T O P
benny332

The picture in the article reminds me of the two mortgage brokers in The Big Short...


GengisKwaan

Essentially the riding the same wave


Knoaf

Exactly where my mind went.


carmooch

I'm calling it the "agent fallacy". When the market is hot, it's because they are "hard workers" and "talented negotiators". But when the market is shit, it's "not their fault" and "there's nothing they can do".


Gman777

So so true. Just like politicians- they take all responsibility when things go well, none at all when things go bad.


[deleted]

I like the story of the helicopter pilot who goes out in stormy weather to rescue someone drowning in the ocean. If he succeeds he's a hero, if he crashes and burns he was a reckless idiot.


Gman777

In that story, it takes balls either way. RE are just leeches that add no value.


Basherballgod

Agent here. That is accurate. When the market is hot, we say we are an agent extraordinaire , and when it is down, it is the market.


Ds685

I get it, I've worked in sales too. You want to celebrate the wins and make the large winners into gods making others think they need to work harder and earn more. It's a part of the game. What I don't get is how shit some realtors can be. We had one who tried to flogg an illegal subdivision promising us it wouldn't matter because we would sell the place for 100% profit in 10 years... Some are great, just stuck selling shit property. I felt sorry for one of your colleagues when he bravely put on a straight face and said "*not having bathroom doors is how they design apparments these days, it's the latest trend*" fully knowing we could all see the toilet from the balcony through glass doors.


Basherballgod

Definitely agree there are shit agents. At least I know the majority of them are gone within 2 years. some somehow manage to sneak through, but you can only go on so long before being caught out. And fucking developers and the doorless ensuites. No one ducking wants them, and they are immediately installed when bought. I love my partner, but I don’t want her being able to see me poop.


montdidier

This is Australia. We poo or sh$&. There is no cute silent p at the end.


Basherballgod

The p at the end of poop definitely isn’t silent


montdidier

I know. Just my sense of humour. I am just not a fan of all the imported American vernacular sneaking into Australian life.


Basherballgod

I didn’t realise poop was an American term


montdidier

I would have said it was more commonly used by Americans but that may well be changing if what I have said doesn’t resonate.


Snap111

Depends how you pronounce it. If you pronounce the double o as you would when sayin "hook" it sounds a bit more aussie.


Ds685

This shitty realtor is the director of a Woodard branch in Melbourne, someone bought one of the illegal subdivisions and then pulled out. The missing door was a funny one! Someone had taken a 2 bed, 2 living room apparment and made it into a 3 bed room, making what used to be the main bathroom into a doorless on-suite. What used to be a laundry nook was then made into the main bathroom. It was super strange. The new wall was built on top of the floor carpet and built in the middle of the balcony enterance. When you opened the glass doors to the balcony the slide door slid into the bedroom side. Also, you had to go out to the balcony to get to one of the other rooms. A family that was looking at it had one kid pretend sit on the toilet and the other on the balcony waving at each other laughing, while the parents glanced at each other, gathered their stuff and left. I had met the same realtor before and he is a nice guy, I felt sorry for him.


stewface3000

The best part about a cold market is the scammer bad agents start to find an new con


TerribleEntrepreneur

You should see the movie 99 homes. Australia hasn’t had a real recession in living memory for most. I wonder how many agents will turn into vultures on the other side of Australia does end up in a seriously bad situation.


stewface3000

I will check it out thanks, personally, I don't see a massive crash happening anytime soon. I just think rate rise have become the click bate because housing market crash stories are not working at the current time so it's all they got. I can't imagine RBA is just going to give us a out of the blue rate change without lots of warning


BNE_propertymanager

The talented ones shine in a shitty market, the hot market is full of newbies that think realestate is a get rich quick career


Ds685

So true, they are just the middle man who takes a cut of the sales price, that's all. Their job is to facilitate viewings of the property and check some legal stuff. They don't negotiate a higher sales price with the buyer, they just put an ad up online and the flocks assemble themselves to inspect and buy. Any realtor is a great realtor when there is a housing shortage.


upx

Privatise the gains, socialise the losses.


macka654

As someone who resides in his catchment area, he is a giant meme to my friends and I. His overenthusiastic face is on every single street; it gives you nightmares.


