perspective on being a beauty influencer and as a viewer. Let’s accept that she’s moved on from her previous brand. I don’t think there’s a need to drag her for doing this, it was literally just a lengthy setup to start a declutter series. What is she even supposed to do with the sheer amount of product she owns due to her job? Hoard?


Minerva_Moon

She could have just did the declutter series without the first video. People have a problem with the first video. Many people enjoy watching declutters but telling them how they should feel right as you start doing one is a bit arrogant.


[deleted]

>She could have just did the declutter series without the first video. or even posting that first video, but with a less clickbait, more nuanced title


Personal_Scallion_13

Also, there are so many communities that collect things as hobbies. The beauty community is the only one that I see eating itself alive in trying to bash people for collecting.


ipetzombies

Not really on topic, but I feel like this is true, but not quite an accurate comparison. Most things people collect *aren't* consumable products like makeup. I have other hobbies for sure, but the supplies aren't things that I need to worry about going bad. I like to paint and do crafts, but no matter how long it takes me to use them, my pencils and watercolors will never go bad and be wasted. Whereas I just recently had to chuck some barely used, quite expensive makeup because it'd gone off, due to an over purchasing era I had a few years ago. Not a good feeling at all knowing that I'd not only wasted my own money, but resources as well. I think it's especially important to be mindful of our purchasing habits when it comes to items that expire. I think beauty gets the brunt of that because it's the most popular hobby that requires consumable items. Although there's probably something to be said about beauty being a historically female community and society in general being much harsher on those.


Personal_Scallion_13

But who cares if it expires, or goes bad before use? Are collectors of other items using those things? Is it just about resale value? I just can’t imagine caring this much about what someone else spends their own money on to make them happy


origamipapier1

Not necessarily the case, I do see a large number of vitriol in other communities that tend to revolve around things women collect. And that's one of my own pet peeves with this. Not all makeup expires at the same time that you think. My mother had eyeshadows from Jordache that were from the 80s for two or three decades and they were actually painting much more than the newer ones. They were the first multichromes she ever had. The issue is that people do tend to dislike seeing others collect, for other reasons. One is seeing too much money splurged, women in that sense are much more into that ideology than men. And in some instances there is a bit of jealousy. Society is much harsher on women, but unfortunately women do often follow along with society and don't take a second to be self-aware that they are doing the same bickering that we've been claimed to do. It's why I seldom actually talk agaisnt a female blogger and I don't quite hate HLP. I just do think her declutter videos were too much. She didn't need to do several rounds to delete her items. She could have also worded things better. I saw palettes that she claimed were holy grails until just yesterday axed. And while people change, you don't change THAT fast.


jersey_girl660

The hello kitty things I collect don’t expire. Makeup does. Also usually makeup collections tend to be a bit bigger then the average collector of other things.


origamipapier1

But someone will state that you are wasting money on your hello kitty things.


Personal_Scallion_13

That’s what I don’t understand. Do people want her to hoard things she doesn’t want to use? Waste space where otherwise she wouldn’t have to? Let’s be honest: most of us beauty enthusiasts are just never going to be able to get through our collections before they expire. I’d rather give stuff away I know would be enjoyed than just let it sit there and rot.


ShesWhereWolf

It seems like a lot of people just have a problem with HLP saying one thing and then doing another. And instead of just saying that she's changed her mind about something, it's like she's trying to convince her audience of something that's not happening. I guess people just don't respond well to that because it seems disingenuous.


origamipapier1

It's not about her decluttering, it is WHAT she declutters and the inconsistency in her own frame of thought or spoken words. She liked products, raves about them and calls them holy grail and a week later she declutters. Speaking from the point of view of someone that analyzes if a youtuber actually likes a product, does it feel like she actually does? You can change your mind over years, NOT within a year or a few months. That's usually very quick and most people do not change their mindset overnight. She also does multiple layers of decluttering. This is beyond Mari Kondo. She's sitting down and makes a cut. She then comes in and goes, no I want to cut more. By the way, that is a form of a high. Decluttering is a high. I've done it with clothes in the past so I see that pattern. She can do whatever she wants, but as she changes from someone that she was 2 years ago to something else she will loose some fans. Especially if she only gears her inventory to higher end brands. Quality does not always mean higher end.


quimichpatlan

I just personally don't vibe with her content, I think I have seen about 10 videos total, but I also don't care about every time she farts and I have no desire to wag my finger at her when she does.