Wallabycartel

It's weird. The dude seems to sell every single house in Quakers


zeraussiul

He used to work for an older man who runs an independent RE business in the area before he started the RW franchise. Seems to have completely turfed the old bloke's business.


salahd-days

That’s the sacrifice it takes to be a salesman lol


Tanduvanwinkle

I'd happily be a meme if I could earn that much.


ovrloadau

I’ll be his boyfriend for a year


L3mon-Lim3

It's disgusting what agents charge.


henry_octopus

Come on now... I bet he works "very hard" for his 7M.


JosephusMillerTime

It certainly seems like a shitload of money. But selling at roughly a house per day volume for an entire year seems like incredible throughput.


bobbing-downstream

I read <0.5% commissions on 380M+ in sales. Not crazy, really. I bet car sales people get a much higher %.


thedarknight__

2% commissions.


bobbing-downstream

You are right.


TerribleEntrepreneur

In the US, listing agents usually get 3%, and buyers agent roughly the same. Costs the seller 6% overall. Australian commissions are really quite small in comparison.


LloydsOrangeSuit

It's a market thing though. They used to be higher commission when prices were lower. There's a race to the bottom for the bottom feeders. As the house prices go up, there are more competitors willing to go lower on commission


3dumbWorrier

Its all merit. He took on board all the risks, commie.


Indigeridoo

Underrated comment. The factory owners of yesteryear are definitely equivalent to the ray white franchisees of today. The true risk taking capitalists we should all aspire to.


[deleted]

Who needs manufacturing when we can sell houses to each other for ever increasing piles of debt


a_sonUnique

Risk? He’s an agent he didn’t own all the house already and sell them for a profit and I doubt a real estate agency has big overheads. They’re not exactly opening a factory and making shit.


3dumbWorrier

1. My Joke. 2. Your head. 3. 10 meter difference.


a_sonUnique

Oofff that certainly went over my head.


Basherballgod

What should agents charge?


Indigeridoo

Flat fees commensurate with the work they do


Basherballgod

So how much?


Indigeridoo

Commensurate. with. the. work. they. do. Want a big marketing campaign - $2,500 How many inspections? - each @ $1,000 Fee upon sale - $3,000 Retainer until sale completed - $250 p/w I pulled those figures out my ass but you get what I mean.


Basherballgod

So not a flat fee then? In your scenario, watch the days on market absolutely blow out. Get an early offer? Nah, hang out for longer you could get more. And you have described the purple bricks model. They went bankrupt in spectacular fashion.


Indigeridoo

It is a flat fee, as opposed to a percentage based fee. Hang out and get more... whilst paying for more and more marketing and inspections? Also, just because one business failed at changing the model doesn't inherently mean it doesn't need to be changed. You also fail to see the perverse incentive for REAs in terms of time on market. They are incentivised just as much via time on market as they are on price, for example an extra $50k to the vendor is a huge amount, but to an REA that's likely only an extra $500 in their pocket if that. Therefore they are perversely incentivised to convince the vendor to take the lower, earlier offer rather than wait it out. The problem is that a commission based system does not reward work, it rewards a quick sale often more than a higher sale.


Basherballgod

And that is where you are wrong and people who don’t work in real estate get it wrong. You think absolutely short term. Yes, $50k extra is only a few extra $ to me. But what you don’t get is that an extra $50k to an owner could mean I am referred to 2 or 3 other people who the owner knows who also want to sell, and because I did an amazing job for them, I get an extra 3 sales. Flat fee sales have been around for as long as commissions have been around. And want to know why you don’t hear of any agents doing massive numbers on flat fees? It is because good agents want to get paid what they fee they are worth, and crap agents will fight for the dregs of flat fees.


Indigeridoo

>But what you don’t get is that an extra $50k to an owner could mean I am referred to 2 or 3 other people They would still refer to you if you pulled your little spin game that you all do and convince the buyer that they won't get any better offer than this today and they should take it. I understand a lot more than you think. I know what goes on between REAs and buyers agents, I know those conversations you guys have and the incentives that are in play. >and want to know why you don’t hear of any agents doing massive numbers on flat fees? Hmm it's almost as if the perverse incentives push REAs toward commission for a reason... So tell me, why should you get paid the same amount for selling a property in a week as you do for selling in three months? Edit: I read your comment again and realised you just proved my point even more than I thought you did originally. A flat fee model causes agents to lose out on money, yes? So they move to commission based, where the vendor inherently loses out on money... because you get paid more? So again, explain to me how you represent your client only and not your own self interest?


Basherballgod

The seller wouldn’t refer if you didn’t do a good job. If you left money on the table that the buyer was prepared to pay to get the property, then I have breached my fiduciary duty, which is working for the seller. That is pretty clear, and a common misconception. What goes on between REA’s and buyers agents? Please let everyone in on the secret, as I have worked with buyers agents for years and I don’t have any secrets. People want to get paid what they feel they are worth. No good agent will work on flat fee models. Why should I get paid the same for working for weeks or months? Price equals time. I am more likely to get the seller an exceptional price in the first few weeks of the market and am rewarded for my work by getting paid earlier and can assist more owners. I am also penalised by spending more time on a property for months, so my cost of sale has increased. The owner is likely to achieve a lower figure the longer it is on the market.


Basherballgod

I would happily work under your model. I could paid $20,000 for a $300,000 sale. Big marketing campaign is not $2,500…but ok I do 3 inspections a week - $3,000 per week. Average time on market 4 weeks - $12,000 Fee upon sale $3,000 Retainer $250/week - 4 weeks on market and then 6 week settlement - $2,500 Sweet. Sold.


Indigeridoo

Hmm it's almost like I pulled the figures out my ass like I said. I'm just explaining how a flat fee model could work.


Basherballgod

And I explained how it wouldn’t work. It has been done numerous times. There is an article every quarter or so about the next “game changer” that is going to break the real estate model, and they fall flat every time. Because good agents won’t work for cheap.


Indigeridoo

The market doesn't fix everything unfortunately... I would like to see regulation.


thedugong

To be fair, price regulation usually fixes a lot less, and mostly causes problems.


Basherballgod

There is plenty of regulation. Anyone inside the profession knows that; and anyone outside only wants more regulation when the market is on fire, and ignores it when it is on the downward trend


bigbadbeeeds

Dude if realestate agents were really overpaid then everyone would do it, it's as simple as that. Yes there are alot of dodgy, shit agents but many make under the average yearly wage and most of them are gone in two years. If you actually look further than this article you are reading you will understand the crazy hours this kid puts into his work and the systems he follows.


zeraussiul

This guy is pure volume. I've been to some of his open homes and if you're a seller he guarantees you a sale in 3 days flat. May not get the best price but you're in and out in a week. No auctions, no buyer feedback call backs, doesn't even print brochures. He'll tell you an asking price at the door and then send you a text asking for best and final offer by 4pm the same day. In some ways I respect the no nonsense approach. Lowest of low bars but he clears it by a hair I suppose. All this at the top of the market though, I've not inspected his properties during dips.


Indigeridoo

If that's the case his Comm split should be 0.5%. He doesn't deserve any more than that.


zeraussiul

I'm sure everyone lists with him because his commission is probably much lower than competition. That's the only way he can generate this level of volume.


ayebizz

He also has a fairly big team We called them a few times for properties we were looking at last year and got multiple call backs from other people in his crew.


rxjavaflux

His standard message after inspection Thanks for viewing , Quakers Hill 3 offers have been made Are you Interested? To make an offer please text your name and offer ASAP to Josh on Cut off is 2pm today Regards Josh Tesolin Owner Ray White Quakers Hill I feel we are few years from uberification real estate agency.


fishinglvl

Royal commission into the real estate industry when? Crazy to see people turn a blind eye to blatantly manipulative tactics used by these clowns which serve solely to disadvantage buyers, just because people are currently seeing their house prices skyrocket. My guess? When the housing bubble eventually pops (assuming it does) people will be lining the bloody streets demanding accountability from these unqualified morons. In the financial advice industry, we have limits on how much we can charge for advice under the FASEA Code of Ethics (Standard 7), which essentially stipulates that any fees you receive must justifiably represent value for money for the client. Which is to say, if an adviser charges more than reasonably represents the value of their work, its: - Goodbye license and career - Hello lawsuits Real estate agents, who literally deal in one of the staple necessities of human life: Shelter? They can charge whatever they like. In fact, because their fee is percentage-based, the more expensive the house, the more they receive. They are unequivocally incentivised to encourage the inflation of prices. Even if an agent completes the same amount of work selling a 2 bedroom, outer suburb flat, they will receive a fraction of the revenue. Do people not understand that the less commission these people scrape off the top, the less sellers will add to their asking price? All the while these unqualified parasites exercise control over every day Australians right to affordable living. So again- royal commission into the real estate industry when? Obligatory: not all agents are parasites. Not being facetious, i genuinely don’t believe they all are. But my god something needs to be done to regulate the industry.


MoonRabbitWaits

I almost fell off my chair when I heard someone from the RE industry talking up the Sydney housing market on ABC radio (last year or the year before, it was during the pandemic). Talk about vested interest!


Basherballgod

Agent here, so feel free to downvote. What would a royal commission achieve? Agents fees are deregulated. So you can pay your agent what you and they agree to. If you don’t like their fee, you can choose to use a cheaper agent, or sell it yourself. In QLD, under the previous act, agent fees were regulated with a maximum fee allowed. What was the outcome? Everyone charged the maximum. (Basically 2.8%) I am surprised by the notion that is agents in some way disadvantage buyers, but when the market is down, we are seen to be disadvantaging sellers. From experience, it is the market and we facilitate the sale. Trying to blame the agent for the prices skyrocketing, but failing to blame them for prices dropping when they do, is absurd. It is supply and demand.


fishinglvl

>What would a royal commission achieve? It would achieve the same thing as the Royal Commission into the Banking Sector in 2017, which basically provided proof of who was abusing the system currently in place, but most importantly who was being disadvantaged, so that an appropriate framework can be implemented to ensure it doesn’t continue into the future. I understand the services REA’s provided are completely necessary for the market to function, and genuinely appreciate the work within reason. But when fees and conduct are unchecked, unethical individuals are empowered to take actions which advantage themselves and disadvantage buyers. For example, take a look at listings on Realestate.com.au right now. Its a seller’s market, so most listings don’t show the listing price, or if it is shown, its almost always under quoted. Agents clearly do this to reduce the free flow of information in the market in order to pressure prices upwards in the name of their own self interests and that of the seller. Why should agents have this power? A royal commission, or other regulatory inquiry, could at the very least establish strong rules/regulations regarding what agents can and can’t do, and establish a body to ACTUALLY enforce these rules. The support for this is just low because property owners are currently benefiting. But as I said, i really think that in the event of a ‘crash’, people will feel differently about this.


Basherballgod

What is being abused? You could go to 3 agents right now and get a range of fees, and you can choose who you want to use. You could have an agent pay for your marketing, or you could have pay it upfront, or on a payment plan. Who is being disadvantaged? When fees are uncapped, you can get agents charging 1%, 2%, 3% flat fee. When fees are regulated, everyone charges the maximum (see the QLD example) If you are advocating for a flat fee, just see the example of GoGecko and Purple Bricks who did that and went bankrupt. People don’t want cheap when it comes to their biggest asset, the family home. The majority of people want a professional service. The market is definitely not a buyers market. It is a sellers market. Many agents are choosing not to put a price on things because the market is absolutely wild. Seeing places sell for hundreds of thousands above the guide and what the sellers would accept. That is the market. When the market goes down, which it will, would you call for a royal commission into agents screwing over sellers for losing huge amounts of money? Or is it just when the market goes up is the agent the bad person manipulating the market? We work for the seller. Our fiduciary duty is to the seller. You work for your client, don’t you? The buyer is not our client, and my job is to get the most for my clients. There are plenty of regulators for the real estate institute - the REI’s, OFT, ACCC. If you have any issues - lodge a complaint. If you think there is underquoting, lodge a complaint. Agents have been fined multiple times for this. But don’t mistake deliberate under quoting for an insanely hot market.


willowtr332020

Well put. I think regulation needs to be on the credit being given out (low interest rates etc) and the other issue is available new housing stock and land. Development is not keeping pace and NIMBYism is a thing. Real estate agents are just working in a piping hot market.


Basherballgod

I would agree there. The lending practices are a big issue.


fishinglvl

>When fees are regulated, everyone charges the maximum. If fees of 1% are commonplace in a market, a government mandated price ceiling of 2% won’t drag the up the prices of those currently charging 1%. Not trying to be insulting but that’s a basic economic principle. >the market is not a buyers market Yep that was a typo, have fixed it up. >We work for the seller. Our fiduciary duty is to the seller. This is basically the problem, its a two party system (buyers and sellers), the fact that there is so little advocacy or support for buyers is where this issue stems from. >You work for your client, don’t you? Yes I do, but the act of me working for my clients is purely in service of them- it doesn’t work to directly disadvantage another opposing party, because there is no opposing party. Prices aren’t the only issue here- its other things like sellers being able to deny buyers subject to finance clauses, just because competition is so high and people don’t really have any choice but to comply and risk their deposit. Yet, when markets are down and buyers have some leverage, the clauses become easier to negotiate.


Basherballgod

I can say, from experience, that if they regulated a fee, every agent would charge the maximum. QLD is the prime example of that. Deregulation saw average % drop. If you are after advocacy, you can pay a buyers agent to represent you. You can pay a property valuer to give you independent advice about price. In the USA, both buyers and sellers have their realtor, with both sides paying 2-3%. Regarding your last paragraph, that is exactly what a free market does. When demand is high, terms become less negotiable. When demand is low, you look at those clauses. A seller can choose what they want to do with their own property. If you had two offers, one at $900,000 unconditional and one at $920,000 subject to finance and building inspection, under what authority should the seller be forced to take the higher offer, when the terms aren’t better. I know I would sacrifice the $20,000 for my own property for the knowledge the property is sold, rather than dealing with a bank that may not approve the loan, or a building inspector that decides that they want repeat business and trashes the property on the report. That should be the owners decision, not anyone else’s, as it is their property.


SonOfHonour

They hated him because he spoke the truth :( Look I don't like most agents, not had many good experiences with them. But to think they are to blame for the state of the housing market is pretty funny. Its like blaming the shovel for the gold rush.


Basherballgod

It doesn’t worry me the negative response (eg: downvotes) I would much rather be upfront in this sub and give a view from inside the profession.


fishinglvl

I don’t think they are to blame for the crisis, i think a large number of agents are parasitically riding the crisis for their own advantage, to the detriment of buyers.


Basherballgod

A large number of people have entered the industry to capitalise on the current market because they think it is easy, and will leave the moment the market turns. Happens every time there is a boom


ccr4dawin

Well said mate Hit me up if your Ipswich based, looking for a house and this is crazy - first home buyer.


Basherballgod

Brisbane based, but will shoot you a message


ValyriaofOld

Not the OP and I agree with some of your points.. However, as u/fishinglvl explained a Royal Commission could achieve a number of things, primarily showcasing/providing proof of who may be exploiting the current system in place and also highlighting the people impacted by this. I don’t have other significant insights to offer but I believe that if the system is not broken then an independent investigation could not cause any damage at all. At worst, some time and resources may be spent and nothing changes but I personally don’t believe this would be the case.


Basherballgod

I would love to know what is being exploited. Haven’t had anyone be able to say what it is. It’s not like we are charging fees to dead people like financial advisors have been. Or recommending crap investments for developer kickbacks like financial advisers have been. Or selling insurance policies to people without disclosing they get a kickback like financial advisors have.


Blackletterdragon

That is exactly how the financial services industry responded to the early calls for a Royal Commission into their sector. And then the hearings finally started and the reports were handed down and we wondered why the hell it hadn't been done sooner; how the industry had been allowed to grow so grotesquely at odds with the public interest.


hear_the_thunder

>Royal commission into the real estate industry when? I think they get away with their bullshit, because it is regulated by the states instead of federally.


Indigeridoo

Don't get me wrong, I think that figure is a load of shit. The principal and Ray white take atleast 40-60% of those comms. Plus he would have to pay for all of his assistants out of that amount too. Also, it's humanly impossible for an agent to sell that many properties without 10 people doing all the work behind the scenes.


palsc5

It'd be interesting to see how much they actually keep. They have 11 staff members and total sales commission of about $10m judging by their numbers. How much would they pay Ray White? How much rent for their office? How much would running costs be? How much to lease the cheapest Mercedes they can find? Essentially it's a business with $7m-$10m in revenue and when you put it that way it isn't all that impressive. EDIT: Actually it is 14 people minimum working there and Real Estate has 3 sales associates working just for him.


Indigeridoo

I think it's reasonable to expect the agent made circa $1mill - which is still incredible of course. But it's absurd to think that he made 3 times more money than the average ASX100 CEO. Especially considering its pretty much in Blacktown.


salahd-days

He didn’t sell the properties for very much either. The highest was 1.4mil. So 7mil profit just to him seems like too much. I do believe he worked his ass off though and is good at his job, selling 350 properties in a year sounds insane and I think the worst thing about being an agent is the long hours through the week and working Saturday’s.


Basherballgod

The average agent across Australia sells 22 properties a year. The numbers he is doing is insane


salty_catfish22

As someone with an insider contact at Ray White (not speaking for all Ray White offices here), but the $7m figure is pure click/rage bait. Gross commission is exactly that - gross, not net. He would likely give half that commission to Ray White, which then filters through to paying the admin team behind the scenes, corporate, and then the franchise. Then he would need to pay his three associates. Now associates generally earn fuck all, but if they're on the listing they might get a cut of the commission too. So realistically he's looking at paying at least around $200k per year out of his commission to his associates. Subtract any insurances (needed for open homes etc), marketing spend per year (some agents spend like 200k per year on marketing) and the figure starts to dwindle. Realistically he probably pulled about $1.5 to 2 mill out of that for himself, before taxes. Still impressive, but takes the shine off a bit.


ovrloadau

How many years can he sustain these sales for?


Nos_4r2

I attended a Ray White awrds night around 10-15 years ago and you are right. The top performing sales rep that year did a mill in comms and had around 5-6 assistants working under him. We worked it out with some napkin maths at the dinner table, if he had that many assistants, take out overheads, wages and all that jazz, he probably would have walked away with around $500k before taxes.


shaker_mag

I have a friend who works for him. He pays his associates 100k a year salary. No commission to be earnt. How long can he keep it up? He already has 22 listings signed in 2022.


Wehavecrashed

"There's a bubble."


RobbWhite_

or wherein a dystopian nightmare


theballsdick

The stupid amount of money central banks have pumped into the world has made me feel like I am living in some sort of clown world or dystopian nightmare for sure.


Early-Berry4156

Meh, there is always someone who gets lucky to be in the right spot at the right time to come on to a bunch of wealth.


xvf9

https://instagram.com/lordsofproperty


hoochnuts

7 mil would buy a lot of nose beers.


TheBoyInTheBlueBox

If he earnt 7mil you would think he could afford to buy a suit that fits him


OldAd4998

Lol.. He needs one. I first inspected his property 2020 and again last month. His tummy is growing like his bank account.


globex6000

Numbers just don't add up. That 2% commission goes to the business, not the individual sales agent. The agent gets around half depending on what they have negotiated. Some a little less, some a little more.


macka654

He owns his own REA. Ray White Quakers Hill.


moojo

Doesn't the parent ray white get a cut?


bigbadbeeeds

Friendly reminder that when it's time for you to sell, you get to choose HOW and WITH WHO you sell your property. Stop trying to suggest how much an agent should be getting paid. When it's time to sell you can go for the agent that charges a low flat fee and undersell your property and run into 50 problems while doing so. This guy obviously knows what he is doing. The jealous comments here are really sad and a reflection of how many Australians have tall poppy syndrome.


[deleted]

Can somebody explain to me how in the age of "disruption technology" we are still paying people a ridiculous amount of money to put on a suit, slick back their hair, lease a BMW and show buyers around a few rooms?


TheBunningsSausage

Good on him. 350 houses in 365 days, I think he has earned every dollar. I also suspect he has a big team behind him.


macka654

He only recently started his own REA. Ray White Quakers Hill


MaltyWhench

Agree. This is a whole team of people working on this. Also, if they did that much business, congrats to him AND his team.


Nanokillaz

If an agent can sell that kind of volume, they deserve what they earn.


Indigeridoo

It's hardly selling ice to eskimos though is it?


Nanokillaz

Well if you can find that many people willing to use your services, you too can make that kind of money.


belugatime

Agree mate, lots of hate for agents on here but it is not an easy job to be successful at. Most people have no idea how hard it is to cold call people and face a ton of rejection, having to be available at all hours for customers and dealing with rude people who treat you like trash despite you only being nice to them.


Indigeridoo

Hard job =/= valuable job


SuckinAwesome

I guess the market decides that one.


belugatime

It's valuable to the vendor when they sell the property for top dollar because the agent was skillful. It's also a free market where people can use whatever agent they want. Nothing is stopping people using a cheap agent or selling it themselves.


Indigeridoo

How much value in terms of selling do you think an agent provides in a market such as this one? They literally sell themselves. I don't think that in a market like this that there is anything an agent can do to cover even their 2% clip.


CommunicationSea5010

If it's that easy, why not change jobs and compete with home then? If it's like selling ice to Eskimos like you're saying


Indigeridoo

Because I like my soul firmly placed inside my body and not sold to the devil


belugatime

If I was selling right now I would be happy to pay top dollar to have a great agent list my property. Depending on the value of the property 2% isn't unreasonable and I would be happy to negotiate a scaling commission where they get more if they can get me a really outstanding outcome. As I said, if you don't see value in an agent at whatever they want to charge you then then don't use them. It's a free market.


Indigeridoo

Imo you're giving them a little bit too much undeserved credit for property FOMO and cashed up boomers but whatever.


mattzky

No offence but just like every market the fees are regulated by the market itself. I work in one of the most competitive areas of Sydney in real estate as an agent and we are always in competition with at least 2-3 other agents for the business sometimes as many as 5 or 6. Our fees are determined by the level of competition in our area. It's impossible to charge more than around 2٪ because there are plenty of other agents willing to the job for far less. It only takes a consumer a short period of time to get an handle on fees from a few agents. If you can't manage that then you probably are going to get fleeced by a mechanic or tradesperson much easier than an agent. side note; We work for the seller, it's our job to get them the most money. That's why we get paid what we do. Buyers agents exist for this exact reason. If you can't so it yourself hire a professional to represent you like sellers do. Notbing prevenets owners from selling their property themselves


active_snail

Im not a fan of real estate agents in general but good on him for doing so well. It would be one of those jobs where you would only get out what you put in so he (and whoever works with him) must of been grafting pretty hard to earn that sort of scratch. Considering your income-per-sale would scale up based on property prices, i imagine it's nice working in one of the few jobs that hasnt experienced a decade long wage-freeze like everything else.


Gman777

I know plenty of agents that out in minimal work and get paid a lot. Not hard in a hot market. You open a house and let people wander through for 30mins. Put out an ad, do a little paperwork, etc. The “hardest” thing is getting listings - again, super simple in a market that moves quickly.


active_snail

Admittedly im ignorant to the day-to-day workings of a real estate agent but it seems a hell of a lot houses to move, hot market or not. RE Agents are shameless self promoters by nature so i can imagine having an article published about him would make it hard for his head to fit through his office door now, but i'll give a man his dues whether im a fan of his "profession" or not. I'd much rather read an article about a heart surgeon earning $7M but apparently the world values someone who can stand there with a book and wait for someone to pay enough money for something... Unfortunately that's the way it is.


Gman777

I don’t think he’s doing all the work himself. He owns the franchise, no doubt he has a team.


HyperIndian

REAs should have a salary ceiling of $80K and no higher. It makes zero sense for a fully replaceable role to make such insane figures for such a lazy business model where consumers will buy irregardless. Uni? Hard work? Honestly? Nah just chat shit, underquote and lie to be rewarded. Only loser? The buyer themselves.


Throwem1112

Don't confuse base wage for commissions. They are fixed and variable for a reason.


Indigeridoo

If he really did make $7mill, which he unequivocally didn't, it will eventually arbitraged down due to technology or cheaper entrants. It's not exactly an industry with a high barrier for entry. This is the high before the fall for REAs imo.


maton12

>arbitraged down due to technology or cheaper entrants...This is the high before the fall for REAs imo. Great idea, why not call it Purple Bricks?


Gman777

The biggest disruptor to the industry is when the two big behemoths (REA & Domain) eventually decide to flip the script on agents, have them work for them instead.


Basherballgod

REA & Domain don’t want the headache of having agents work for them.


Indigeridoo

Yeah that was a massive fail obviously. Doesn't mean that tech can't disrupt it eventually though. I don't have the answers but my knowledge of economics tells me that a job that provides such little value for so much money is ripe for change.


Reginald_Rutabaga

Firstly, irregardless is not a real word. (Edit: this bit is said with tounge in cheek.) Secondly, what other industries should we also place salary caps on? Only the bad industries, right? Who decides which industries are worthy of such restrictions? You?


Indigeridoo

Oops: [https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/irregardless](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/irregardless) Found the angry REA resorting to ad hominem..


Reginald_Rutabaga

Lol fair reply. I’m not an REA though. I have had mostly bad experience with REAs. I am mainly attacking the silly idea of salary caps.


Indigeridoo

Of course it's a silly idea, I assumed it was a tongue in cheek jab at a job that requires little skill.


HyperIndian

Irregardless is a word. Also by your logic, why shouldn't hospitality workers get paid much more? Why can't the median wage for them be $100k for example? It isn't $100k because of how replaceable their roles are. That's why. If barriers to entry are low, it makes zero sense to reward certain occupations. Further, you mention who decides which industries are worthy of more? Unions. That's the simple answer. Why do you think tradies get paid good fucking money in the West compared to third world countries where they get the poverty line? Unions. The biggest difference from blue collar and white collar is that they get paid for their overtime (which is amazing). This rarely happens in white collar jobs. Why? Unions.


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HyperIndian

I understand what you're saying. But I still don't believe REAs should earn more than $80K. Because people will always buy houses. It's not like enterprise sales where at least there's more effort required by the sales person to close. Houses sell easy. If the effort is so low, what you're really saying is: don't work hard. Why? Because some lying schmuck in a Tarocash suit will make more $ than you anyway so why bother.


belugatime

I work in enterprise sales and have for over 15 years. I still think that top Real Estate salespeople are extremely skillful and deserve the money they make. Houses sell easily right now but in a slow market they don't, also the battle isn't just selling the house it's getting the listing where they have to compete against other agents and differentiate themselves. Sales doesn't need salary caps or a union, it operates as a meritocracy where if you are good at it you can make a fortune, if you are bad at it you make your base salary until you eventually get fired.


HyperIndian

Mate, I get where you're coming from. But with how dodgy the property market is and how developers, construction and REAs collude with each other so they all win, it just isn't fair to the honest worker who does the right thing. That's the problem I have. It just isn't fair to people who are honest as they're the ones who get taken for advantage. Also, slow market? In Australia? Where have you been in the last 25 years?


belugatime

Yeh, it's a dog eat dog world in sales and there is a lot of dodgy stuff that happens. Just a couple of years ago in 2019 it was much harder for agents to get a deal done as vendors had to accept that the market had shifted downwards. From what I observed in that time it was difficult trying to mediate an outcome that is agreeable to both the vendor and purchaser.


Tiny-Look

It's just regardless. It's not a word mate, sorry. They're essentially the "same word", some ponse just decided to add to the word and is too stubborn to back down.


Early-Berry4156

Putting a wage cap on jobs is the most dystopian thought in this whole thread. People choose of their own free will to use the services of this person. And apparently he just does such a good job that everyone decides to keep doing it.


Thelandofthereal

"It's a bubble" Mark Baum


Antho204

Kinda like being the smartest dumb kid.


cataractum

Good on him. Housing prices isn't his fault, even if he's benefiting, it's our policy settings and culture.